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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: New music for Galatia Academy (06/12/24)

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Author Topic: [0.97a] Realistic Combat 2.0.6  (Read 300170 times)

Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.3.0
« Reply #75 on: July 14, 2022, 03:13:51 PM »

so far i also like it. the only thing (maybe only for me?) that is strange is, that the rockets/missiles fly with lightspeed (for example the missiles from the ed shipyard mod). they are that fast, that they surround the ship and only hit it, if it fly fast to an another point (or is big enough). is that normal or do i have change something?

Wooooo!  I'm glad that you've tried and liked it!  Thank you so much.  Do you mean that the missiles are swirling around the ships?  If so, I might have to increase their maneuverability.

MedwedxXx

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.3.0
« Reply #76 on: July 14, 2022, 04:17:52 PM »


Wooooo!  I'm glad that you've tried and liked it!  Thank you so much.  Do you mean that the missiles are swirling around the ships?  If so, I might have to increase their maneuverability.


exactly that. in the main menu of starsector the missiles i see have a "good/normal or how you want call that" speed (doesn´t look like the missiles in my fightes with extrem speed). big difference between main menu and my own fightes. i think the maneuverability is good but somehow (maybe only for me?) the speed is too high (or for some missile types if they have they on values)
« Last Edit: July 14, 2022, 04:19:30 PM by MedwedxXx »
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.3.0
« Reply #77 on: July 14, 2022, 04:34:13 PM »

exactly that. in the main menu of starsector the missiles i see have a "good/normal or how you want call that" speed (doesn´t look like the missiles in my fightes with extrem speed). big difference between main menu and my own fightes. i think the maneuverability is good but somehow (maybe only for me?) the speed is too high (or for some missile types if they have they on values)

Thanks!  I'll look into it for the next patch.

MedwedxXx

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.3.0
« Reply #78 on: July 15, 2022, 02:59:54 AM »

i tried other missiles. it looks like missiles with medium speed in description are good in speed and some (or maybe most) missiles with fast or very fast are "too fast". the missiles from the ed shipyard mod as example are too fast.
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.3.0
« Reply #79 on: July 15, 2022, 04:35:39 AM »

i tried other missiles. it looks like missiles with medium speed in description are good in speed and some (or maybe most) missiles with fast or very fast are "too fast". the missiles from the ed shipyard mod as example are too fast.

Ok, the next patch will have higher missile maneuverability.

Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.0
« Reply #80 on: July 15, 2022, 08:34:15 AM »

Patch 1.4.0 is out!  Ship, fighter, and weapon specification modification can each be toggled in RealisticCombatSettings.json, missiles are more maneuverable, and a targeted enemy ship will have a red hull level indicator diamond!
« Last Edit: July 15, 2022, 08:36:25 AM by Liral »
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #81 on: July 15, 2022, 12:32:04 PM »

Hotfix 1.4.1 - turns out I had somehow removed reloading from the ballistic autocannons.  They should work better now.  Also, reloads are bigger but further apart.  Same average rate though.

lili

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #82 on: July 15, 2022, 07:25:11 PM »

The following are all machine translated content

This mod is quite wild and ambitious. The current experience has a few more impact on the play experience.
Each ship is difficult to control the movement, which leads to every battle they will be almost mixed together. It impossible for some vulnerable ships (like carriers) to hide behind, but also makes the super long range not get played because they are blocking each other. This problem makes it difficult to operate and command in the battle now. Now the game is difficult to really play in, only by automatic operation.

Another problem is that weapon changes after the change will be extremely different due to some parameters, such as diableavionic's opfergv, lts actual rate of fire is burst delay, while in the mod is based on the chargeup chargedown calculation, resulting in a large discrepancy in the results. Built in weapons like versant wanzer's harvester have no increased range. I feel that this problem is best to write a script that shows what the weapon should have dps in vanilla and so on to facilitate comparison.

At the same time I recommend the swp custom battle and random battle mission, you can do a lot of combat testing.
Finally, good luck with your mod! :)
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PCCL

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #83 on: July 15, 2022, 11:28:26 PM »

The scaled up map size is great, but it seems to allow ships to retreat from the middle of the map.

I'm not sure how the code around that works at all, but might be something worth looking into.

Edit: this seems to only happen when the enemy fleet is in full retreat, they just straight up disappear and the game ends
« Last Edit: July 17, 2022, 02:06:30 AM by PCCL »
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #84 on: July 16, 2022, 11:58:02 AM »

This mod is quite wild and ambitious.

Thanks!

Quote
The current experience has a few more impact on the play experience.
Each ship is difficult to control the movement, which leads to every battle they will be almost mixed together. It impossible for some vulnerable ships (like carriers) to hide behind, but also makes the super long range not get played because they are blocking each other. This problem makes it difficult to operate and command in the battle now. Now the game is difficult to really play in, only by automatic operation.

Yes, I have noticed that the fleets mix unless the player orders his to stop before they reach the enemy fleet.  The field manual warns against letting the fleets fly through each other on autopilot but does not, though I now think it should, explicitly tell the player to order their fleet to stop.

Quote
Another problem is that weapon changes after the change will be extremely different due to some parameters, such as diableavionic's opfergv, lts actual rate of fire is burst delay, while in the mod is based on the chargeup chargedown calculation, resulting in a large discrepancy in the results.

This problem occurred in older versions of the mod but not in the newer ones, which use the following source code to determine whether a weapon is a cannon or not:

Code
private static boolean isCannon(WeaponSpecAPI weaponSpec) {
    projectileWeaponSpecProxy.setWeaponSpec(weaponSpec);
    if (weaponSpec.getBurstSize() > 3) return projectileWeaponSpecProxy.getBurstDelay()
                                                                   > getCannonRefireDelayThreshold();
    return (weaponSpec.getChargeTime() + projectileWeaponSpecProxy.getRefireDelay()
               > getCannonRefireDelayThreshold());
}

Speaking of that method, this code is ugly, and I have just now replaced it for the next version with

Code
private static boolean isCannon(WeaponSpecAPI weaponSpec) {
    projectileWeaponSpecProxy.setWeaponSpec(weaponSpec);
    return weaponSpec.getBurstSize() > 3
                ? projectileWeaponSpecProxy.getBurstDelay() > getCannonRefireDelayThreshold()
                : weaponSpec.getChargeTime() + projectileWeaponSpecProxy.getRefireDelay()
                   > getCannonRefireDelayThreshold();
}

Quote
Built in weapons like versant wanzer's harvester have no increased range.

You must be using an old version: the newer ones fix this problem.

Quote
I feel that this problem is best to write a script that shows what the weapon should have dps in vanilla and so on to facilitate comparison.

I haven't thought about comparing DPS, but now that you mention it, perhaps I should.

Quote
At the same time I recommend the swp custom battle and random battle mission, you can do a lot of combat testing.

Ooooh, thank you!

Quote
Finally, good luck with your mod! :)

Thanks a lot!
« Last Edit: July 16, 2022, 11:59:57 AM by Liral »
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #85 on: July 16, 2022, 12:01:55 PM »

The scaled up map size is great, but it seems to allow ships to retreat from the middle of the map.

I'm not sure how the code around that works at all, but might be something worth looking into.

Uh oh...

5ColouredWalker

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #86 on: July 16, 2022, 12:05:58 PM »

I've downloaded this for trying later, and I think the zoom modification effect is applying despite the mod not being activated. Fortunately I loike the ability to zoom out so much more
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #87 on: July 16, 2022, 02:17:11 PM »

I've downloaded this for trying later, and I think the zoom modification effect is applying despite the mod not being activated. Fortunately I loike the ability to zoom out so much more

Woo, thanks!  I have no idea how that may have happened.

Somerespect

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #88 on: July 16, 2022, 05:39:51 PM »

Hello! I just created an account so I can comment. Let me just say I like the mod and it's execution for the most part, but a particular balance problem I have:

Frigates, particularly their range. They are extremely fast for such a small target, and although that can be mitigated with configuration the major problem with them is fact that they can easily outrange larger hulls, especially capitals. Which is rather absurd in my opinion.

Perhaps it is possible for you to code in smaller hulls having a range malus of some sort?
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Liral

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Re: [0.95.1a] Realistic Combat 1.4.1
« Reply #89 on: July 16, 2022, 07:43:29 PM »

Hello! I just created an account so I can comment.

Wow, thanks!  I appreciate that a lot! :D

Quote
Let me just say I like the mod and it's execution for the most part, but a particular balance problem I have:

Why thank you!  I'm happy to talk about balance, too.

Quote
Frigates, particularly their range. They are extremely fast for such a small target, and although that can be mitigated with configuration the major problem with them is fact that they can easily outrange larger hulls, especially capitals.

Sounds like the automatic range adjustment of the mod works as intended!

Quote
Which is rather absurd in my opinion.

It's surprising but realistic: a small, fast, frigate could hit a big, slow capital ship from further with the same gun because the former could strafe off the path of its projectiles before they would hit from closer than the latter could.  The capital ship could out-range the frigate as you correctly intuit that it would have in on Earth only by mounting longer-range weapons than the frigate could carry: bigger guns with high muzzle velocities, enough missiles to overwhelm the weak shields and thin point defenses of the frigate, or lasers to zap it outright.

Quote
Perhaps it is possible for you to code in smaller hulls having a range malus of some sort?

It's possible, but I refuse to do it because it would defeat the purpose of the mod, which is Realistic Combat.  I should add the advice above to the Field Manual and meanwhile work on improving weapon recognition to allow rail guns to have higher velocities, especially at larger weapon mount sizes.
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