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[Alex]

... I haven't been keeping up with this thread, but, probably a good time to mention that in the dev version, the Legion is up to 300 OP (+40) and the XIV version is up to 310 (also +40). I'm a bit concerned the latter might be too much, actually, hmm.

[Kos135]

Its been a lot of pages but my feeling is still that the ship just needs like 50 OP, enough for a few hullmods or premium options, and it would be fixed right up.

I suspect I already gave this opinion in this thread, but I'm too lazy to look back right now:
I think the Legion should get +30 top speed and a new system to replace Burn Drive. I recall suggesting Damper Field or Reserve Deployment, with at least one person being horrified at the prospect of a low tech capital with Damper Field.
The Legion is supposed to be support/escort for the Onslaught, so this change allows it to fulfill that role while also boosting combat ability and not pigeon-holing it into a frontline role by giving it Burn Drive.

[Thaago]

That would be interesting. Giving it with its massive exposed rear and fighters a bit more kiting abilities (not that it would be actually fast) would be significantly different. It certainly has a huge engine region.

[Hiruma Kai]

+30 base speed would put the Legion on par with mid-line cruiser speed (Champion/Gryphon) and the Enforcer.  Which feels off, even if it wouldn't have burn drive.

Also, am I the only one who puts omni-shields on Onslaughts and Legions to help with the exposed rear problem?  I also feel like it makes the AI more willing to drop shields in the first place, which is handy on such heavily armored ships.

[FooF]

But then it’s just a bigger Mora, which is even less fun to pilot. As it is, it’s a battle carrier that can pursue, which to me is more unique than a giant damage sponge.

I’m with perfectly fine with 40 more OP as “enough” to keep the Legion in my good graces. I just did a run where I found an early Legion and had 4 Wasps, 2 Devastators, pretty much all HMGs, Flak and Vulkans and went all Battlestar Galactica with it. The only thing I felt it needed was a few more hullmods.

@Hiruma Kai

For those two, I gravitate toward shield shunt. For the AI though, I can see how Omni would be beneficial

[Jackundor]

... I haven't been keeping up with this thread, but, probably a good time to mention that in the dev version, the Legion is up to 300 OP (+40) and the XIV version is up to 310 (also +40). I'm a bit concerned the latter might be too much, actually, hmm.

a full 40 more OP? damn

[vladokapuh]

removing burn drive would ruin the ship for me to be honest

[Grievous69]

That sounds like a nice buff although I don't see the need why both versions need it. XIV is already strong enough, and we've seen how the same ship hull with different weapon mounts can have different OP pools. That said I'd still prefer if both got buffed rather than none.

[FooF]

I’d say it would be odd for the XIV to have less OP than base. From my end, it just means more hullmods that I wish I could afford. An Onslaught (which is equivalent logistically and DP) is considerably tougher to kill simply because it can afford more defensive hullmods.

[gG_pilot]

+40 OP sounds like lazy overbuff.
Standard vs XIV is nice touch,  where performance of standard should be below average while XIV above average. However, a situation when even standard is above average is over the top.

M previously proposed idea  Capital Salvage gantry in Legion add utility value without power creep. If it didnt hit your mood  then :
I would recommend this package:
+20 OP (+8%)
+ 11 speed (+38%)
Cargo+Fuel capacity rise both from 300 to 400 (+33%)
Change the ship system. AI usage of Burn drive  has an unwanted result often, when backline ship is suddenly surrounded by enemies. Some of theese :
Reeserve deployment - good choice
Recall device - good choice but sounds a bit high tech
Active Flare Launcher - is also good for support ship, it can do PD for others.
Targeting  feeds - consume too much flux. Consume 50% flux at once, >>   unfortunate system for any ship with direct weapons.



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I would be careful with over-buff. Rather add flavour than pure OP load.
instead of my initial +20 OP add even less OP but build in some flavour. Alternative OP package:
+10 OP
build in HighResSensors  or Recovery shuttles or  add another fighter bay with built in mine drones.

[FooF]

I’m not convinced the Legion needs an overhaul. Reserve Deployment wouldn’t be bad but then you’d have to buff base speed because a ship that is supposed to be front-line but can’t get to the front lines is useless. Salvage Gantry and logistics buffs doesn’t add anything of value to me. By the time I have a capital, post-battle salvage is trivial and I already have a fleet of logistics vessels.

[Wyvern]

40 OP seems maybe a bit much...

...Until I consider OP costs on bombers and what it takes to actually have both good direct combat power and not the cheapest fighters you could be fielding.

Though, hrm. Were it me doing the changes, I might, instead of the OP increase, go with a 10 point discount on fighter LPCs, similar to heavy ballistics integration for ships that might otherwise want to downsize some of their large guns? It's the same total bonus, but it also removes the current incentive to consider installing talons or mining drones...

[Thaago]

Yeah I don't think it needs any drastic changes. Considering it's possible missile loadout (for either), burn drive is a good system for the ship. I just wish the AI would not cancel it so cautiously! Run your enemy down!

In terms of is 40 an overbuff: I would also say no. Comparing loadouts with an Onslaught as FooF mentioned, they are both 40 DP ships and yet the Onslaught can comfortably run a full stack of hullmods to boost itself, while a Legion has to sacrifice in one of its categories (fighters, missiles, guns) in order to afford the basic "required" ones.

40 OP seems maybe a bit much...

...Until I consider OP costs on bombers and what it takes to actually have both good direct combat power and not the cheapest fighters you could be fielding.

Though, hrm. Were it me doing the changes, I might, instead of the OP increase, go with a 10 point discount on fighter LPCs, similar to heavy ballistics integration for ships that might otherwise want to downsize some of their large guns? It's the same total bonus, but it also removes the current incentive to consider installing talons or mining drones...

Hmmm.... is it actually a bad thing to install talons or mining drones though? I feel this is a different situation as compared to Heavy Ballistics Integration: in that case ships have non-overlapping arcs of large slots, so its best to just "stack" up on one arc and completely ignore the other, which the hullmod fights. There was a net gain in power for ignoring half the ship with little penalty.

In this case though, if a player chooses talons or mining drones, its a choice to specialize that does carry a heavy cost because the weapon systems (fighters + whatever else) are deployed simultaneously. Its like a ship that has large ballistics in the same firing arc: HBI doesn't really make sense there.

[FooF]

The other thing to consider is that a Legion wants the Fighter Skills while also wanting all the same skills the Onslaught has! In order for the Legion to surpass the Onslaught, it needs two more skills to do it. If the base Legion was slightly overtuned relative to the Onslaught, the Onslaught would make up for it by requiring less skills to reach its ceiling.

The other lever to pull would be to make the Legion 35 DP and not directly comparable to the Onslaught. But, if they are both 40 DP, the Legion needs a little more to stay competitive. Again, I think 40 OP is a strong step to even them out.

[Thaago]

Thats a good point about skills. I think the carrier skills getting multiplied by 1.5 for officers mitigates this for AI control as they don't need to take more skills, but it does make those two skills even more valuable for players that want fighters in their fleet (they are just fantastic fighter boosters). A 'max combat' player without those skills is at a disadvantage vs a battleship I agree.