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Author Topic: Starsector Ship Tiers  (Read 155134 times)

Dark.Revenant

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Starsector Ship Tiers
« on: January 14, 2015, 11:54:22 PM »

Starsector Ship Tiers List
This is a resource and an ongoing effort to categorize ships, both vanilla and modded, on a scale of general usefulness.

Be sure to comment if you feel that certain ships should be in a different tier!  Please post your own tier lists (especially for mods I missed) and explain why you think that way.

Modders: Aim for Tiers 2-4, and try to keep the majority in Tier 3.  Avoid creating Tier 1 ships, unless the ship is extremely hard to come by or NPC-only.  Tier 5 ships are actually okay, but try to limit the amount.  Nobody wants to play a mod where everything sucks, after all.



Tier 1
Best of the best.  A no-brainer option better than anything else for its role.  Potentially versatile, filling many possible roles well.  Usually performs well even outside of its role.

Fighter: Teuton WingTem

Frigate: Hyperion • Tempest

Destroyer: AsuraBR

Cruiser: PaladinTem

Capital: Paragon • MimirSRA



Tier 2
A very good ship, typically one that performs one role very well and can hold its own in other situations.  Not as versatile or all-performing as a Tier 1, but still competitive.

Fighter: Broadsword Wing • Dagger Wing • Thunder Wing • Wasp Wing • Claw WingSS+ • Claymore WingSS+ • Lightning WingSS+ • Trident WingSS+ • Xyphos WingSS+ • Skinwalker WingSRA • Angha WingMay • Heak WingCit • Serket WingBR • Vespa WingBR • Azata WingExi • Naxos WingExi

Frigate: Afflictor • AlastorSS+ • DecurionII • MaximusII • ConduitCit • PorterCit • ImaginosBR • Mod SilverfishBR • ScarabBR • SilverfishBR • Silverfish-BBR • HammerJP • JesuitTem • MartyrTem • MegaeraSCY • Stymphalian BirdSCY

Destroyer: Enforcer • Gemini1 • Medusa • MorningstarSRA • DesdinovaBR • MorpheusBR • ScorpionBR • CrusaderTem • Komondor (CB)PACK • Pitbull (CB)PACK • RidgebackPACK • Lamia (Armored)SCY

Cruiser: Dominator • Doom • Eagle • Heron2 • ZenithSS+ • DictatorII • Charybdis2SRA • ScyllaSRA • TartarusSRA • Del AzarchelMay • AdumbralCit • NovaCit • TorusCit • Convergence2BR • NevermoreBR • Gigantophis2ASP • Erymanthian Boar (Armored)SCY • Manticore (Carrier)3SCY • Stheno (Armored)SCY • ShourenTHI

Capital: Onslaught • RenegadeSS+ • VictorySS+ • Matriarch7II • RavanaMay • Sierra2Cit • KarkinosBR • Irithia2Exi • Archbishop3Tem • Nemean LionSCY



Tier 3
A solid ship.  Either acts as a jack-of-all-trades and master-of-none, or specializes very well for one role at the cost of being sub-par at everything else.

Fighter: Gladius Wing • Talon Wing • Trident Wing • Warthog Wing • Xyphos Wing • Dagger WingSS+ • Halberd WingSS+ • Sentinel WingSS+ • Draconarius WingII • Scutum WingII • Vicarius WingII • Kobold WingSRA • Neriad WingSRA • Raksasha WingSRA • Inanna WingMay • Raad WingMay • Arrowhead WingCit • Firewall WingCit • Mako WingCit • Dipteron WingBR • Krait WingBR • Kaivor WingExi • Naithyr WingExi • Tarujan WingExi • Azazel WingAA • Cleat WingJP • Splinter WingJP • Constrictor WingASP • Bite WingASP • Dadao WingTHI • Hefei WingTHI • Yiling WingTHI

Frigate: Brawler • Hermes • Monitor • Omen • Shade • Vigilance • Wolf • ExcelsiorSS+ • HecateSS+ • LasherSS+ • PhalanxSS+ • ScytheSS+ • TigerSS+ • VenomSS+ • Venom-XSS+ • BasileusII • Basileus-FII • InvictusII • AshnanSRA • EnlilSRA • InannaSRA • SeskiSRA • ShamashSRA • LilithMay • TiamatMay • AuralCit • RondureCit • ParticleCit • StableCit • LocustBR • MantisBR • ElhiurExi • IndraExi • YriaExi • RauwelAA • ClamJP • SickleJP • StoatJP • Bedlington (CB)PACK • SamoyedPACK • SchnauzerPACK • WirefoxPACK • DiamondbackASP • AlectoSCY • LealapsSCY • TalosSCY • TisiphoneSCY • NanzhongTHI • WujunTHI

Destroyer: Condor1 • Hammerhead • Mule • Sunder • Tarsus • AlbatrossSS+ • ArcherSS+ • ArchonSS+ • BeholderSS+ • CamelSS+ • Construction RigSS+ • RevenantSS+ • SharkSS+ • Sunder (U)SS+ • VanguardSS+ • CenturionII • InterrexII • LynxII • PraetorianII • Princeps1II • Sargasso1SRA • SolidaritySRA • CimeterreMay • Foraker1May • SafirMay • Safir BMay • Ayre1Cit • CometCit • ModemCit • TacitCit • CetoniaBR • GonodactylusBR • Typheus1BR • Nasir1Exi • ZephosExi • AzryelAA • Kafziel1AA • BoxensteinJP • BoxerJP • LangoustineJP • Octopus1JP • TurbotJP • BRTPACK • KomondorPACK • PitbullPACK • Ridgeback XPACK • Shar PeiPACK • Copperhead1ASP • Argus1SCY • EuryaleSCY • LamiaSCY • OrthrusSCY • GuanduTHI • HanzhongTHI • HujingTHI • Tianshui1THI

Cruiser: Apogee • Aurora • Falcon • Venture1 • Castle1SS+ • CirceSS+ • KestrelSS+ • PunisherSS+ • StalkerSS+ • SummitSS+ • VindicatorSS+ • Vindicator (O)SS+ • VultureSS+ • Eagle (I)II • Falcon (I)II • JupiterII • MalleusII • Sebastos1II • ElysiumSRA • Jamaran1May • DriverCit • Inland1Cit • Knight1BR • StenosBR • PergonExi • HarinderAA • DugongJP • GoatJP • MagpieJP • MastiffPACK • Erymanthian BoarSCY • KhalkotauroiSCY • ManticoreSCY • Siren1SCY • SthenoSCY • Dingjun1THI • WuzhangTHI

Capital: Astral6 • Atlas • Conquest • Odyssey1 • Cathedral4SS+ • CronusSS+ • CaesarII • Dominus1II • LeviathanII • OlympusII • Eschaton1BR • KurmarajaBR • Gehenna1AA • KrakenJP • Orca2JP • Keto4SCY • XiakouTHI • XuTHI



Tier 4
A situational ship.  Not the best in any category, but can hold its own in its area of specialization.  Usually performs poorly outside of its role.

Fighter: Piranha Wing • Longbow WingSS+ • Flamen WingII • Proton WingCit • Glynado WingExi • Saraph WingAA • Shard WingJP • Spike WingJP • Venom WingASP • Armored Mining Drone WingTHI

Frigate: Cerberus • Dram • Hound • Lasher • Ox • Shepherd • Wolf (D) • Avalon1SS+ • NautilusSS+ • TickSS+ • TorchSS+ • TundraSS+ • AurigaII • SouthpawSRA • RobberflyBR • BedlingtonPACK • Samoyed (Base)PACK • CentaurSCY • LaohuTHI • LuoyangTHI

Destroyer: Buffalo • Buffalo Mk.II • Enforcer (D) • Mule (D) • Sunder (D) • Tarsus (D) • Phaeton • ArachneSS+ • BoarSS+ • BullSS+ • LocomotiveSS+ • Rook1SS+ • SloopSS+ • ValkyrieSS+ • VistaSS+ • LambentSRA • PotniaSRA • Potnia-bisSRA • ScytheJP • BaliusSCY • HydraSCY • TelchineSCY • Chengdu1THI • TuoluTHI

Cruiser: BarbarianSS+ • Dominator (D) • ThresherSRA

Capital: Prometheus • Dragon1SS+ • InfernusSS+ • MonolithCit • XanthusSCY



Tier 5
Just bad.  Mediocre on a good day, terrible on a bad day.  Can't hold its own even in its area of specialization, if it has one.  Possibly a trap option.  Avoid.

Fighter: Longbow Wing • Mining Pod Wing • Neutron WingCit

Frigate: Cerberus (D) • Hermes (D) • Hound (D) • Lasher (D) • Mercury • Mercury (D) • SidecarSS+

Destroyer: Buffalo (D) • Construction Rig • Hammerhead (D) • Valkyrie

Cruiser: Eagle (D) • Falcon (D)

Capital: The Reaper1JP



Legend
Number in subscript: Number of flight decks

SS+: Starsector+
II: Interstellar Imperium
SRA: Shadowyards Reconstruction Authority
May: The Mayorate
Cit: Citadel
BR: Blackrock Drive Yards
Exi: Exigency Corporation
AA: Ahriman Association
Tem: The Knights Templar
JP: Junk Pirates
PACK: P.A.C.K.
ASP: ASP Syndicate
SCY: SCY Nation
THI: Tiandong Heavy Industries
« Last Edit: November 07, 2015, 12:30:12 PM by Dark.Revenant »
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Histidine

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2015, 01:34:34 AM »

Great list!

Only one that seems off to me is the Xyphos; it's got good stats and can kill most other fighters pretty well, but its beam-only loadout is IMO a pretty serious limitation. I'd put it squarely in Tier 3.

A mod glossary would be helpful; it took me a while to figure out what AA stands for and someone unfamiliar with the modding scene is likely going to go "BR? May? Huhwhat?"
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2015, 01:50:31 AM »

Good point, I'll add a key.

I forgot that Xyphos is buffed in SS+.  Will update the list accordingly.
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TaLaR

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2015, 02:41:57 AM »

Is this list based on AI or player piloting?
Seems to be somewhat inconsistent with both options.

If player piloted, then it's hard to sell Hyperion not being tier 1. Teleportation is just that good, when properly (ab)used. Even considering that teleport was seriously nerfed compared to it's former glory. (Cooldown and increased flux cost)
If AI piloted, then i don't quite agree with Desdinova being tier 1. AI often pointlessly suicides it (too flimsy and twitch skill dependent). Plus it has CR timer unlike every other Destroyer.

Also, while I agree that Paragon is OP, i don't think it fits tier 1 description as defined here (versatility part). It pretty much boils down to exploit synergy between Power Grid Modulation 10 and Fortress Shield. Otherwise i'd prefer something that can actually avoid being surrounded when outnumbered, like Mimir or Karkinos.
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kazi

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2015, 02:50:08 AM »

This is great. I think you're spot on for almost everything. The only one I'm a little iffy on is the Ravana, I think it's worse than the other ships in its Tier. Or I suck at flying them, which is also a distinct possibility.

And yeah, the Desdinova is so OP it's not even funny. It's relatively cheap/easy-to-find, extremely fast, and absolutely tears apart anything smaller than a capital ship. It's pretty much a heavy cruiser/battlecruiser in terms of firepower, but has the speed of a destroyer. If anything, it needs to lose a couple weapon mounts (like at least 4 lol).

Also, I'm pretty sure that the Rakshasa wings are from Shadowyards.
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2015, 03:03:35 AM »

A ship that is unlikely to be player-piloted is scored almost entirely on its AI behavior.  A ship that is almost always player-piloted is scored as a player-piloted ship.

The Paragon can kill anything.  Full stop.  You don't even need player skills for that thing to dominate, as long as it's equipped correctly.  It's amazing in player hands and AI hands, and has virtually no weaknesses.  Just play "Forlorn Hope" to see what I mean.

The Hyperion didn't make Tier 1 because it is only viable as a player ship.  You can't put an AI captain in there; it's tantamount to throwing money away.  And if you're using a Hyperion, you're not using something bigger and better, like a Nevermore or Paragon.  Desdinova is at least workable as an AI craft, and you can still easily solo fleets with it.  Definitely Tier 1.

The Ravana is pretty low on Tier 2 but it's too good to be a Tier 3.  It's quite a good ship; those triple universal hardpoints backed up by triple ballistic turrets can do amazing things, considering it has maneuvering thrusters.

Oops, mislabeled the Rakshasas.
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kazi

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2015, 03:41:54 AM »

Because I apparently have nothing better to do with my spare time:


I ranked factions by their relative percent of ships in each tier. I mostly eyeballed it and may have miscounted at some point. Anyhow, here's the ranking:

OP - Templars (no suprise there)

Good - Blackrock, Mayorate, Citadel

Average - Vanilla, Shadowyards, Interstellar Imperium, Exigency, Ahriman Assoc.

Poor - SS+

Terrible - none

A few comments on the ranking:
-Interstellar Imperium, Exigency, and Ahriman have been "balanced" to the point where there are few, if any, standout ships of any kind.
-The Mayorate, Blackrock, and Citadel all have a very high number of very good ships. Apparently we need to convert a few of the good ones into weak ones.
-Shadowyards is the most balanced faction.
-Exigency, Ahriman Assoc., Templars, and the Mayorate all have a very small number of ships, which sort of exacerbates the balancing issues. The presence of one or two really good ships can easily skew the faction's balance one way or the other.
-This ranking doesn't really take into account how difficult ships are to get. With Blackrock, its quite easy to get a lot of really great ships. Exigency, on the other hand, requires a lot of effort for ships that are very average. Of course, neither of these have been updated recently, so this could change.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 03:59:51 AM by kazi »
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TJJ

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2015, 04:05:40 AM »

Paragon better than Onslaught???
Don't make me laugh!

Sure the paragon can soak up a lot more damage, but it's soooo slow, which when combined with the pathetic range of projectile energy weapons, makes it a prime target to be kited.
While the AI misuses the onslaught 100% of the time (stop using the damn shield!!!), in the hands of a human, the 'kill them quickly so I don't take damage' strategy is much more powerful.

I suppose it comes down to capital ship play style; agro vs tanky.


More generally I don't think any ship with energy mounts can be considered top tier (at least when considering the vanilla weapons set).

- Dominator should be tier 3 or 4; extremely over costed hull - too little flux dissipation & OP to effectively utilise its mounts.
- Sunder -1 rank too; average speed, average shield, pathetic armour, ineffective mountings, AI is useless with it. Horrible ship.
- buffalo 1/2 not tier 5???? I suppose if their role is to die every battle, then they fit your tier definitions well ;)

Though tbh I'm not enamoured with your tier definition; they're rather ambiguous & open to interpretation.


« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 04:20:48 AM by TJJ »
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2015, 04:28:38 AM »

It may be worth considering synergy, as well.  For example, II ships work very well in fleets, despite being average on their own.  A lot of players like throwing in something like an Interrex or Decurion with their fleets simply because they are reliable in the AI's hands.

Furthermore, a ship being powerful doesn't necessarily make it a higher tier.  Tier is a measure of usefulness.  An Olympus is powerful enough to wipe out a big chunk of the fleet, but isn't as useful as something like a Paragon, which is powerful while having the versatility and staying power to back it up.  An Archbishop is extremely powerful, but its slow speed and huge logistics costs make it less than practical to use.

There is nothing wrong with having ships that lean towards a certain Tier, but that leaning must be justified.  For the Templars, of course they're a boss faction, so it's a given.  For the Imperium, having ships that are all solidly average is part of their persona.  As you mentioned, the ease of acquisition is a major part of it.


Exigency ships are kind of special, by the way.  They go up in tier if the player is able to outfit them freely and give them the benefit of full tech/combat aptitudes.  A Zephos can go from a unique but vaguely above-average destroyer to a lightning-fast ninja of death capable of outperforming a Hyperion.  An Irithia goes from a competitive combat carrier to a horseman of the apocalypse, especially with that absurd 50% missile damage boost.


More generally I don't think any ship with energy mounts can be considered top tier (at least when considering the vanilla weapons set).

- Dominator should be tier 3 or 4; extremely over costed hull - too little flux dissipation & OP to effectively utilise its mounts.
- Sunder -1 rank too; average speed, average shield, pathetic armour, ineffective mountings, AI is useless with it. Horrible ship.
- buffalo 1/2 not tier 5???? I suppose if their role is to die every battle, then they fit your tier definitions well ;)

Energy mounts get much better the larger they are.  Large energy weapons are extremely good, and the Paragon has four of them.  They all point in the same direction.

Dominator is fast (due to burn), has a nice array of weapons with good arcs, very tanky, and can dish out a ton of damage.  It's even got THREE medium missiles, which gives it unparalleled burst damage.  It might not have made Tier 2 without the buffs to missiles.  It's also only 8 supplies/day, compared to something like the Aurora which is 10/day.

The Sunder is actually pretty dangerous if you outfit it correctly.  It does a ton of damage very quickly.  It would be Tier 2 if it were not for the fact that the AI is not very good at using it.

Buffalo are decent freighters.  Not as good as Tarsus, but they carry just as much.  The Buffalo Mk 2 would have been Tier 5 in 0.6.2, but the buffs to missiles make it really dangerous in a pinch.
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Tartiflette

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2015, 04:31:53 AM »

Paragon better than Onslaught???
Don't make me laugh!

I respectfully completely disagree. It comes down to this:
- The Onslaught has a HUGE weakness, it's rear. Also it can't focus it's firepower because of the limited turret arcs (at best you get 1 TCP and 2 large turrets).

- The Paragon has no weakness because of it's bubble shield, and has full 360deg heavy weapons coverage with in bonus a strong frontal concentration. On top of that it has a system that enhance it's defense.

Almost all it's combat stats are near those of the Onslaught or far superior:
10% less hull
14% less armor
33% more consuming shield

50% more flux reserve
100% more flux dissipation
Omni shield instead of frontal
100% wider shield
40% more efficient shield
16% more speed (out of burn drive)
33% better acceleration
4% more OP


So no, there are no better ship than a Paragon in my book.
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icepick37

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2015, 05:08:35 AM »

I mean it is called the paragon.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2015, 06:51:01 AM »

I think Hyperion should be tier 1.  If piloted by player, it is superior to every other stock frigate and destroyer that it is in a class of its own.  While AI Hyperion cannot be relied on to kill other ships efficiently, it can be relied on to capture points quickly.  AI Hyperion does not suicide very often (moot point given how rare it is.)  Its CR decays slower in 0.65 than in 0.62.

While piloting a bigger flagship is nice, Hyperion has two advantages over them:  One, burn speed - fastest battleship can move at burn 6 or 7, Hyperion can go 12 to 14.  Burn speed is very important in 0.65.  Two, it eats much less supplies and Logistics.  This is important for characters who do not have Leadership, and do not have the Logistics to support even a lone battleship.  Even characters with high Leadership may want Hyperion over a capital so they can use more Logistics for freighters.
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2015, 08:18:16 AM »

I would suggest that the nevermore be tier 2 - it is powerful, but it is also quite fragile; even under player control.

The Mimir, by contrast, should probably be tier 1; its teleportation allows it to go up against entire high-end bounty fleets with combat 10 flagship onslaughts and win without taking a scratch (as a player flagship, and assuming that player is both skilled and relatively cautious); not even the Paragon can do that due to its much lower speed.

I would also have put the Dominator at tier 4 - it's the combination of poor flux stats, an inability to focus firepower on any target smaller than a capital, and a generally poor weapon layout that has to choose between point defense (which it needs being a low tech armor-heavy ship) and offense in those two medium turrets.  The best Dominator variants I've built have ended up highly asymmetrical... and they're still not very good.  At the very least, bump it down to tier 3 - it's not comparable to an Apogee.
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Cycerin

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2015, 08:57:49 AM »

Nevermore/Desdinova are def. tier 1 in player hands, but hardly so if AI piloted. A swarm of Enforcers in the AI hands is frankly superior to practically anything else, with the exception of other bricky destroyers such as the Scorpion.

I intend to take both ships down a peg in my next version, for the record.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector Ship Tiers
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2015, 09:16:15 AM »

@ Wyvern:  Do not forget that Dominator can carry plenty of missiles, not as much as an Aurora, but enough to slaughter things.  Dominator is very good as both player and AI ship.  As for point defense, Vulcans in all small mounts is sufficient (and flux efficient), and all medium and heavy mounts can go to offense.
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