Fractal Softworks Forum
Starsector => Suggestions => Topic started by: CryIsFree on January 05, 2023, 09:08:05 PM
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After playing this game for a reasonable amount of time and experimenting with almost every ship and weapon, I came to a conclusion that the medium energy slot is a clear loser on a otherwise very balanced arsenal available to the player, with very rare exceptions. To reinforce this idea I will present my general thoughts on all slots and some of the choices I've found to work, then elaborate on medium energy and why I think it needs some love.
Small Ballistics: Great slot. Extremely versatile, with many options for PD, short range or medium range kinetic, frag and high explosive damage. Vulcan Cannons are some of the best PD in the game, railguns are amazing kinetic pressure. Light Mortars aren't amazing IMO but they are an option if you want explosive dmg.
Medium Ballistics: Amazing. Just as versatile as small ballistics, but with more options, on top of short and medium range frag, kinetic and HE damage you also get amazing long range options. Hypervelocity Drivers and Heavy Maulers are some of the best weapons in the game for long range kinetic and HE damage respectively, Heavy Autocannons and Heavy Mortars do the same on medium range, Assault Chainguns are great for close quarters combat, Flak and Dual Flak Cannons are amazing PD, Heavy Machine Guns can be good kinetic pressure on QCQ ships with Safety Overrides.
Large Ballistics: Good. Not as versatile as the other slots, as most your options are long range, but they are still great options nonetheless. Devastator Cannons are probably the best PD weapon in the game, all the High Explosive options are good on their own rights, Gauss cannons are amazing kinetic pressure with insane range, Mjolnir cannons do decent energy damage from afar with a EMP on top.
Small Energy: Good slot. many pd options, all of which are good though I prefer the Burst PD Laser, Antimatter Blasters are amazing on QCQ ships, frigates, destroyers, cruisers, anything fast or phase can use one. Ion cannons are also good on QCQ ships, EMP is never a bad thing to have. Tactical Lasers aren't amazing IMO but if you're building a very long range ship with beam weapons, targeting core/unit and advanced optics you might as well slap some of those in for extra damage.
Large Energy: Amazing slot. Great mid range energy DPS options on the Plasma Cannons and Autopulse Lasers, and the amazing Tachyon Lances to poke and EMP your enemy at a distance.
Missiles need no explanation, pretty much every single missile weapon is good on their own right with very few exceptions, if any. These are the best weapons until they run out of ammo.
Which brings us to the point I'm trying to make: The Medium Energy Slot. I'd like to start off by saying the Graviton Beam and the Ion Beam are great support weapons, if not some of the best. Constant kinetic and EMP pressure is never bad. However the med energy slot lacks outstanding damage dealing options, as the Heavy Blaster is extremely flux hungry and short range, the Ion Pulser is good at very short range but the AI struggles greatly to use it because of the magazine size, Phase Lances do extremely low DPS, Pulse Lasers are just unimpressive in every possible aspect, and the energy damage type tends to struggle greatly vs armour, and the late game ships are all heavily armoured.
Furthermore, some ships seem to have been designed to rely on the medium energy slots for damage, like the Fury and the Medusa, and I often struggle to build these ships around said slots, despite of their great stats. Falcons and Eagles also feel weak since those two medium energy slots are rarely doing much other then providing a slight kinetic pressure or a weak EMP bean. The mediocrity of the Medium Energy slot also makes high tech ships often rely on missiles instead of energy weapons. The Aurora is an amazing hull, with SO and missiles it can easily take down most capitals in the game, but trying one without missiles, relying instead on energy weapons is often lackluster. The Midline and Low Tech cruisers comparable to the Aurora don't suffer from this problem, as Eradicators and Champions can easily forfeit missiles altogether to rely on Hypervelocity Drivers, Heavy Maulers or assault Chainguns for damage.
Also its important to point out that [VERY REDACTED] weapons make this slot good but they are so limited and hard to acquire I prefer to not include them in the general weaponry available.
In conclusion, my suggestion is either a stat buff to the standard damage dealing weapons in the class, which are the Heavy Blaster (preferably a range buff) and the Pulse Lasers (I dont know what to buff on this one), or even add a new weapon to bolster the strength of this slot.
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You'll probably be pleased to know, then, that next version of the game is going to be getting two new medium energy weapons: a flux-efficient longer-range burst-damage beam weapon, and a kinetic blaster.
As for the current game: the trick to getting use out of medium energy based ships is to abuse the existence of the Heavy Blaster, a ridiculously over-statted gun that's basically a large-slot weapon crammed into an entire size down. (This doesn't help ships like the Falcon and Eagle, though, which is where new weaponry and a significantly reduced deployment cost on the Eagle come in. And it doesn't help the poor Wolf, which can't really support a Pulse Laser, nevermind the Heavy Blaster's slightly insane flux cost.)
In general, for a ship that relies on medium energy weaponry, you want one heavy blaster, and then everything else as flux-efficient a secondary armament as possible (or in some cases, outright leaving weapon slots empty). For example, with the right selection of hullmods and an aggressive officer, you can get pretty good results out of an Aurora with 1x heavy blaster, 2x pulse laser, 2x IR pulse laser, 4x ion cannon, 2x burst pd, and then maybe a sabot pod in the rear synergy slot or maybe no missiles at all. (Note that the aggressive officer and the ion cannons are important, here: getting in and shutting down enemy firepower allows this variant to stay at close range when other Aurora builds would have to back off.) In my experience, this performs better under AI control than the classic missile-heavy builds most people go with; the missile-heavy build will outperform it against the first ship or two it fights... and then it'll be low on missiles and struggle to get kills after that, while my energy-heavy variant can just keep on trucking for as long as the battle goes.
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I think you'll be glad to hear that at least several med energies are having changes made to them then. If you're unaware the graviton will cause the target to take additional shield damage from all sources, and the other med beams are all confirmed to "be receiving some love". Nothing specific yet.
In conclusion, my suggestion is either a stat buff to the standard damage dealing weapons in the class, which are the Heavy Blaster (preferably a range buff) and the Pulse Lasers (I dont know what to buff on this one), or even add a new weapon to bolster the strength of this slot.
Bad news is, I'm not aware of any confirmed changes happening to either of these though. That said, the next update seems to be massive so it's hard to imagine that one way or another, med energies or the ships that rely on them won't see a buff.
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And it doesn't help the poor Wolf, which can't really support a Pulse Laser, nevermind the Heavy Blaster's slightly insane flux cost.
I actually find it's the opposite; the Pulse Laser's continuous fire is much less useful than throwing a few Heavy Blaster bolts before backing off. If you have poor flux stats, it's better to fire fewer, more powerful shots.
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Heavy Blaster, a ridiculously over-statted gun that's basically a large-slot weapon crammed into an entire size down.
I don't think the heavy blaster is that good. 500 DPS is good but 600 range isn't, and 720 flux/second is ludicrous. That's 0.69 damage per flux spent when most high end ships have less shield flux/damage then that, [REDACTED] ships all have 0.6 before Expert Field Modulation, 0.51 with it, so you're spending 1 flux to deal 0.35 hard flux on a ship that has way better stats then yours. On top of that, energy damage does very little against highly armoured targets, and all the hard fights also have high armour which largely diminishes the damage dealt to the hull. Other energy weapons don't suffer from this issue, Plasma Cannon has way better dmg/flux (0.91) stats and 100 extra range. Fast frigates can also dodge the projectile which isn't a major problem but it is something. If you wanna keep it as it is right now at least make the dmg/flux less laughable, maybe make the projectile faster too
It might be a bit extreme to always think in terms of [REDACTED] but I always build fleets to eventually fight the hardest fights so that's how I think. Heavy Blasters struggle vs the heavily armoured Hegemony fleets too so there's also that
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When we finally get rid of SO as it is right now, we might get better medium energy weapons that are not beams.
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In my experience, medium energy mounts are only an issue on ships that also have other, better mount types, like Eagle or Venture. Ships designed for medium energies can use them pretty well. Hyperion or Fury might be overly expensive for what they do, but they aren't bad ships per se (they certainly were good enough to get nerfed), even if the meta is ever shifting. Heavy Blaster and Ion Pulser combo is still very good, especially against remnants.
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I wouldn't say medium energy is bad, I'd say that AI can't do hit and run tactics. Which makes heavy-hitting burst-fire medium energy weapons(and high tech ships that use them in general) look very lackluster in comparison, because the AI simply cannot use them effectively. Meanwhile in player hands ships like Fury or Aurora are some of the most effective in the game.
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Meanwhile in player hands ships like Fury or Aurora are some of the most effective in the game.
Dude the Fury is NOT one of the most effective ships in the game, its actually kind of bad, dare I say the worst combat cruiser in the game after the eagle and the falcon (excluding the meme civilian and pirate/pather cruises)
Hell, it might be worse then a Falcon. Definitely worse then a Pirate Falcon
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Dude the Fury is NOT one of the most effective ships in the game, its actually kind of bad, dare I say the worst combat cruiser in the game after the eagle and the falcon (excluding the meme civilian and pirate/pather cruises)
The fury is very good, you don't build it for long-range beam configs, you give it close range assault weapons (Heavy blaster / Sabot Pod / Ion Pulser) and rush in (which is easy with Plasma Burn) and deal massive burst damage, and you can then leverage the ships high mobility to back off if you need to.
The player will be better at doing this than the AI, but even then it can still be very potent in AI hands.
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Back to the topic of medium energy weapons, they can be a bit situational, but overall they are good.
Graviton Beam - long range suppression, good for energy slots on ballistic focused midline ships (eg: conquest / eagle) and with the coming update they will have a nice bonus for shield damage
Heavy Blaster - The close range high aggression weapon, often requires safety overrides to use practically, but the sheer damage output makes it valuable
Heavy Burst Laser - a bit niche, i'd argue it to be the weakest of all medium energy weapons, but it's the only PD option, so it has uses.
Ion Beam - similar use case to the graviton, one of these on a conquest/eagle gives it some effective EMP disabling ability.
Ion Pulser - offers massive burst damage, and lots of EMP, while short ranged, combined with a more efficient anti-shield option it can be truly punishing.
Mining Blaster - considered by some to be a sidegrade to the heavy blaster, rather niche, but still has uses.
Phase Lance - instant-hit with rather high power against armour, very good when backed up by some kinetic weapons.
Pulse Laser - Jack of all trades, master of none, generally outclassed by one of the other options in every area, but can be useful for its "middle-of-the-road" average value.
For the ships that can mount them, there is at least one medium energy weapon that works in each slot, it's just a case of figuring out what role the ship/weapon slot needs to fill.
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The new kinetic blaster will then likely fill the hole if none of the other weapons work as it will certainly be efficient vs shields and it is described as being like the heavy blaster which is good except for it’s flux.
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In what world do Mining Blaster and Heavy Burst Laser have uses? Give me an example where you'd fit those weapons, I'm honestly curious. I see them as trap options, where you're better off just leaving the mount empty and spending OP elsewhere. I've been around for a long time yet didn't see a single person call Mining Blaster a sidegrade to Heavy Blaster.
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Nah. Mining Blaster is fine. It's the budget armour breaking option for energy guns, and it's p. good at it.
Just because it can't do everything like the Heavy can doesn't mean it's useless.
I use it quite a bit since I don't buy stuff. And, yeah, the Heavy is a better all-round weapon.
But the MB is 'good enough' to get a decent amount of use out of.
I like it on fast ships that can slide away and vent reliably. Almost any frigate can use them fairly well.
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Mining Blaster is the best medium energy weapon in the game, because any ship using it becomes an easier target the instant it fires the blaster.
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Budget ( ) -- 1.71 flux efficiency ( )
Choose one
I still can't tell if some are just messing with us here for the sake of comedy. Like SCC said, any ship with it is an immediate target since I know it won't do anything in combat, only overload itself.
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Mining Blaster is the low-tier Open Market armor cracker for Energy ships that was probably designed for enemy Ventures or civilians drawn into combat. It should have its DP lowered below 10 to be more like other low-tier Open Market weapons. As for when to use it, Apogee starter starts with it (and can support it), and there is nothing much better against heavy armor until Heavy Blaster or Plasma Cannon (or HIL/Tachyon if Apogee has Squalls) comes along. Later in the game, after I have all the weapons I want, I never use it - too inefficient and not enough range. It used to be useful for Hyperion when it had unlimited teleport before its recent redesign, but now it is no good for Hyperion anymore.
Heavy Burst Laser ignores countermeasures, so if I want burst PD but do not have IPDAI (or want more range than burst PD), I may want heavy burst laser. Also, it is more efficient than phase lance (and has +200 if ePD is involved), so if I stack a few, I have a phase lance alternative (instead of one Phase Lance and two Tactical/Gravitons) that is more efficient (and more range if the ship has ePD). Better anti-armor than Tactical Laser or Graviton Beam. Works fine against human fleets, but admittedly underpowered against Ordos.
I use the following in medium energy mounts.
* Heavy Blaster - for big ships that can support it, or SO ships.
* Heavy Burst Laser - burst PD with more range; light anti-armor if the ship can focus several.
* IR PL - Two is superior to one Pulse Laser when ship has ePD+IPDAI, and many ships have smaller mounts to spare.
* Pulse Laser - shield cracker or flyswatter on ships without ePD. Mediocre option all-around.
* Phase Lance - strike weapon for Harbinger. Okay as flyswatter on some other ships.
* Mining Blaster - Apogee starts with it, and it will do until I find a heavy blaster or plasma cannon. (Upgrading missiles has higher priority.)
* Ion Beam - rarely use, it takes too long for the beam to EMP an enemy.
* Ion Pulser - finisher or non-missile PD.
* Graviton Beam - rarely use, and most of the time I do use it, I also use High Scatter Amplifier to give it hard flux.
The new kinetic blaster will then likely fill the hole if none of the other weapons work as it will certainly be efficient vs shields and it is described as being like the heavy blaster which is good except for it’s flux.
If kinetic blaster is much rarer than standard human weapons because player cannot buy, order, or (with blueprint) mass-produce them (and must kill and grind LG Executors for them), I would not count kinetic blasters as a feasible option because they would be too rare, especially if Lion's Guard is less common than Ordos.
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I'd say the mining blaster has a very narrow niche in the early game for when I have no other armor crackers yet because its so widely available. Once I find a heavy blaster its out.
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Mining Blaster's niche was old Hyperion with unlimited teleportation. But since that ship doesn't exist anymore, MB is always a subpar option.
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In regards to the Heavy Burst Laser, no: it's not a mainstay by any stretch but it can be very potent anti-Missile PD. With all the Eagle testing I was doing in the Eagle thread, I found myself mounting HBL in the Medium Energies since the (modded) Large Ballistic was doing most of the heavy lifting. The HBL was zapping Sabots before they went to the second-stage and wiping Harpoons out very efficiently. Obviously, they get overloaded against fighters, Annihilators, Squalls, etc. but against some of the stronger single-shot missiles, they do very well. Also, they can contribute against armor much better than most PD if you get in close. Not an ideal use for them but they're better than other PD.
The Mining Blaster is obviously inferior to the Heavy Blaster but if you can score hits on armor, it's not completely awful. Using it against Shields (which the AI will do) is asinine though because of the inefficiency, unless you can cause an overload because of it.
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I'm not sure if it still works out, but Heavy Burst Lasers on a Conquest at least used to be able to take out hurricane MIRVs before they split.
I very very rarely use it on hulls that don't have capital grade ITU, though.
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I do have extensive play time of current Hyperion with 1 or 2 Mining Blasters.
Only on player-controlled ship, MB manually fired, never shooting into shield, aiming (if possible in the heat of battle) engines and high priority weapons of enemy ships.
So I like it. Doesn't mean it's "the best", though. ;D
Idea 1: increase its damage from 700 to 900, and reduce its fire rate from 30 shots/min to 20 shots/min. So a DPS decrease (from 350 to 300), but more importantly have an even more obvious "burst" behaviour. Don't ask me about flux per shot.
Idea 2: keep its damage and fire rate as is, but add a guaranteed on-hit secondary effect. Like damage a wider part of the armor, do higher damage to bare hull/engines/weapons.
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Mining blaster is something i've used on various (modded) phase frigates, they can zip behind the target and get around shields, so good shots into hull, and then can diss the (soft) flux from firing when phased, so the poor efficiency is less of an issue.
Ofc a heavy blaster would have been better, but i was using what i could get my hands on.
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I would like to see the MB become a budget HE weapon, it looses in all stats against the HB improving them a bit wont change anything about it.
Make it HE about half the dmg and quarter the flux and you get a budget option for may situations.
The Pulse laser should get 25% more dmg without increased cost making it fit the 0.8 efficiency of other pulse laser sizes.
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Changing the damage type for Mining Blaster is something that would need to be given some careful consideration.
It is the only non-pd weapon in the base_bp group that has energy damage, and removing that could make quite a difference as you'd no longer have a (semi) useful weapon to put in energy slots that can actually hurt shields.
The Mining Blaster, like many of the things people complain about being "not the best and therefore useless" is designed as a fallback option for a faction that doesn't have access to anything.
Idea 1 / Idea 2
Yes! Double down on the implied role rather than change the role.
I can't say I like phase ships all that much, but I have used a Harbinger with Mining Blasters before. And it worked a lot better than I expected it to (caveat - this was before phase ships became self-immobilising, so it may not work the same now).
It also kind of works on a Sunder, although it really needs the extra speed from safety overrides to be able to slide away at all to get rid of all that flux.
Frigates do better at running and resetting though - especially if you put cautious guys in charge.
I don't really have a strong opinion on the Heavy Burst, as it's not something I've ever had much cause to use.
Light Bursts + beams seem to do just fine for pd. And only the rather uncommon medium synergy mounts would require its use if you had to have pd there.
They're also incredibly hard to find if you rely on salvage - easily one of the rarest weapons in the entire game.
The Pulse Laser could do with a little something.
I think I'd prefer to see less flux than more damage though, as it's more of a continuous fire than a burst weapon.
Or range. Giving it a little edge there might be something to consider. Even an extra 50 would be nice.
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Changing the damage type for Mining Blaster is something that would need to be given some careful consideration.
It is the only non-pd weapon in the base_bp group that has energy damage, and removing that could make quite a difference as you'd no longer have a (semi) useful weapon to put in energy slots that can actually hurt shields.
The Mining Blaster, like many of the things people complain about being "not the best and therefore useless" is designed as a fallback option for a faction that doesn't have access to anything.
That is the player early in the game. Apogee needs something in its large gun to kill enemies. Mining blaster works, even if it is inferior to other options. Also, high-tech stations with only base_dp available (like the player's) will be loaded with mining blasters. I have been a few fights against pirates attacking my high-tech orbital station before I found any blueprints.
I can't say I like phase ships all that much, but I have used a Harbinger with Mining Blasters before. And it worked a lot better than I expected it to (caveat - this was before phase ships became self-immobilising, so it may not work the same now).
The biggest nerf to Harbinger was the system change - one charge with long recharge delay that needs Neural Link and two linked Harbingers to partially fix, and overload duration might have been reverted to nearly no delay like when Harbinger had synergies for Reapers. And the "self-immobilizing" wrecked AI Harbinger, which still tries to get behind the enemy but fails spectacularly and wastes too much time (and PPT) in the process. Harbinger is trash in this release. Without Neural Link and two linked Harbingers, Harbinger practically has "No System". It can punch down without its system, but that makes Harbinger an overpriced Vanguard wannabe for the flagship only.
I don't really have a strong opinion on the Heavy Burst, as it's not something I've ever had much cause to use.
Light Bursts + beams seem to do just fine for pd. And only the rather uncommon medium synergy mounts would require its use if you had to have pd there.
They're also incredibly hard to find if you rely on salvage - easily one of the rarest weapons in the entire game.
Railguns and burst PD are rare enough that I only have enough of them after I get the blueprint and can mass produce them. As soon as I get the blueprint, I start ordering dozens of them immediately from my Orbital Works.
I expect LG's kinetic blaster to be even rarer than that, and it may not have a blueprint to mass produce them. If so, I do not care if it gets stepped on by a buffed pulse laser.
The Pulse Laser could do with a little something.
I think I'd prefer to see less flux than more damage though, as it's more of a continuous fire than a burst weapon.
Or range. Giving it a little edge there might be something to consider. Even an extra 50 would be nice.
If ePD stays as it is, that is a very good idea. ePD+IPDAI IR PL has not broken anything, aside from making every other medium energy weapon obsolete for shield cracking for ships with ePD. Pulse Laser could get more efficiency like every other pulse laser of other sizes and/or maybe +50 or +100 more range. Still not as good as ePD+IPDAI IR PL, but at least it costs less to get.
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https://twitter.com/amosolov/status/1612948304157110273
Trying out a redesign of the Mining Blaster - a high-explosive (anti-armor) burst weapon, with much better flux efficiency.
Feels pretty good so far; not sure if the current stats are over-tuned or not. It's a lot of burst damage, but also: still just 500 range!
(https://i.imgur.com/fsb2bBr.jpg)
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Between this and the kinetic blaster I think Alex is onto a solution for medium energy’s. Having the all of the damage types means we can have damage and efficiency now. We’ll have to see how they shake out though.
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I really wouldn't count LG weapons as standard ones, since from what we heard, they'll take a while to get to and then farm. But really liking this change, this now means Pulse Laser is the basic one (it's on open market right?).
Although I'm curious how this will affect the Phase Lance, since the two weapons seem to have a very similar role. Mining Blaster might be even better since the description says it doesn't shoot at shields.
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I like it, it certainly fits that a mining tool would be more effective against armor. Because rocks are... hard... yeah.
But more importantly, the entire LG lineup is getting their own ship variants? And what is the topmost built-in hullmod?
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And what is the topmost built-in hullmod?
Energy bolt coherer, the thing that gives bonus range to non beam energy weapons. That is really cool on Brawler imo.
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It is, it's nice to see that LG ships are getting something more than just Solar Shielding for their "LG tax"(Brawler LG has 5 less OP than regular Brawler, and 15 less than Brawler TT)
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Yeah I'm really happy Alex listened to feedback and made LG ships unique and fun in their own way, instead of them being a pure downgrade while looking different.
But now with Mining Blaster getting a nice rework, and Gravitons having an additional effect on hit, medium energies are pretty much in a good place. Only other thing I'd touch is the Heavy Burst Laser.
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That’s actually pretty good. Yes, it can eat armor but its sustained DPS is garbage, it will be terrible against shields and it’s low range. I assume the last of the flavor text means it holds back a charge or two when when shooting at shields?
It won’t be a “poor man’s Heavy Blaster” anymore and that’s ok.
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Mining Blaster change may be interesting, especially for phase ships with Phase Anchor (to speed up recharge), but I wonder what will happen with Apogee and player's high-tech battlestations.
Apogee starter can probably replace the tac lasers with IR PLs. Two or more IR PL is the energy shield cracker, although only two is frigate level firepower.
Player's high-tech battlestations with only base_bp? Wonder how they will work with only HE mining blasters in the bigger weapon mounts.
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...this now means Pulse Laser is the basic one (it's on open market right?).
If things stay as they are now, no. For energy options, only the two mining weapons are Open Market.
That said, pulse lasers are fairly common in black markets, and if the way black markets work stay as they are, then it will be fairly trivial to go to an enemy or unprotected station and buy it from there.
It just so happens that the two base energy weapons are also Open Market weapons, and the bigger problem is energy loadouts for things limited to base weapons set only and cannot be configured by player.
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Huh, with expanded magazines that means the new mining blaster would dump out 2100 HE damage with 700 penetration in 1.2 seconds.
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Sunder in the back anyone? I think with skills it legitimately might be able to "one burst" a Dominator, or get close to it.
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Sunder using HEF (+50%) and assuming +15% average bonus from Energy Mastery, +15% from targetting analysis, +10% from 'pack, and +10% from CR gives a (100 + 15 + 15 + 10 + 10)(1.5) = 225% damage. Using three Mining Blasters outputs 6,300 damage, or 14,175 at 1575 (Hellbore-esque) pen after all the boosts. Dominator is 14,000 hull + 1,500 armor, so it should still survive, barely.
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Yeah hah there's no way it's staying that way :)
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Energy weapons need to be worse/more restrictive than the other weapon types because the ships they are mounted on are just better. This especially applies to range because high tech ships are faster, and would just kite everything with 1200 range beams if they were allowed to use energy weapons on par with ballistics.
Medium energy weapons are the best damage output SO weapons in the game (Heavy Blaster and Ion Pulser) but they are pretty lacking in midrange/long range. Alex seems to think the same because he gave the LG ships all Energy Bolt Coherer which I think is great. If all the LG sub-capitals get the hullmod that means you can play most of the midline roster with it. Seems like medium energies are effectively buffed now (assuming that LG doesn't have some crippling downside), while not buffing high tech ships like the Fury, which unlike what some here claim, is not bad and is one of the best ships in the game. Also I think many weapons will not be good with energy bolt coherer since these midline ships still don't have the flux to run all those energies.
Also to reply to Alex the new Mining Blaster feels like it will be pretty garbage. Basically a Phase Lance with HE that does hard flux (which doesn't matter much since it's HE), and has lower DPS. You could also see it as a crappy Heavy Blaster if you want. I hope it is buffed somehow or changed to be more useful.
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I'm thinking scripted damage is going make an appearance soon... ;)
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Lortus, did you not see Hatters calculation showing that the new mining blaster can, with the right set up, almost destroy a Dominator in about 1 second?
I think the mining blaster should get a bit less damage and do some armour only damage like breach missiles. Maybe change the damage type back to energy.
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Sunder using HEF (+50%) and assuming +15% average bonus from Energy Mastery, +15% from targetting analysis, +10% from 'pack, and +10% from CR gives a (100 + 15 + 15 + 10 + 10)(1.5) = 225% damage. Using three Mining Blasters outputs 6,300 damage, or 14,175 at 1575 (Hellbore-esque) pen after all the boosts. Dominator is 14,000 hull + 1,500 armor, so it should still survive, barely.
did a sanity check on this, for science
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOhIvnmDhT4
while not quite a one second kill, mining blaster is still quite strong - especially given burst synergizes with HT doctrine. nothing competes nearly as well against heavy armour without using torpedoes. heavy blasters take a similar time to kill under the same criteria, but mining blasters don't eat up your entire flux capacity in the process.
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… that’s overpowered as hell but I don’t care because I love it. Really cool video.
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I see that LG Hammerhead with two medium energies...
... which if you think about it is a bit weird, since it's almost a worse Sunder that way which has the same mounts plus a large energy and HEF. Which means LG Hammerhead must have a non-HEF system otherwise it'd be almost certainly just a worse Sunder.
I wonder if the TT Brawler will get Coherer as well. I suppose it doesn't have to since it has Plasma Jets and 5 extra OP (plus the default TT builds use beams) but feels a bit weird if the actual high tech Brawler is lacking such a high tech hullmod.
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I also see the LG Sunder has a G I G A Cannon…
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I see that LG Hammerhead with two medium energies... ... which if you think about it is a bit weird, since it's almost a worse Sunder
Kinetic Blaster is going to be medium no? I feel like that alone will dramatically change the value of a medium energy slot.
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Doesn't change the fact that the Sunder has the same slots + a large energy, not to mention vastly superior flux stats?
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Doesn't change the fact that the Sunder has the same slots + a large energy, not to mention vastly superior flux stats?
Sunder also has 1.2 shield efficiency. Hammerhead has 0.8.
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That's to balance its flux stats so it doesn't have super shields AND super weapons. The Sunder has double the flux dissipation of the Hammerhead and nearly double the flux capacity.
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Kinetic Blaster is going to be medium no? I feel like that alone will dramatically change the value of a medium energy slot.
Kinetic blasters will be rare, and while good for anti-shield as far as energy weapons go, they'll still fall short compared to ballistic options.
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Kinetic Blaster is going to be medium no? I feel like that alone will dramatically change the value of a medium energy slot.
Kinetic blasters will be rare, and while good for anti-shield as far as energy weapons go, they'll still fall short compared to ballistic options.
They’re not being compared to ballistic. Most of the time you don’t get to choose. If you did then most ships would go with ballistics most of the time.
Most medium energies are on high tech ships and high tech ships are generally faster and have more flux so they they don’t mind the kinetic blaster being flux hungry or short ranged as much as low tech would.
Kinetic blaster will have the damage and not terrible efficiency and that’s all it needs to make medium energies much stronger. Sure a ballistic would be better but that’s not the point.
... which if you think about it is a bit weird, since it's almost a worse Sunder that way which has the same mounts plus a large energy and HEF. Which means LG Hammerhead must have a non-HEF system otherwise it'd be almost certainly just a worse Sunder.
What’s wrong with that? An enforcer is just a worse dominator and yet it’s a good ship anyway. Edit: Nevermind, I thought they were talking about the LB brawler.
TT brawler with coherer would be good. It’s easily the worst of the variants.
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TT brawler with coherer would be good. It’s easily the worst of the variants.
Hopefully the TT version gets coherer just as the LG one does.
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I could see a Hammerhead with medium energies being ok as long as it got a decent system to back them up. Medium energy has always had decent anti-hull/armor options, and it looks like the ship is keeping its small ballistics so it can mount kinetics. Or if the system really makes energies worth it it could mount small energy's in its slots (but I'm kind of doubtful - small kinetics are great and pair with energy really well).
I do see that it would be similar to a Sunder, but the Hammerhead is a significantly tougher, cheaper ship that has more small mounts. It all hinges on that system!
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What’s wrong with that? An enforcer is just a worse dominator and yet it’s a good ship anyway.
Enforcer is a Destroyer and Dominator is a Cruiser. Enforcer costs a lot less DP than a Dominator to deploy - you can almost deploy three Enforcers for the cost of one Dominator.
Sunder and Hammerhead meanwhile have similar DP costs (and are both Destroyers) so are obviously meant to be on par power-wise, which is the case when the Hammerhead uses superior kinetics but definitely isn't when it's using energy weapons its flux grid can't support properly.
I do see that it would be similar to a Sunder, but the Hammerhead is a significantly tougher, cheaper ship that has more small mounts. It all hinges on that system!
Well, it has one extra small mount that points backwards. But yeah I expect the LG Hammerhead to have a mobility system (probably plasma jets) to make it different and competitive with the LG Sunder.
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My mistake, I thought it was the LG brawler that was being called a worse sunder.
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Yeah I'm really happy Alex listened to feedback and made LG ships unique and fun in their own way, instead of them being a pure downgrade while looking different.
But now with Mining Blaster getting a nice rework, and Gravitons having an additional effect on hit, medium energies are pretty much in a good place. Only other thing I'd touch is the Heavy Burst Laser.
What changed? Also %5-10 additional damage seem too weak for Graviton Beam buff.
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Yeah I'm really happy Alex listened to feedback and made LG ships unique and fun in their own way, instead of them being a pure downgrade while looking different.
But now with Mining Blaster getting a nice rework, and Gravitons having an additional effect on hit, medium energies are pretty much in a good place. Only other thing I'd touch is the Heavy Burst Laser.
What changed? Also %5-10 additional damage seem too weak for Graviton Beam buff.
Mining Blaster becoming a charge based burst HE weapon. Same range but much better efficiency. Alex showed the stats on twitter but it appears he'll change them as it's too strong currently.
Gravitons apply a 5-10% kinetic vulnerability on a ship that's getting beamed. That means from ALL sources. Sounds like a strong thing to me tbh.
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Yeah I'm really happy Alex listened to feedback and made LG ships unique and fun in their own way, instead of them being a pure downgrade while looking different.
But now with Mining Blaster getting a nice rework, and Gravitons having an additional effect on hit, medium energies are pretty much in a good place. Only other thing I'd touch is the Heavy Burst Laser.
What changed? Also %5-10 additional damage seem too weak for Graviton Beam buff.
Mining Blaster becoming a charge based burst HE weapon. Same range but much better efficiency. Alex showed the stats on twitter but it appears he'll change them as it's too strong currently.
Gravitons apply a 5-10% kinetic vulnerability on a ship that's getting beamed. That means from ALL sources. Sounds like a strong thing to me tbh.
Sorry I meant to ask how LG ships got better rather than being generic ships with a nerf hullmod?
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Well we don't know the exact changes Alex made after the blog post. But from the screnshots we can tell that some ships have different weapon mounts from the originals. We also see built in hullmods so it's not a stretch if some ships will have different systems. But they will all come will less OP and that Special Modifications d-mod.
So I dare not say they're going to be better nor worse, just sidegrades.
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So, if the Mining Blaster changes happen (to whatever degree), what does that do to the Phase Lance? The (shown) Mining Blaster gives up about 20% sustained damage and 100 range but gains hard flux against shields and waaaaay better anti-hull damage (at way better efficiency). The Phase Lance will kill fighters better but I don't think that's enough of an advantage to make it competitive. Technically, this has always been the case, but the Mining Blaster was so horribly flux inefficient that it kind of ruled itself out. Now, at 1.0 efficiency, it squarely beats the Phase Lance in an anti-armor role.
As an off-the-wall suggestion, why not increase the RoF of the Phase Lance while leaving the actual armor penetration alone? Beams half as long in duration but firing (roughly) twice as fast? It would overkill less on fighters, while shooting more down, making it a bit more of a generalist. As an aside, why is it flux inefficient? I hate that a lot of Energy weapons are homogenizing to 1.0 efficiency but I don't understand why the Phase Lance pays a premium to fire when it does soft flux. I've also argued it could use 700 range but that's an entire suggestion entirely.
(https://iili.io/HY8SMAb.png) (https://freeimage.host/)
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You know, I had this exact same thought when I initially saw the Mining Blaster on Twitter. I just didn't think it was worth enough to talk about it. Phase Lance would probably still have a role, only a super small one. Like a niche beyond niche. Not sure what it could be done, as I agree that just having a bunch of 1.0 efficiency weapons is boring. RoF increase sounds nice but I dread giving such a thing to AI.
Only reason I justified that 1.2 efficiency was because of its burst. But Mining Blaster will surpass it in that role (even after Alex adjusts the stats), so unfortunately it indirectly got much worse all of a sudden.
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As an off-the-wall suggestion, why not increase the RoF of the Phase Lance while leaving the actual armor penetration alone? Beams half as long in duration but firing (roughly) twice as fast?
That is effectively the Omega's Rift Lance (which takes a small mount).
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With all the other buffs coming to medium energies I would not say no to a phase lance buff, but I will also say that in its current form I use them frequently alongside kinetics and for burst damage builds, including on non-high tech ships that you'd think the poorer efficiency would be important on. The current weapon works.
For phase lances, doing full damage to shields and being in a burst makes their being soft flux matter less - it still matters, but the damage is delivered quickly enough that high flux targets can't dissipate it during the burst. And because its a beam, even overloading doesn't actually save them from the damage the way it does with high per shot damage projectiles. I do wish the AI would fire them less frequently into low flux targets when backed by kinetics, but burst weapons are trickier than ammo weapons in terms of shot conservation.
In terms of dealing with shields, 214 soft flux/sec at 1.2 in 1250 spikes is imo much better than 87.5 hard flux at 2.0 (I have no idea what the initial spike size will be, as the revealed stats are confirmed to be being tweaked downwards in terms of burst). I'm very happy to hear that the mining blaster is going to have custom fire logic to preserve itself and not waste into shields! Thats going to make it way better at its job of armor and hull killing.
In terms of anti-hull, I think they are going to be nearly equal at DPS once the mining blaster's burst is down, as the MB has lower DPS but better penetration (700 vs 500), but with better efficiency. Otoh, even high flux shields can 'catch' mining blaster shots safely, while they really can't catch phase lances... I'm really unsure here. I think for medium-armor targets I might prefer the phase lance depending on the burst and accuracy of the mining blaster! Also being able to get 800 range (with advanced optics) vs 500 is a decent difference.
Uhhh I kind of rambled there, but I think a firing logic tweak (and the aiming bug being fixed which we know it is!) would be just as important as a small stat change to making the phase lance keep up well.
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That is effectively the Omega's Rift Lance (which takes a small mount).
Tells you how much I use Omega weapons, eh? ;) Yep, literally the same. So…scratch that idea!
@Thaago
Yeah, I’m really wary of power creep, as well. I don’t think the current Phase Lance is bad but I’m just seeing all these changes and wondering if the meta will pass it by.
Again, maybe a little off the wall here, but what if Phase Lances siphoned flux off of shields? I.e, if they hit a shield, their flux cost got halved or something. It doesn’t actually raise or lower the enemy ship’s flux any more or less, or do any additional damage, it’s just a scripted discount for the Phase Lance when hitting shields. So, real numbers, if a Phase Lance connects with shields, it fires 1250 soft flux into it but only costs 750 instead of 1500. The moment shields drop, it goes back to its 1.2 efficiency.
It wouldn’t feel so bad firing into shields this way because you know you’re not “wasting” the shot. It’s still soft flux, but it’s efficient. You can tweak the numbers (25%, etc.) but it’s a thought. I’m kind of surprised there isn’t a flux siphon weapon of some sort already. Or the Mechwarrior equivalent of a Flamer that basically does no damage but drives up Heat (Kinetics are sort of this on shields but imagine a weapon that drove up hard flux when hitting hull/armor but did little to no actual damage)
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Again, maybe a little off the wall here, but what if Phase Lances siphoned flux off of shields? I.e, if they hit a shield, their flux cost got halved or something. It doesn’t actually raise or lower the enemy ship’s flux any more or less, or do any additional damage, it’s just a scripted discount for the Phase Lance when hitting shields. So, real numbers, if a Phase Lance connects with shields, it fires 1250 soft flux into it but only costs 750 instead of 1500. The moment shields drop, it goes back to its 1.2 efficiency.
It wouldn’t feel so bad firing into shields this way because you know you’re not “wasting” the shot. It’s still soft flux, but it’s efficient. You can tweak the numbers (25%, etc.) but it’s a thought.
This is actually a pretty neat idea. An elegant solution to the issue of the AI just firing it into enemy shields regardless of their flux level.
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I actually don't like the Mining Blaster being "useful", to be honest. It feels wrong to see Mining Blasters mounted on something like a Harbinger. IMO "mining weapons" should always be inferior (but cheaper OP wise) to dedicated military counterparts, e.g. hammer vs reaper, mining laser vs PD laser.
I'd feel a lot better about the Mining Blaster if we get a military-grade upgrade for it (and really, the iteration of the Mining Blaster in the post is probably too strong and needs a nerf). I see Alex thinks the Heavy Blaster is the military-grade version which is true previously but this new iteration where it actually has a niche as a flux-efficient armor breaker? Not really.
As long as the Mining Blaster is best-in-slot for something (e.g. Harbinger) I won't feel good about it.
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I actually don't like the Mining Blaster being "useful", to be honest. It feels wrong to see Mining Blasters mounted on something like a Harbinger. IMO "mining weapons" should always be inferior (but cheaper OP wise) to dedicated military counterparts, e.g. hammer vs reaper, mining laser vs PD laser.
I'd feel a lot better about the Mining Blaster if we get a military-grade upgrade for it (and really, the iteration of the Mining Blaster in the post is probably too strong and needs a nerf). I see Alex thinks the Heavy Blaster is the military-grade version which is true previously but this new iteration where it actually has a niche as a flux-efficient armor breaker? Not really.
As long as the Mining Blaster is best-in-slot for something (e.g. Harbinger) I won't feel good about it.
I used hammers but never a mining blaster because they are just not worth it. If a weapon is designed to be useless i honestly see no point on it existing at all. The mining blaster should be useful even if not optimal. I get the point that the mining blaster being the best option is odd but it should still be worth giving consideration.
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be inferior (but cheaper OP wise)
This is not a functional balance option in Starsector. You can always fit smaller number of more efficient and more expensive weapons, instead of filling all the slots with garbage. A weapon MUST be "best in slot" somewhere to be worth including in the game.
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This is not a functional balance option in Starsector. You can always fit smaller number of more efficient and more expensive weapons, instead of filling all the slots with garbage. A weapon MUST be "best in slot" somewhere to be worth including in the game.
Realism people when a mining weapon is no longer trash tier: :o :o :o
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be inferior (but cheaper OP wise)
This is not a functional balance option in Starsector. You can always fit smaller number of more efficient and more expensive weapons, instead of filling all the slots with garbage. A weapon MUST be "best in slot" somewhere to be worth including in the game.
A good comparison would be Hammers vs Reapers. Technically Hammers are inferior, but there are still situations when you want to use Hammers over Reapers for one reason or another. Light Mortar vs LAG is another one.
Mining Blaster vs Heavy Blaster though? With the change they no longer fill the same role exactly, and there's far too many situations where Mining Blaster (in the form shown in the tweet) is just straight up superior to the Heavy Blaster in most metrics (specifically when it comes to phase ships, which should be the last ships you expect makeshift weapons on).
By the by, Hammer torpedoes didn't always have the "ubiquitous because of uses found by miners" line, it got added because I complained that Daggers shouldn't be using Hammers (which was planned to replace Reapers on Daggers at the time, thankfully that never eventuated); so it got retconned into a military weapon that became popular with civilians for non-military purposes.
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Hammer Barrage is a better choice 95% of the time than Cyclone Reapers, so I guess it's a good comparison but in favour of the other poster.
I'm really not sold on Mining Blaster obsoleting Heavy Blaster. First, HB does energy damage and high tech needs all the anti-shield it can get. Second, why are we still looking at Mining Blaster from the screenshot when Alex said it needs stat adjustments (or in other words, nerfs).
Also big surprise someone is afraid of phase ships being stronger, as they're pretty sad right now.
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I thought it would be clear that my grievance is primarily a flavour one. A Harbinger using Mining Blasters as its best weapon is just wrong. I honestly am not too fussed about phase ship balance, given I mod out the phase speed debuff in my own games.
And I didn't say the Mining Blaster obsoletes the Heavy Blaster, I said they become no longer comparable. They no longer try to fill the same role, the Mining Blaster becomes its own thing which no other energy weapon does (and in what it does - armor breaking - it absolutely beats the heavy blaster for many ships). That's my problem with it, if a makeshift weapon exists to fill a unique niche then a military version of it WOULD be made.
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Hyperion in the past also wanted Mining Blasters, IIRC that was the optimal weapon then. Not sure how things like these ruin the flavour. Even in reality some machines or high tech parts might use some crude tools or old parts since they just work nice together. I really don't think we should redesign a redesigned weapon just so it's not great on phase ships. If you want another weird example look at new DEM missiles which can be used on a Buffalo MKII., or hell you can even slap some [REDACTED] weapons on it and it would make for a nice fit. There's loads of stuff like this.
And I didn't say the Mining Blaster obsoletes the Heavy Blaster, I said they become no longer comparable. They no longer try to fill the same role, the Mining Blaster becomes its own thing which no other energy weapon does
You actually described how things should ideally be implemented and balanced. I for one don't like when games have 5 types of machine guns and only one or two are worth using. Of course not to say there shouldn't be overlapping roles but this is a much better way of dealing with an useless weapon.
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Hyperion in the past also wanted Mining Blasters, IIRC that was the optimal weapon then. Not sure how things like these ruin the flavour. Even in reality some machines or high tech parts might use some crude tools or old parts since they just work nice together. I really don't think we should redesign a redesigned weapon just so it's not great on phase ships. If you want another weird example look at new DEM missiles which can be used on a Buffalo MKII., or hell you can even slap some [REDACTED] weapons on it and it would make for a nice fit. There's loads of stuff like this.
And I didn't say the Mining Blaster obsoletes the Heavy Blaster, I said they become no longer comparable. They no longer try to fill the same role, the Mining Blaster becomes its own thing which no other energy weapon does
You actually described how things should ideally be implemented and balanced. I for one don't like when games have 5 types of machine guns and only one or two are worth using. Of course not to say there shouldn't be overlapping roles but this is a much better way of dealing with an useless weapon.
I was going to mention Mining Blaster Hyperion as one of my pet hates actually, though that wasn't too bad because it was very niche and objectively the Mining Blaster is just super worse than Heavy Blaster except for its alpha strike power. But if civilians and renegades figure out how to make a flux-efficient explosive energy weapon (which the Heavy Blaster is absolutely not: it's a completely different weapon with the new change) you can bet military engineers would develop their own, premium version.
Like I said, flavour.
And to clarify, the issue is not "this weapon should not be useable anywhere because better alternatives exist", like you and I pointed out Hammer vs Reaper is a pretty good example because the Reaper thematically is the "military" version of the outdated Hammer; and yet Hammers are sometimes preferred over Reapers. That's fine by me.
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That is true all things considered. If the mining blaster had the happy happenstance that cracking asteroids open with a burst of energy blasts working just as well with enemy ships then people probably would had caught on to that. Guess the military version would be the ''premium'' version of it? Kinda like with railguns and autocannons i think. The mining blaster is going to get nerfed into something more sane so this would probably be the ideal chance to conserve some of its former power.
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(It's probably worth noting that compared to the twitter screenshot, the MB has like half the DPS and an extra 100 armor-only damage on hit. The original stats were wild. Also: some visual tweaks to make the sprite fit better on a variety of ships. And, changed to HYBRID just for fun.)
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Knew it'd end up with a scripted effect. But hold on, hybrid as in it can be installed on ballistic mounts as well?
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Yep. Not that you'd *want* to most of the time; it's honestly mostly for flavor.
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HYBRID for Mining Laser? ;)
On the one hand, now "mining" ships aren't obliged to have energy mounts to get "mining" weapons. On the other, now all ships with med ballistics can mount a 350? hit strength HE weapon with +100 bonus armor damage.
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HYBRID for Mining Laser? ;)
Yes, but this is a medium weapons thread :D
On the one hand, now "mining" ships aren't obliged to have energy mounts to get "mining" weapons. On the other, now all ships with med ballistics can mount a 350? hit strength HE weapon with +100 bonus armor damage.
With 500 range, though! And poor efficiency.
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Spoiler
HYBRID for Mining Laser? ;)
Yes, but this is a medium weapons thread :D
On the one hand, now "mining" ships aren't obliged to have energy mounts to get "mining" weapons. On the other, now all ships with med ballistics can mount a 350? hit strength HE weapon with +100 bonus armor damage.
With 500 range, though! And poor efficiency.
It is palpable.
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I'm thinking scripted damage is going make an appearance soon... ;)
Not saying I called it but… ;)
I think the Hybrid change is very interesting, and yes, for flavor. I think the reduced effectiveness of the MB also puts less pressure on the Phase Lance to compete. They’re similar in role but execution will be quite different.
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If Mining Blaster is hybrid, then it cannot be mounted in a large energy anymore. If Apogee starter will remain available, what will be in its large mount? (Heavy Blaster? Autopulse?)
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If Mining Blaster is hybrid, then it cannot be mounted in a large energy anymore. If Apogee starter will remain available, what will be in its large mount? (Heavy Blaster? Autopulse?)
Tbf even if it wasn't hybrid, HE weapon on a high tech cruiser with a few mounts makes for a wonky starting ship. Although it would make sense when I think about it, it's an exploration start. I suppose it's going to be Autopulse for the start, HB feels too elite to get right at the start.
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If Mining Blaster is hybrid, then it cannot be mounted in a large energy anymore. If Apogee starter will remain available, what will be in its large mount? (Heavy Blaster? Autopulse?)
Wave Motion Gun Autopulse. It’s a generalist.
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You've all got the "pulse" part right :) It's the regular Pulse Laser, set on autofire and sporting its shiny new 0.8 flux efficiency. IIRC one of the tac lasers is replaced with an IR Pulse, too, to give it slightly more sustained dps.
One of the main points of that fit is to give you many ways to upgrade it.
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Oh thank lord Wolf can finally use the Pulse Laser, woohoo. It's nice this thread is starting to become a tease for the patch notes.
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Huzzah! Yeah, I guess Pulse Laser makes sense as a solid starter option. Better efficiency is welcome.
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But isn't Pulse Laser medium? And the mount on Apogee is Large?
I guess it's a way of teaching players that they can downsize weapons? Well if they pick the exploration start at least...
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But isn't Pulse Laser medium? And the mount on Apogee is Large?
I guess it's a way of teaching players that they can downsize weapons? Well if they pick the exploration start at least...
That's the case right now? Mining Blaster is also a medium weapon.
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Well nevermind then, I'm crazy.
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Well nevermind then, I'm crazy.
'Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: 'we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
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(It's probably worth noting that compared to the twitter screenshot, the MB has like half the DPS and an extra 100 armor-only damage on hit. The original stats were wild. Also: some visual tweaks to make the sprite fit better on a variety of ships. And, changed to HYBRID just for fun.)
Armor only damage? Cool effect. How does it perform now? On paper a DPS cut of a half sounds awful but the previous iteration of it was insane.
Also huh, the mining blaster being a hybrid is one of those things i never knew it would make so much sense until it until i saw that. This reminds me... Should mining lasers be hybrids too? You know, those super cheap PD lasers with low damage but nice range compared to standard PD lasers.
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Mining Blaster being hybrid makes me really happy, because it means the base Mule can mount Mining Blaster again; which is a flavour win.
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This reminds me... Should mining lasers be hybrids too? You know, those super cheap PD lasers with low damage but nice range compared to standard PD lasers.
HYBRID for Mining Laser? ;)
Yes, but this is a medium weapons thread :D
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Oh my god i am blind.
Nice that it is a yes though!
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So ballistic rangefinder boosts MBs range to 600 or 700 if there’s a large. Mining laser is pd though so it gets no boost.
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So ballistic rangefinder boosts MBs range to 600 or 700 if there’s a large. Mining laser is pd though so it gets no boost.
Medium Hybrid (non-PD) weapons on a ship with a large ballistic mount get double the +100 bonus for a medium weapon in a medium ballistic mount, so 500+200 for 700 with Mining Blaster. No bonus for medium weapons on a ship without a large ballistic mount.
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Medium hybrid should still get +100 without the large slot.
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Medium hybrid should still get +100 without the large slot.
Currently, only small ballistic/hybrid weapons get a range boost on a ship without a large ballistic slot.
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Just checked the hullmod code in starfarer.api, pretty sure you are wrong.
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Just checked the hullmod code in starfarer.api, pretty sure you are wrong.
Negative. I just tried Eagle with HAC and Heavy Needler and fired them both side-by-side. HAC had more range than Heavy Needler. Then I replaced the Heavy Needler with Light Needler and fired HAC and Light Needler together; HAC and Light Needler had the same range.
Results were as expected from the hullmod description in the game.
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Uh, heavy needler isn't a hybrid weapon? Medium ballistic weapons don't receive any bonus without a large slot, but medium HYBRID weapons in ballistic slots always get at least +100.
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Okay, I see. Had to re-read the description several times to find that info on +100 for hybrid that would get no bonus otherwise.
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Yeah, it's super convoluted and the tooltip is hard to parse. Did you know large hybrid weapons receive the rangefinder bonus? Technically it's covered by the tooltip, but it's very unintuitive.
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After reading it enough, yes, but I still would not want Volatile Particle Driver on Onslaught or Conquest because it costs the full 30 OP by not working with Heavy Ballistics Integration. VPD ends up on the likes of Odyssey or Radiant, if it gets used at all.
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(It's probably worth noting that compared to the twitter screenshot, the MB has like half the DPS and an extra 100 armor-only damage on hit.)
Will the burst damage remain mostly the same?