Fractal Softworks Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: GIF Roundup (04/11/20); The forum will be down for maintenance from the night of Monday, August 10th into Tuesday, EST

Author Topic: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.  (Read 6789 times)

WarStalkeR

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 341
  • Per Aspera Ad Astra!
    • View Profile
    • Email
Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« on: July 25, 2011, 02:03:01 AM »

Developers, you said this game will be sandbox, but won't have multiplayer. But because Starfarer is still far from over (it's alpha isn't it?) it has great chance to become multiplayer, or semi-multiplayer. Now i will explain what did I meant:

When player begins new game, galaxy/universe generates randomly. And it's saved in to a file.
Let's say player have character (pilot/commander/etc.) and he connects to this world on it's own computer.
*.character file - holds all info about character you've playing including fleet, researched technologies & etc, thus player can have more then one character.
*.world file - holds all info about generated galaxy/universe including locations of current ships, fleets, stations, current objectives for player X & etc.
Every Y minutes/hours *.world saves and overwrites itself with up to 3~5 backups of current world's previous saves.
In addition if *.world file didn't opened on dedicated server, every time player quits game, it saves (because this world is played in singleplayer mode with only one player). But if *.world runs on dedicated server, it saves only every Y time or when servers closes.

Thus every player if want, will be able to share his sandbox with other players for cooperation, competition or full scale warfare.
Devs, I'm interested to hear out what you think about this half crazy idea ;D
Logged

"Happiness for everybody, freely, and let no one to leave unhappy!" (c) Strugatsky Brothers
Independent Defense Force is here! And they already in Sector Xplo.

Alex

  • Administrator
  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 16761
    • View Profile
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2011, 09:31:27 AM »

It's got to be at least 75% crazy - to be honest, I don't quite understand what you mean, though I get the general idea :D

Either way, though, adding multiplayer goes beyond the (very significant) technical concerns. What mechanics are needed to make it fun, what "balance" means, etc, all depend on whether a game is SP or MP. You can't just add on MP and expect the game to be any good - it has to be designed for it in the first place. Likewise, just tacking SP onto an MP game isn't going to work well, not without lots of gameplay changes.
Logged

Alendor

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 35
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2011, 07:31:50 AM »

making the campaign mode simple multiplayer couldn't hurt tho.  would be neat to have upt to like 4 guys in the galaxy, doing their own things with their fleets, and occationally bumping into them.

will bring more to the game if you can play with a friend, as opposed to just playing all by yourself
« Last Edit: July 30, 2011, 07:48:53 AM by Alendor »
Logged

Erebos

  • Lieutenant
  • **
  • Posts: 68
    • View Profile
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2011, 03:46:57 PM »

Quote
making the campaign mode simple multiplayer couldn't hurt tho.  would be neat to have upt to like 4 guys in the galaxy, doing their own things with their fleets, and occationally bumping into them.

Correct me if I'm wrong, as I've only played it single player, but I think Mount & Blade: Warband did the exact opposite of what you're suggesting and has multiplayer battles without the campaign layer, because the way the campaign layer works is fundamentally unsuited to multiplayer. For example, time moves at different speeds depending upon what you're doing; how would this work if one player is having a battle and another is travelling or resting in a town? My apologies if you haven't played M&B and have no idea what I'm talking about, but I imagine Starfarer will ultimately function in a similar manner (and it's a damn good game too, so you should play it).

Furthermore, if you could only play the campaign layer with a friend, without battles, it would probably be more frustrating than entertaining due to the lack of meaningful (i.e. violent) interaction, and someone else mucking with your game world.

A multiplayer battle mode would be a fun addition, but I wouldn't want to see it take precious development time away from the single player game.
Logged

Alendor

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 35
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2011, 11:00:33 PM »

well, my opinnion is based of little understanding on how the campaign layer will playout.  i dunno if there will be an upper later, adn when you get in fights it goes into the mission type gameplay, or what.  i assumed that the whole game would be played out from the viewpoint of what we have to play now.  if that were the case, there wouldnt be an issue with time stopping when there is a battle. 

also, if you go a m&b approach, you don't have to stop time on the campaign layer either.  you can be in a battle while the rest of the universe is still moving around.
Logged

Flare

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 897
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2011, 03:14:02 AM »

Won't fixing the universe's temporal rate affect the depth of the game itself? For example, if Hearts of Iron only had one speed at which you can move at, I'm pretty sure a lot of the stuff in the game would have to be simplified to accommodate for such a design.

The only feasible way to retain both time frames as well as the mechanics of the game itself would be to turn the online version of the game into turn based. Other than that, one could always go for the M&B mods Persistant world, CRPG, or Stratego to implement it.
Logged
Quote from: Thana
Quote from: Alex

The battle station is not completely operational, shall we say.

"Now witness the firepower of this thoroughly buggy and unoperational batt... Oh, hell, you know what? Just ignore the battle station, okay?"

JWNoctis

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 18
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2011, 07:35:53 PM »

Tactical-level split-screen cooperative multiplayer a la Cortex Command would probably work nicely, although that did miss the point by a few metre.

Might be good to leave the compaign alone, PC-PC interaction can be quite a bit more...illogical compared to PC-NPC interaction, and illogicality doesn't make up for the immersion, which is something SP mode excels at.
Logged

powerbonger

  • Lieutenant
  • **
  • Posts: 90
    • View Profile
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2012, 05:38:53 PM »

Many pardons for the necroposting; I just like the idea of multiplayer in Starfarer :)

While a multiplayer PvP is easy to visualize, a multiplayer campaign co-op *might* work, but there'll be some concessions. I'll be operating on the assumption that the pause button will probably have to be disabled for a campaign co-op mode (or at the very least, only the "host" has the right to do so).

That being said, it might be possible if the way its set up is the host will act as the "fleet commander," moving the fleet on the campaign map and judging where to go. When in combat, however, the second player can take command of one of the fleet's ships, which will be awesomesauce. Going by Erebos' Mount and Blade example, I believe there was a mod that gives just this functionality for M&B Warband some time ago, and worked pretty well despite the mod being unfinished.

Now, this arrangement will pose some problems as well. For one, the other players might not have much to do in between battles, resulting in potential boredom - it'll have to be an exercise in patience and give-and-take between the players to maintain a game. Perhaps a drop-in, drop-out system can help with this, but it won't be a full solution. :) But just the thought of having the freedom to let your sub-commanders/other players outfit their own ships and control them in battle as you progress through the campaign sounds like a wonderful experience.
Logged

Zapier

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 213
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2012, 05:54:05 PM »

Yeah, shouldn't have been brought back, especially when a new one pops up every week as it is. Personally, I think it's been said enough... no multiplayer. Period. Not for this incarnation at least, and it was the same way with Mount&Blade. Anyone who paid for it's alpha/beta would know the same was said, suggested, asked for, etc. for Mount&Blade but thankfully the small team kept their idea on the track they wanted. They made an excellent, singleplayer experience with great modding capabilities. The game still proved to be a huge success for such a small indie team, and it was after Mount&Blade was released that a form of multiplayer was even worked on... it was easy then, because they had the successful financial backing from their original game, as well as it's contents to work from. There was less pressure because their singleplayer game was finished, so they could do that other work... as well as improving upon the singleplayer experience... which was M&B:Warband.

Also, cRPG is the popular 'progressing characters' mod for M&B by the way. It, and it's "campaign" Strategus additions have further increased its multiplayer experience for some players, but that's another game, another topic.

Basically, I think we all need to respect what Alex has stated many times and just accept that this current version will be a successful singleplayer experience. Once, Starfarer is finished, we all can then pester Alex to make Starfarer: Galactic Conflict or whatever you wish to call it and get a multiplayer version. For all we know it might be another 6-12 month wait after Starfarer, but I think it'd be worth it...
Logged

powerbonger

  • Lieutenant
  • **
  • Posts: 90
    • View Profile
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2012, 06:07:55 PM »

I apologize, I wasn't thinking when I didn't realize that there has been enough topics on this issue since before. x_x Thank you for putting that civilly. I realize that I could have been blasted pretty badly for that post; I can only imagine what happened before to make it a sensitive topic now.

I have nothing but respect for what Alex is planning for Starfarer, and indeed it is worth the wait. :)
Logged

Zapier

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 213
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Unique way of Multiplayer realization for Starfarer.
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2012, 07:19:14 PM »

Not so much a sensitive topic as just a heavily repeated one. :) No problem in suggesting it, but it's just been suggested many times is all I'm saying.
Logged