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Author Topic: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??  (Read 1988 times)

TK3600

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2024, 08:02:47 AM »

Well...
Lower case independent. It means the market is independent of player's direct control like stockpile. It does not belong to Independent faction, which is capitalized.

Besides, tariff is still going to the government. Why else is Hegemon patrol on my tail for my tariff dodge, if Hegemon dont earn the tariff?
Besides independents not actually being a single faction and just displayed that way for the sake of the game, having commerce on your colony can trigger a system bounty paid out by independents.

Nope, "Independent" is literally a faction in the game and as such "Independent" being its name transforms the word from a noun into to a pronoun, ergo the uppercase "I". If one is referencing a subject using the word as an adjective or a shorthand noun (e.g. referencing an subject or subjects in general without mentioning affiliation), then a lowercase "i" is appropriate.
Reading comprehension my friend. I know "Independents" are a faction in the game. I'm saying in-universe, they are not and are just a bunch of individual polities that somehow manage to not get subsumed by PL or heg. It's just that having like 20 extra factions to represent each planet would be really stupid so we, as players, just get them all lumped together as Independents. So this market, that isn't affiliated with anyone, would fall under the Independents, regardless of it's capitalization.
Also, independent isn't a noun in this case (independent market), it's an adjective. and Independent isn't a pronoun, it's a proper noun.
OK even if it is managed by an independent entity, it would make no sense for tariff be charged not by governement. It is how every government functions including all government in universe. Certainly, merchants themselves are not the one charging it.... The current implementation makes no logical sense. Nor does it make any sense in gameplay. Player can bypass tariff in other planets but no their own? When there are clearly smugglers visit your planet. So they can use blackmarket, just not you.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2024, 08:06:11 AM by TK3600 »
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Darloth

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2024, 11:42:10 AM »

It does make sense from a gameplay perspective, because it disincentivizes the player from taking a load of stuff out of the storage of their colony and dumping it on their own open market.

Without tariffs, you could even do this from resource stockpiles if you needed money NOW rather than at the end of the month - you could take potentially tens of thousands of resources, pay for them later, and get the money now.  (You can in fact still do this with tariffs, but you know you're taking a solid chunk as a loss later.)

If the trade price for that resource ever went even a credit above the 'nominal' price (which, admittedly, is rare for many resources - but it does sometimes happen) then this would become the optimal choice.  Pull every unit your colony can provide, and sell it back to independent traders or whoever Commerce markets represent, and you've got free money for clicking some buttons.

Narratively, tariffs make no sense, but they have a strong gameplay reason to exist as effectively a money sink to prevent players from generating money from nothing with short term economic conditions without ever stepping foot into a spaceship.  Sure, you can do it by creating a shortage and doing some black market trading or whatever in the core worlds, but now you're interacting with a lot more game systems (patrols, simulated economy, transit time, cargo space limits etc) and so it's much easier to argue that it's generating good gameplay.

Perhaps they should be reduced on player colonies, but given a different name - overhead, bureaucratic inefficiency, networking fees, whatever.
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TK3600

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2024, 01:30:22 PM »

It does make sense from a gameplay perspective, because it disincentivizes the player from taking a load of stuff out of the storage of their colony and dumping it on their own open market.

Without tariffs, you could even do this from resource stockpiles if you needed money NOW rather than at the end of the month - you could take potentially tens of thousands of resources, pay for them later, and get the money now.  (You can in fact still do this with tariffs, but you know you're taking a solid chunk as a loss later.)

If the trade price for that resource ever went even a credit above the 'nominal' price (which, admittedly, is rare for many resources - but it does sometimes happen) then this would become the optimal choice.  Pull every unit your colony can provide, and sell it back to independent traders or whoever Commerce markets represent, and you've got free money for clicking some buttons.

Narratively, tariffs make no sense, but they have a strong gameplay reason to exist as effectively a money sink to prevent players from generating money from nothing with short term economic conditions without ever stepping foot into a spaceship.  Sure, you can do it by creating a shortage and doing some black market trading or whatever in the core worlds, but now you're interacting with a lot more game systems (patrols, simulated economy, transit time, cargo space limits etc) and so it's much easier to argue that it's generating good gameplay.

Perhaps they should be reduced on player colonies, but given a different name - overhead, bureaucratic inefficiency, networking fees, whatever.
I think the issue is stockpile price... It should be local market rate. If you buy from stockpile and sell... You get nothing. This is most logical outcome IRL.
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Pizzarugi

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2024, 03:20:45 PM »

Isn't the tariff imposed by the Hegemony? During the story campaign, you speak personally with Daud and one of the questions you can ask is to have tariffs lowered.
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Phenir

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2024, 03:57:11 PM »

Isn't the tariff imposed by the Hegemony? During the story campaign, you speak personally with Daud and one of the questions you can ask is to have tariffs lowered.
You really think the persean league would allow the hegemony to tariff goods at their colonies? or the pirates? or the path?
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TK3600

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2024, 10:15:31 PM »

Always funny to see pirate charge tariff, or have blackmarket. Pirate blackmarket should be the main one, with other one be the premium market for reserved stockpile.
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Bungee_man

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #21 on: July 12, 2024, 03:08:04 AM »

Always funny to see pirate charge tariff, or have blackmarket. Pirate blackmarket should be the main one, with other one be the premium market for reserved stockpile.

In theory, you gain reputation for shopping at the main market and lose reputation for shopping at the black market, but at present I don't think I've ever lost reputation for using the pirates' black market, and the only thing a good relationship with the Path gets you is adding a faction that hates everyone to your colonies' list of potential convoy sources, which ensures constant shortages. It feels like a trap for newbies and people who accidentally click on the wrong button, at present.

Given that Free Port lets the player profit off of black market trade, it might be cool to have free ports not have separate black markets, and instead have a single market with a much smaller tariff. This would also make it clearer to the player why some colonies check for transponder status and contraband and others don't.
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Beep Boop

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #22 on: July 12, 2024, 02:32:22 PM »

More annoyingly, the entire thing trashes the F1 screen. Now the "best" buy/sell locations listed become clogged with your own colonies, except they're the worst places to do either because of that 30%.
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TK3600

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Re: Can I stop paying tariff in my own colony??
« Reply #23 on: July 12, 2024, 02:51:38 PM »

If it is OP, I am all for it rebalanced. Perhaps nerf commerce improvement from 25% buff to 15%. In exchange let us trade tariff free.

Some people raised point that president gets taxed. But government itself dont get taxed. If it does, government just get tax from left pocket to right pocket. It owns tariff anyway. President make procurement to its fleet/military all the time. No tax!
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