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Author Topic: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 323003 times)

Foraven

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1095 on: May 16, 2023, 03:02:29 PM »


- Sometimes, as their try to get closer, ships forget to raise their shields when their are getting in range of their foes longest range beams or guns.

This is probably intentional; the AI is willing to take some hits on armor for a flux advantage. At times this'll look "wrong" and like unnecessary damage, but there's basically some amount of damage it doesn't care very much about.

In one of my tests, I was testing beams on a Sunder and the "victim ship" was an Hammerhead. Several times the hammerhead would take damage at long range only to raise shields once a bit closer. It wasn't effectively saving it's flux, it was just needlessly taking hull damage. I think it did not account for the actual range the beams had (advanced optics + Integraded targeting units).   
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1096 on: May 16, 2023, 03:35:43 PM »

I have been messing around with the missile autoloader hullmod a bit but... Could it be a little bit more lenient? If you have more than 1 small missile slots more often than not chances are that you won't get a greater bang from your buck than by just picking EMR. And they cost the same.

In all honesty, that sounds like exactly where it's meant to fall, balance-wise related to EMR.

In one of my tests, I was testing beams on a Sunder and the "victim ship" was an Hammerhead. Several times the hammerhead would take damage at long range only to raise shields once a bit closer. It wasn't effectively saving it's flux, it was just needlessly taking hull damage. I think it did not account for the actual range the beams had (advanced optics + Integraded targeting units).   

They're definitely aware of the range. And the Hammerhead benefits from tanking a few hits by being able to get a little closer with its zero flux boost...
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Amoebka

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1097 on: May 16, 2023, 03:40:07 PM »

In all honesty, that sounds like exactly where it's meant to fall, balance-wise related to EMR.
It's a bit boring though. There are ships that use EMR, and ships that use autoloader. It's not a choice you make, one is always better for any given ship. Even more dull than "choosing" between hardened shields and more capacitors.

Imo it would be more fun if autoloader worked better on more ships, but the reload delay aspect got amplified. Then it would be an actual choice between extra missiles here and now; versus even more extra missiles, but over a lond period of time.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2023, 03:54:07 PM by Amoebka »
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Sly

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1098 on: May 16, 2023, 03:47:56 PM »

An addendum is that if you have one or two phase ships in your fleet, whether piloted by the player or not, the new AI behavior for clustering around one another as they "circle the wagons" cannot be underestimated for exploitation. They will voluntarily block one another's firing arcs in a large blob to better protect themselves against a phase ship.
They should only do that when there isn't much else other than phase ships nearby, though - is that not what you're seeing?

I believe it's working as intended! It's just fun to isolate a distant group like a sheep dog barking at the herd. It's very hard to do spontaneously in the middle of a big battle (needing advance scouting and planning), but I love that you created it. Watching the enemy fleet adapt to fighting primarily phase ships was a "wow, cool!" moment the first time I saw it. The change to phase combat tactics at a level below [HYPER REDACTED] is much appreciated, and I think it adds a neat tactic to the battles.

It can lead to some interesting alternate engagements early in a battle where you deploy phase ships as an advance force, during a staggered deployment, around the objective locations.

My phase ship allies, as noted by others, do sometimes make questionable decisions, unfortunately. I'm not sure what could be done to help them. I don't know much about programming AI, just the gist of weights and priorities. It seems like a challenging thing to do. A lot of phase ship combat comes down to reading the enemy and accurately predicting where to go, from where and when to fire, and how you'll escape afterward. There's a lot of nuance to consider, like enemy turret turning speed, fire rate and/or burst cooldown, your approach angle, your firing angle and position, and where you'll be shot - and by what. Because you'll almost definitely, eventually, be hit.

And of course the king of all considerations: making sure you don't overflux yourself and death spiral while surrounded by a pack of angry Hounds with Assault Chainguns. Or worse.

I'm impressed that the AI does as well as it does, all things considered.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1099 on: May 16, 2023, 03:50:27 PM »

Ah, awesome, thank you for the detail! I'm glad it's working out to be something interesting.

(Yeah, getting phase AI to the level of a human in those kinds of decisions - or anywhere close, really - would be quite the task. And I'm not sure it'd be a good thing, since at that point phase ships would probably need to be removed from the game due to how they'd be to face.)
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Doctorhealsgood

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1100 on: May 16, 2023, 05:33:32 PM »

In all honesty, that sounds like exactly where it's meant to fall, balance-wise related to EMR.
I would argue that its use cases are so narrow that it is kind of a shame. There is very little ships that i know that have 1 small missile. Two small missile ships are more common but at that point all you get is either breaking even or lesser gains compared to EMR no matter how hard you try to squeeze those reload points.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1101 on: May 16, 2023, 05:47:15 PM »

IMO it's not really about the narrowness of the use case. The point is to give an option for boosting missile ammo to ships where EMR does not make sense, OP-to-missiles-reloaded-wise, under almost any circumstances, not to boost missiles overall in cases where EMR might already make some sense.
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Brainbread

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1102 on: May 16, 2023, 06:05:34 PM »

Just a bug that caused me a couple of issues

During the Scan the Gates quest, I went to Magec and spaced the Tri-tachyon fleet that was interfering. A few of their ships got away and I let them go, but I was still being told that they were interfering with the gate. I left the system, came back. Same issue.

Later on in the campaign, after the Kanta quest line, I attempted to flee through said gate and was once again given the error that it was being interfered with. So I guess that quest flag never cleared despite being past that quest stage.
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Spaceman_Spiff

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1103 on: May 16, 2023, 06:31:00 PM »

Found a bug:

 - Remnants will occasionally have captured infrastructure in a remnant system. They can't capture it while I'm in-system, though they will swarm the infrastructure in response to my recapturing it. Conditions for this were a friendly colony with no patrol hub, and an active remnant station. Tends to happen after leaving the system for long periods of time.
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Toxcity

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1104 on: May 16, 2023, 06:41:00 PM »

Small bug:

Defective versions of a skin (such as Falcon(P)(D) ) bring up the base skins Autofit variants when you click the Autofit button.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1105 on: May 16, 2023, 06:48:58 PM »

Small bug:

Defective versions of a skin (such as Falcon(P)(D) ) bring up the base skins Autofit variants when you click the Autofit button.

(I was just looking at this, and haven't reproduced this yet; it seems to work correctly at least in the general case, hmm.)
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Foraven

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1106 on: May 16, 2023, 06:58:34 PM »

They're definitely aware of the range. And the Hammerhead benefits from tanking a few hits by being able to get a little closer with its zero flux boost...

But that's not what it was doing, it was just near the max range of my Sunder's beams. It was trying to drop flux alright, but it wasn't trying to rush forward. It just not registring it was still in range of the beams. That hammerhead was destroyed after a few pass without doing any real damage.
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Zaizai

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1107 on: May 16, 2023, 06:59:19 PM »

I have a suggestion for a new energy focused hullmod: beam weapons equipped in bigger mounts get their damage scaled up(as well as flux cost) as more energy would be supplied to them. 
This opens up to some interesting builds, for example a more support oriented sunder could equip a graviton beam in its large slot and have it count as 3 gravitons with that hullmod, or you could equip some tactical lasers on the medium slots of an executor, and rely on your ballistic mounts for shield damage, while shifting the focus of your mediums to a more generalistic role. 
If you go for a beam build, There's very little choice, I think this hullmod could alleviate that a bit by giving more freedom to try different builds instead of the "small=tac, medium=grav, big=HIL/Tachyon".


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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1108 on: May 16, 2023, 07:03:25 PM »

But that's not what it was doing, it was just near the max range of my Sunder's beams. It was trying to drop flux alright, but it wasn't trying to rush forward. It just not registring it was still in range of the beams. That hammerhead was destroyed after a few pass without doing any real damage.

Hmm. Is there a simulator setup where this happens reasonably consistently that I might be able to take a look at?
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Sts678

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Re: Starsector 0.96a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1109 on: May 16, 2023, 07:35:13 PM »

Hello Alex. I meet a strange thing, which is probably a bug?
When I am exploring the lost colony of Hegemony and salvaging the drone battleships around the fringe jump point, I recover a crew and some luxuries from these automatic ships. I am not sure whether it is a bug.  Or maybe it is your setting?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2023, 07:44:04 PM by Sts678 »
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