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Total Members Voted: 128

[Erick Doe]

Hey Erick, while you're here, I don't suppose I can get an update on whether or not we can get an Antediluvian station, so we can play as the faction?

I'd love to take on Corvus with those speedy, hardy ships.

Well. I suppose the war would ultimately wear down the Antediluvians, as natural metals mined from the planet's submerged surface would become scarce. A lack of materials might force them to sell off their designs for credits, which in turn would allow them to purchase raw materials to produce additional ships. This would justify them selling their tech at an orbital station.

I will have to create supply fleets. And spawn a station near Atlantis.

Next release will have an orbital station. Prices of ships and weapons will be high though.

[Shoat]

What was the range on the guns you were using?

I had reduced a lot of the sonic weapon's stats in an effort to balance them with vanilla. But I think I'll have to increase the range of those weapons again. They were, after all, intended as the Antediluvian's long-range weapon. The damage will go down a little though. Furthermore, the "ghostships" will get an upgrade in armour and integrity.

Also, an increase in minimum crew, to make them harder to capture. And a decrease in cost. After all, they can't be bought anywhere. This will make it less profitable to capture and sell them.

They were 1500 (+200 from Optics hullmod) so they were quite high range, but any ~1000 range weapon could do the same.

If I remember correctly, the sonic weapons have only 600-ish range, which is just not enough (that short range is fitting for the plethora of small rapid-fire weapons, but not so much for these).

It'd probably be enough to double their range and compensate by reducing damage&flux for the medium one and rate of fire for the large one (so the medium one feels more like constant shelling at long range and the large one more like a capital ship's main gun).

[Uomoz]

1200 range weapons should be a specialized or high-tech exception not a rule. Look at vanilla range values.

[Erick Doe]

1200 range weapons should be a specialized or high-tech exception not a rule. Look at vanilla range values.

I agree. And any ship fitting a weapon like that should probably be classified a cruiser, not a destroyer. Remember, classifications do not equal ship size. A destroyer could be ten times larger than a cruiser. But a ship yielding superior weaponry should be of a higher classification, regardless of size.

I don't know what mod is giving access to 1500 range weapons, but it is obviously overpowered if you can use it on a faster ship, to stay of range and easily pick off a heavier ship. Sure, I could add greater range to Antediluvian weapons, but that would screw up balance, and result in a weapons build up between factions, which we don't need.

[Erick Doe]

Let me put it this way. Classification should not be up to the modmaker conserning his mod (if they are to be vanilla balanced). Heck, I could create a "frigate" that is on par with a Hegemony "Capital Ship".

Instead, classifications are universal.

[arcibalde]

It's my weapon       And i think your right, ill reduce it to range of 900. Unfortunately i got little feedback so i didn't know its too op...

[hadesian]

Let me put it this way. Classification should not be up to the modmaker conserning his mod (if they are to be vanilla balanced). Heck, I could create a "frigate" that is on par with a Hegemony "Capital Ship".

Instead, classifications are universal.

Like the little Scarab from Starfarer Extended, running about with it's large ballistic slot?

[IIE16 Yoshi]

Let me put it this way. Classification should not be up to the modmaker conserning his mod (if they are to be vanilla balanced). Heck, I could create a "frigate" that is on par with a Hegemony "Capital Ship".

Instead, classifications are universal.

Like the little Scarab from Starfarer Extended, running about with it's large ballistic slot?

That thing. 
First time loading up Omega's Minimash, bump heads with one of those ships in a Lasher, get all high and mighty because it's one on one and it looks flimsy. Suddenly, NOPE'd by a crazy frigate gunboat with an Autopulse Laser. That showed me. 

And I play with the DSTech mod installed, vanilla balance goes out the window. The Judgement destroyer in it's 'Anti-Capital' loadout uses a weapon not unlike the Tachyon Lance, except it does more damage over time, shoots faster, has 8000 range instead of 5000, and the Judgement itself moves at around 150-200 or so, even while firing, so even as the long-range sniper that it is, it never has to worry about being harassed. Even if it is attacked, it can just turn it's sniper beam on the harasser. Luv me DSTech ships.

[NikolaiLev]

I have to echo the ease at which ghost fleets are decimated, even with a meager fleet and some careful tactics.  I've done this with both JP and IF fleets.  They ought to be much mightier across the board, since they lose their advantage of mobility the antediluvian ships have.

Don't forget about what torpedoes can do to these poor, unshielded ships, since that's that primarily makes the ghost capital ship so vulnerable.  All that pd in the world won't save it if it's being distracted successfully.

[Erick Doe]

You are right. The "ghost" ships are fairly slow. The debris is not as effective an escort as normal Antediluvian frigates, since they don't have the speed to swarm an enemy. I will up their stats a fair bit for next release. They will also be harder to capture.

Still, they will never hold up against a decent sized and well outfitted fleet. The great threat here is that they can sneak up on you, since they are hard to spot on the map (and on the main screen as well, though Uomoz's Corvus uses a lighter background, resulting in making these "ghost" fleets easier to spot).

[NikolaiLev]

You are right. The "ghost" ships are fairly slow. The debris is not as effective an escort as normal Antediluvian frigates, since they don't have the speed to swarm an enemy. I will up their stats a fair bit for next release. They will also be harder to capture.

Still, they will never hold up against a decent sized and well outfitted fleet. The great threat here is that they can sneak up on you, since they are hard to spot on the map (and on the main screen as well, though Uomoz's Corvus uses a lighter background, resulting in making these "ghost" fleets easier to spot).

Just wait until we can have cloaking and stuff.  That oughta do it. 

[IIE16 Yoshi]

http://puu.sh/zJus

Not sure what that Antediluvian did to invoke such wrath from the pirates, but it was hella funny watching them chase him around the system.

[Erick Doe]

That's quite a force chasing them! 


Updated OP.

[Shoat]

1200 range weapons should be a specialized or high-tech exception not a rule. Look at vanilla range values.

My point was that there are already two 1000-range medium weapons in the vanilla game and that a quick destroyer (or maybe even a frigate) with those is enough to take down the ghost ship, which has no way at all to defend itself against that.

I mean, if the ghost ship is player-piloted that is no problem because you can easily switch it's weapons to ones with better range and/or put on advanced optics and integrated targeting (and you have decent escorts to deal with fast ships), but the standard variant is just not much of a threat to players because it is unshielded, slow and has only short range weaponry.

[Erick Doe]

I'm addressing the issue by giving sonic weapons a longer range. Torpedoes will also get a slight range increase. Don't want to overdo it though. Range is sometimes all someone has against the fast Antediluvians, who are lethal up close.

On a side note, I'm also removing the 'basic' variants. These were really just placeholders, equipped with vanilla weapons, untill the Antediluvian weapons were done.