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Author Topic: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.3.2 - more apocalyptic settings  (Read 150951 times)

Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.95a] Starpocalypse 1.4.0 - fortresses and regulations
« Reply #75 on: December 16, 2021, 06:07:33 AM »

I don't think Yunru meant this in a bad way, we have an ongoing joke on Discord (type !reading) as people keep on asking things that has been (often minutes before) talked about. Just like your question (25 minutes after I elaborated how it is, and always will be, save game compatible).

Anyway, stay tuned for 2.0.0 release later this week!
« Last Edit: December 16, 2021, 02:41:29 PM by Jaghaimo »
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EmperorOfMankind

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Re: [0.95a] Starpocalypse 1.4.0 - fortresses and regulations
« Reply #76 on: December 16, 2021, 07:11:46 AM »

I don't think Yunru meant this in a bad way, we have an ongoing joke on Discord (type !reading) as people keep on asking things that has been (often minutes before) talked about. Just like your question (25 minutes after I elaborated how it is, and always will be, save game compatible.

Anyway, stay tuned for 2.0.0 release later today!

My bad. As Im not aquated with the discord it sounded like open hostility for no reason. Thank you for clearing this up and answering my question.  ;D
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Yunru

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Re: [0.95a] Starpocalypse 1.4.0 - fortresses and regulations
« Reply #77 on: December 16, 2021, 08:35:41 AM »

Is it save game compatable?
Reading is an essential skill for anyone wishing to use the Internet. It can therefore be assumed that you know how to read. Which begs the question why you are not doing so.

You took time to post all that when you could just say Yes or no  ;D I posted it bc apparently Im blind and didnt see if it said it or not. Sorry if its too much of an inconvenience for you to just say yes or no our grand overlord.
Your prostration and acknowledgement of our true rank has been noted. Come the cleansing, you shall be spared.

Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #78 on: December 17, 2021, 09:45:46 AM »

New release is out. Some balancing and more changes to ruin your day. Enjoy!~

Quote from: Changelog
- Decrease quality of core world ships by taking away special goodies (e.g. nanoforges, synchrotrons).
- Add marines and special items (like hull modspecs) to military regulations and contraband.
- Remove independents (faction) from military regulations.
- Remove Black Market (submarket) from military regulations.
- Disable ability to trade on Black Market if the transponder is on (only for factions with military regulations enabled).
- Damage starting fleet members on new game.
- Reduce amount of logging that happens.
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A_Random_Dude

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #79 on: December 17, 2021, 10:53:48 AM »

Hum... Interesting, but what does that "Reduce amount of logging that happens" mean? The mod prevents us from quick-loading?
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #80 on: December 17, 2021, 11:09:20 AM »

Previous versions would spam messages in the log file. Technical change if anything.
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SpaceDrake

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #81 on: December 17, 2021, 07:40:32 PM »

Hmm, I'm not nearly as big a fan of the nanoforge thing. Like, it's a significant part of the setting that a few polities have access to the substantially better manufacturing standards than the rest of the sector, and their ships reflect this. It's been two hundred years of struggle for the sector to get even where it is, and more importantly, this makes potential enemies of the player weaker because now they'll be d-modded. I get the idea is "make it harder for the player to get pristine stuff quickly", but this approach has a lot of rippling changes throughout the entire game. Now, you've made it toggleable, which is good! But I think a lot of people are likely to turn it off.

That being said, in general I like the general thrust of this mod. It always felt a little odd that Mark IX Autocannons and whatnot were something you could fly up and buy, or occasionally you'd even find A Whole Ass Capital Ship for sale on the open market. The Sector might be a little wild up in space, but that always felt a bit off, so I especially appreciate the market adjustment module and the way it works.

I did want to echo previous feedback that I do think it would make sense for certain point-defense guns to be allowed under the regulations, though. Like autocannons and missile launchers being controlled, sure, that's understandable, but I could absolutely see things like light machine guns or vulcans being allowed for sale for merchant captains. Currently, you can buy a ship hull on the open market but can't even necessarily arm it, and with the current state of the Sector, that feels... a little strict, even for the Hegemony, in-universe. I think they'd allow for "defensive" weapons to be sold (since these aren't really that useful in a true military sense and only mad pirates and luddics try to use them on warships against other warships), though I can also see how the implementation of this could be a pain.

There's also a bit of a funny interaction with what ships are allowed, because the ship screening module appears to be filtering ships by looking for the civ-grade hull mod, rather than the CIVILIAN tag in the ship data. This isn't too bad for vanilla ships, but creates a bit of oddness with some mods; Diable is the big example. Part of Diable's gimmick is that, as part of their plan to compete with their rivals and win over spacers in their quest to "reclaim" the Sector, their "civilian" ships are technically military-grade. Their "big" freighter is a decommissioned cruiser with the scarier bits ripped out for cargo space, but it's still got that military drive train and hull in-lore, for example; their smaller support ships are also designed to be mil-spec but not actually a military threat, and thus something you could sell to people outside of Diable control without too much worry. So they're largely intended for export and should be available on the Diable open markets, but because of how the filter works, their open markets are currently entirely empty and you need a Diable commission to get their support ships, which isn't (as far as I can tell) how it's supposed to work in-universe.

So, I think if the regulatory routine got a bit of a rewrite to filter by the CIVILIAN tag in ship_data, rather than looking for the hullmod, that would help with the verisimilitude a bit and help support mods that get a bit creative with the interpretation of what a "civilian" ship is.

Still, a really great mod, and thank you for putting it together!
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IonDragonX

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #82 on: December 17, 2021, 08:03:24 PM »

Is it possible to make whitelists & blacklists for the Market, Military Market and Black Market?
I'd like to buy Mining lasers & Mining Blaster in most Markets, Machine Guns in most Military Markets and Harpoons in most Black Markets.
Some mods add weapons that I disagree with and would like to blacklist from markets in general.
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starman13

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #83 on: December 17, 2021, 10:42:33 PM »

Is it possible to make whitelists & blacklists for the Market, Military Market and Black Market?
I'd like to buy Mining lasers & Mining Blaster in most Markets, Machine Guns in most Military Markets and Harpoons in most Black Markets.
Some mods add weapons that I disagree with and would like to blacklist from markets in general.

I hacked together a quick edit that allows a whitelist and blacklist of items and ships. I made it so that point defense weapons and combat freighters like Cerberus are not considered contraband. I could submit it for review if Jaghaimo is amenable.

BTW in the 2.0 version the contraband in the black market no longer seem to be limited by market stability. Is that what this means "Remove Black Market (submarket) from military regulations."? It's harder to access the black market now, but if I go in dark and access the black market it seems to have a full range of weapons and ships even in stability 10 markets where in 1.4 the black market had no contraband under those conditions.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2021, 11:28:29 PM by starman13 »
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SpaceDrake

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #84 on: December 17, 2021, 11:36:35 PM »

It's behaving like the vanilla black market (where it has a lot of equipment/stuff available even at Stab10), so I would assume that's the idea, yes. Getting to a lot of polities, especially in the otherwise vanilla game (and with everywhere having patrol HQs now) completely undetected can be quite a challenge, so I assume that's the entire idea of the trade-off. It also makes free ports quite a bit more attractive since it's a lot easier to just cruise on in to one with your transponder off.

Funnily enough, I actually reverted the change to independents being exempt on my end, since I run a decent few mods with well-developed independent markets (Arma, Tahlan Shipworks, etc) so it made sense for them to still behave like highly regulated polities.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2021, 12:26:12 AM by SpaceDrake »
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Oni

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #85 on: December 18, 2021, 01:11:14 AM »

Can't say I'm too much of a fan of the "Shy Black Market" function.

Doesn't completely removing the ability to access the black market with your transponder on make the 'suspicion' mechanic useless?

I can understand making it with your transponder off giving you a better selection along with not accruing suspicion, but removing it completely seems like taking out a relatively important part of trading (ie balancing your BM trades with your legit ones to maximize profit while avoiding suspicion).
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #86 on: December 18, 2021, 01:41:44 AM »

Wow, it's been a while since I had so much feedback after one release. Something to note though - Starpocalypse is a meme mod, or at least started as one. All.of it features are low hanging fruits, or are implemented in a cheaty way.

Having said that, seeing that the mod is slowly getting a loyal fan base, I will be improving certain aspects of it.

Quote
Doesn't completely removing the ability to access the black market with your transponder on make the 'suspicion' mechanic useless?

Shy Black Market will be changed, you will be able to access it with transponder on, but items and ships that fall under military regulations will be illegal. This is a buff from previous behaviour where they were straight up removed or moved to military market. It is possible to revert this (even now) by disabling shy market in settings and adding back black market to csv.

Quote
I hacked together a quick edit that allows a whitelist and blacklist of items and ships. I made it so that point defense weapons and combat freighters like Cerberus are not considered contraband. I could submit it for review if Jaghaimo is amenable.

Yes please, open a PR against my repo.

Quote
BTW in the 2.0 version the contraband in the black market no longer seem to be limited by market stability. Is that what this means "Remove Black Market (submarket) from military regulations."?

Correct.

Quote
Hmm, I'm not nearly as big a fan of the nanoforge thing. Like, it's a significant part of the setting that a few polities have access to the substantially better manufacturing standards than the rest of the sector, and their ships reflect this.

Happy to reimplement this. One thing I was thinking about was replacing pristine with corrupted, or just giving corrupted to other factions, or just removing all but giving a nano forge like bonus anyway (maybe smaller).

Quote
I did want to echo previous feedback that I do think it would make sense for certain point-defense guns to be allowed under the regulations, though.

I'll make an option to allow that (on by default).

Quote
So, I think if the regulatory routine got a bit of a rewrite to filter by the CIVILIAN tag in ship_data, rather than looking for the hullmod, that would help with the verisimilitude a bit and help support mods that get a bit creative with the interpretation of what a "civilian" ship is.

Last time I checked, vanilla had hullmods and no tags. Will have to look into it again, perhaps a mix of tag, civ hull mod, and no mil systems is the way to go.
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Oni

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #87 on: December 18, 2021, 02:22:59 AM »

....
Quote
Doesn't completely removing the ability to access the black market with your transponder on make the 'suspicion' mechanic useless?

Shy Black Market will be changed, you will be able to access it with transponder on, but items and ships that fall under military regulations will be illegal. This is a buff from previous behaviour where they were straight up removed or moved to military market. It is possible to revert this (even now) by disabling shy market in settings and adding back black market to csv.
...
Oh I know, I'd already noticed it in the settings and having options is always good, but since it was active "by default" I considered it a function of the mod "as intended" so to speak.  8)

One thing you could do, if you had intended to keep it inaccessible I mean, was perhaps make some bar encounters regarding it. Say overhearing some smugglers or paying off a pirate (cost depending on rep with them) gives you access to the BM regardless of transponder state for a week (it would then "change location" and you'd have to find it again).
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starman13

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #88 on: December 18, 2021, 03:56:30 AM »

Quote
Yes please, open a PR against my repo.

Done.

Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.95.1a] Starpocalypse 2.0.0 - more apocalyptic settings
« Reply #89 on: December 18, 2021, 05:23:48 AM »

Thanks man13, you're a star.

I'll merge your changes to a branch tonight, and weave it into a release next week.
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