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[boggled]

Hmm, you're right that it's a little weird that there's basically no requirements to improve organics and volatiles. Do you have any ideas regarding what requirements I could add for those projects? What about that the mining industry is required on the planet?

I saw something in the configs called planet cracking that improves ore deposits and gives you a tectonic activity modifier as a downside, which actually makes a lot of sense because you're increasing the accessbility of existing deposits and not just introducing new mass so it's logical and somewhat balanced. You could let this apply to organics and volatile deposits because they'd both be underground like ores.

I also noticed I was able to create volatiles deposits out of thin air on markets that previously had no volatiles deposits, which didn't make much sense logic or balance wise. Making the planet cracking improvements only apply to existing resource deposits would be good as well.

Going with this idea would probably remove resource improvement from the terraforming menu entirely in favor of the building on an orbiting station, or vice versa. It's just a spitball, as I don't know how well this would work cause I haven't tried planet cracking ingame in it's current state. I only just found out about it through the config because it's disabled ingame by default.

You would need to edit the source code to remove just those two projects. However, you can always just not use them if you don't want to bother with that.

Yeah maybe I should just have a little self control lmao, cause I can't code for the life of me and I'll probably break something deleting stuff

I'm not sure something like planet cracking would be a good solution for organics and volatiles. Planet cracking adds a permanent negative condition on the market which I don't want to do for organics and volatiles.

I'm leaning towards adding a credit and/or resource cost for those projects, and maybe for a few other projects as well.

[jvaler]

I'm not sure something like planet cracking would be a good solution for organics and volatiles. Planet cracking adds a permanent negative condition on the market which I don't want to do for organics and volatiles.

I'm leaning towards adding a credit and/or resource cost for those projects, and maybe for a few other projects as well.

Organics and volatiles are much more valuable resources than ores, hence why organics are only found on rare habitable worlds and volatiles on high hazard worlds like gas giants and cryovolcanic worlds. This prioritization seems backwards, but it's your decision to make.

[[REDACTED]]

Hmm, you're right that it's a little weird that there's basically no requirements to improve organics and volatiles. Do you have any ideas regarding what requirements I could add for those projects? What about that the mining industry is required on the planet?

I saw something in the configs called planet cracking that improves ore deposits and gives you a tectonic activity modifier as a downside, which actually makes a lot of sense because you're increasing the accessbility of existing deposits and not just introducing new mass so it's logical and somewhat balanced. You could let this apply to organics and volatile deposits because they'd both be underground like ores.

I also noticed I was able to create volatiles deposits out of thin air on markets that previously had no volatiles deposits, which didn't make much sense logic or balance wise. Making the planet cracking improvements only apply to existing resource deposits would be good as well.

Going with this idea would probably remove resource improvement from the terraforming menu entirely in favor of the building on an orbiting station, or vice versa. It's just a spitball, as I don't know how well this would work cause I haven't tried planet cracking ingame in it's current state. I only just found out about it through the config because it's disabled ingame by default.

You would need to edit the source code to remove just those two projects. However, you can always just not use them if you don't want to bother with that.

Yeah maybe I should just have a little self control lmao, cause I can't code for the life of me and I'll probably break something deleting stuff

I'm not sure something like planet cracking would be a good solution for organics and volatiles. Planet cracking adds a permanent negative condition on the market which I don't want to do for organics and volatiles.

I'm leaning towards adding a credit and/or resource cost for those projects, and maybe for a few other projects as well.

Idea: instead of terraforming to add deposits of organics and volatiles, what about special industries that directly make them without deposits but requiring an input, such as transplutonics for volatiles and organics for themselves?

[[REDACTED]]

I'm not sure something like planet cracking would be a good solution for organics and volatiles. Planet cracking adds a permanent negative condition on the market which I don't want to do for organics and volatiles.

I'm leaning towards adding a credit and/or resource cost for those projects, and maybe for a few other projects as well.

Organics and volatiles are much more valuable resources than ores, hence why organics are only found on rare habitable worlds and volatiles on high hazard worlds like gas giants and cryovolcanic worlds. This prioritization seems backwards, but it's your decision to make.

Sure, but when you're terraforming a planet to be habitable, why shouldnt you then also have a source of organics on that planet? After all, chemistry doesnt particularly care if the carbon based chemical came from corn or coal as long as as the compound is the same either way. As for volatiles, realistically they should also be on any planet with water or ice since some fraction of naturally occurring H2O has deuterium in place of one or both hydrogen atoms, even if for balance most would have fairly poor deposits of volatiles the game is interested in.

[jvaler]

Sure, but when you're terraforming a planet to be habitable, why shouldnt you then also have a source of organics on that planet? After all, chemistry doesnt particularly care if the carbon based chemical came from corn or coal as long as as the compound is the same either way. As for volatiles, realistically they should also be on any planet with water or ice since some fraction of naturally occurring H2O has deuterium in place of one or both hydrogen atoms, even if for balance most would have fairly poor deposits of volatiles the game is interested in.

Only having surface access to organic material (because it's freshly terraformed) would be a lot sparser than being able to access xyz years of carbon cycle matter below the surface. Which is again why I think planet cracking would be a good idea for this.

[e]

hence why organics are only found on rare habitable worlds

Organics are supposed to be more plentiful in toxic worlds, worlds like Salamanca are sought after for their organics extraction.

[YourLocalMairaaboo]

hence why organics are only found on rare habitable worlds

Organics are supposed to be more plentiful in toxic worlds, worlds like Salamanca are sought after for their organics extraction.

They occasionally exist in large quantities in toxic worlds, but this is the exception, not the rule.
The main source is habitable worlds, like how the hegemony gets the bulk of theirs from Jangala's Xenolife.
I always saw organics terraforming as you injecting some compounds into biological matter deposits to accelarate the formation of oil and coal, or stuff like that.

[e]

hence why organics are only found on rare habitable worlds

Organics are supposed to be more plentiful in toxic worlds, worlds like Salamanca are sought after for their organics extraction.

They occasionally exist in large quantities in toxic worlds, but this is the exception, not the rule.
The main source is habitable worlds, like how the hegemony gets the bulk of theirs from Jangala's Xenolife.
I always saw organics terraforming as you injecting some compounds into biological matter deposits to accelarate the formation of oil and coal, or stuff like that.

Still, there seems to be a correlation (at least in vanilla core worlds, not considering randomly generated worlds) between availability of organics and the danger it presents. Jangala and Salamanca are the two bigger sources of the resource and both of these present a type of additional hazard, Salamanca being obvious and Jangala while being habitable, it is hardly a safe place to be given it's conditions and xenolife.

Meanwhile, the tamer worlds, like Gilead, Tartessus or Volturn, they have a not insignificantly lower production of organics, maybe due to climate (colder worlds like Eochu Bres barely has any organics at all) or maybe because their focus is on food production. Random worlds don't seem to follow these conditions, so it is possible that plentiful organics can just grow on any habitable planet consequence-free, but the core worlds at least seem to indicate that max organic production come with an inherit risk.

[Brob]

Hey boggled,

Is there any chance that you could add a disabled by default option for "unrealistic stellar reflector arrays" that does suppress extreme hot and extreme cold conditions for those who want it?

Much Thanks,
Brob

PS> Thank you for making the mod 

[boggled]

Hey boggled,

Is there any chance that you could add a disabled by default option for "unrealistic stellar reflector arrays" that does suppress extreme hot and extreme cold conditions for those who want it?

Much Thanks,
Brob

PS> Thank you for making the mod 

Yeah, this should be easy to add.

I'm glad you're enjoying the mod!

[jvaler]

[REDACTED], I looked ingame and every organics tooltip references it as an underground resource.

[[REDACTED]]

[REDACTED], I looked ingame and every organics tooltip references it as an underground resource.

Oragnics: "Bulk complex carbon-based molecules and derivatives thereof with applications in plastics, fuels, solvents, polymers, food products, biotech, life support, and a vast array of other necessities."
At best you're exaggerating, but Im inclined to assume you're intentionally lying since the literal tool tip for the item itself is the most obvious thing to check first, of course, the tool tips for (trace)organic deposits and mining, as well as the fact it's mining that produces them all imply they are an underground resource, but none outright state it. And of course, absolutely none of this in any way refutes my point that you could have farms for producing organic material for the applications described in the literal description of organics them selves.

Addition: After having terraformed a planet, the implied form of deposit seems to vary by tier of deposit, 2 of them IIRC implying oil, which planet cracking would not be a good tool for obtaining, and thinking about it, planet cracking wouldnt be good for obtaining coal or any other form of organic deposit since logically violently breaking open a planet would produce a lot of heat, which could ignite the very resource you're trying to obtain. With this in mind, making organics deposits should be limited to low quality deposits(if remaining possible at all), and the main means for obtaining organics from terraformed planets should probably be farming instead using a high initial investment industry.

Hey boggled,

Is there any chance that you could add a disabled by default option for "unrealistic stellar reflector arrays" that does suppress extreme hot and extreme cold conditions for those who want it?

Much Thanks,
Brob

PS> Thank you for making the mod 

Nothing unrealistic about such an option.

[jvaler]

I don't know why you think I'm being malicious or lying. Not trying to be hostile.

there's meant to be a screenshot here i don't know why it won't load (https://imgur.com/a/r2X1tpF) (https://imgur.com/a/tcvQVMS)



Below the surface, through the surface.

[Ivan Fullbright]

Getting a couple different crashes, figured I'd ask about it here.

First, happens whenever I try to create a mining station:

Spoiler

93743 [Thread-4] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain  - java.lang.NullPointerException
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.ô00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignState.showInteractionDialog(Unknown Source)
   at data.campaign.econ.boggledTools.createMiningStationMarket(boggledTools.java:3185)
   at data.campaign.econ.abilities.Construct_Mining_Station.activateImpl(Construct_Mining_Station.java:72)
   at com.fs.starfarer.api.impl.campaign.abilities.BaseDurationAbility.activate(BaseDurationAbility.java:220)
   at com.fs.starfarer.api.impl.campaign.abilities.BaseDurationAbility.pressButton(BaseDurationAbility.java:187)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.newui.G.actionPerformed(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.o0O0.buttonPressed(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.oooOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.Ò00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.oooOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.processInput(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.W.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.BaseGameState.traverse(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.state.AppDriver.begin(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain.main(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745)

[close]

It would have been my first colony, so thought that might be the issue. Tried colonizing nearby, went fine, but trying to interact with the new colony after leaving for the first time gave this crash:

Spoiler

78055 [Thread-4] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain  - java.lang.NullPointerException
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.ô00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignState.startEncounterInvolvingPlayerFleet(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.BaseLocation.advance(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.StarSystem.advance(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignEngine.advance(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignState.advance(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.BaseGameState.traverse(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.state.AppDriver.begin(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain.main(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745)
78501 [Thread-10] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.D.return  -
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.ô00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.Õ00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.Ò00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745)
79002 [Thread-10] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.D.return  -
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.ô00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.Õ00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.Ò00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745)
79505 [Thread-10] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.D.return  -
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.ô00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.class.Õ00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return.Ò00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.D.return$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745)

[close]

Any ideas? I'm not running any other major mods.

Edit: Crashes originally occurred on 8.3.2 version, but I was able to reproduce them after updating to 8.4.4. Also cross-posted to the bug reports modded subforum on the advice of someone smarter than me

[Godofchaos]

Hello i have a crash when installing a stellar mirror array on a irradied world :

1974082 [Thread-3] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain  - java.lang.NullPointerException
java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.ui._.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.m.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.n.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.ui.MarketConditionsWidget.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.ui.float.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.ui.class.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.newui.o0OO.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.public.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.newui.L.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.public.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.newui.do.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.newui.classsuper.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.interfacenew.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thissuper.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignState.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.BaseGameState.traverse(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.state.AppDriver.begin(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain.main(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher$1.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Unknown Source)