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[Megas]

True that some useful ships from factions of interest are locked behind a commision, can't find an independent world that sells stuff like Scarabs and Medusa's often (I have to do commisions, but don't want to make an enemy out of Hegemony, they're your early buddies)

Scarab is a Tri-Tachyon exclusive ship that no one else sells, at least in 0.72.  Although even if you are commissioned, it is as rare as Hyperion, which is so rare that your best bet to get one is to fight a fleet and recover the ships.

Medusa is not too rare, and can be found at various Black Markets if you lack commission.

[adimetro00]

I need to ask something.
Would the autorefit put other weapons other fleet's ships if there's no stock for the original weapon?
And can variants be randomized in vanilla?

[Alex]

@Voyager I: Thanks! Made a few notes.

Would the autorefit put other weapons other fleet's ships if there's no stock for the original weapon?

Autofit will use other weapons, yeah, trying to pick the most similar ones available. It will take weapons from cargo, but not from your other ships.

And can variants be randomized in vanilla?

I'm not sure exactly what you mean, but I'm pretty sure the answer is "no" in any case

[Deshara]

@Voyager I: Thanks! Made a few notes.

Would the autorefit put other weapons other fleet's ships if there's no stock for the original weapon?

Autofit will use other weapons, yeah, trying to pick the most similar ones available. It will take weapons from cargo, but not from your other ships.

If you give two ships "strip" permissions, will they?

[Sy]

If you give two ships "strip" permissions, will they?

the "strip before autofit" only applies during that autofit, and only to the ship being autofitted. as in, it will try to match the goal variant as closely as possible, even removing weapons or hullmods that were already installed, if those are not part of the goal variant. with that option disabled, it will keep what's already there, and try to build around it. so basically disable that if you want autofit to just 'fill in the gaps' rather than build an entire loadout from scratch.

it does not strip other ships, taking their stuff to get closer to the specified goal variant of whichever ship you're currently autofitting.

[TMPhoenix]

Loving the changes in 0.8a so far.

After doing my civic duty helping out during a battle I noticed that my fleet had last some crew even though none of my ships had been destroyed or even damaged, since most of the battle was already over before I reached the main battle. It seems that if one of allied fleets loses crew/ships you pay the price.

Also when reading the codex I occasionally notice a block pattern glitching through the text for a fraction of a second or is this just an issue with the tri-pad?

[Deshara]

I just figured if you have two ships set to "strip" before refitting, and those two *** autofitted at the same time, they could both (instantly and invisibly to the player) strip, dump their weapons into cargo & then reassemble themselves from the shared pool. So if one ship autofits a pair of hammers because it can't get the harpoons it wants, and then you pick up a ship covered in harpoons that you switch to a template that wants torpedoes, they won't be gridlocked forever without player intervention. In my head it sounds like it wouldn't have to take too much effort to make work, but then I don't java so clearly I am the best authority on this and Alex should definitely do everything I think of

[Sy]

After doing my civic duty helping out during a battle I noticed that my fleet had last some crew even though none of my ships had been destroyed or even damaged, since most of the battle was already over before I reached the main battle. It seems that if one of allied fleets loses crew/ships you pay the price.

that doesn't seem quite right.. are you sure you didn't just lose a few fighter pilots in the short skirmish?

I just figured if you have two ships set to "strip" before refitting, and those two *** autofitted at the same time, they could both (instantly and invisibly to the player) strip, dump their weapons into cargo & then reassemble themselves from the shared pool. So if one ship autofits a pair of hammers because it can't get the harpoons it wants, and then you pick up a ship covered in harpoons that you switch to a template that wants torpedoes, they won't be gridlocked forever without player intervention. In my head it sounds like it wouldn't have to take too much effort to make work, but then I don't java so clearly I am the best authority on this and Alex should definitely do everything I think of

that sounds like a terrible idea to me, to be perfectly honest... and not because of how it would need to be coded. ^^

what you're describing would need an entirely new settings thing, because the current autofit options all only apply during autofit of that ship, they aren't saved seperately for each individual ship (as that wouldn't really make sense with their current functions). and then it still needs "player intervention" anyway because you need to specifically enable it for those ships that you know have weapons that another ship would need -- because if you enable it for all ships, you're constantly gonna end up with half-finished or unnecessarily frankensteiny loadouts as each ship tries to take stuff from the others.

the only case where this would work without issues is if two or more ships have exactly the weapons another ship needs, and those weapons are exactly the ones that each ship which currently has them doesn't need, and both of these conditions apply for every single one of the ships involved, perfectly mirroring each other... which is virtually never gonna happen in any not-super-tiny fleet, and those super-tiny fleets are already the ones where any reduction of necessary micromanagement is needed the least anyway.

in short: no.

[Deshara]

After doing my civic duty helping out during a battle I noticed that my fleet had last some crew even though none of my ships had been destroyed or even damaged, since most of the battle was already over before I reached the main battle. It seems that if one of allied fleets loses crew/ships you pay the price.

that doesn't seem quite right.. are you sure you didn't just lose a few fighter pilots in the short skirmish?

I just figured if you have two ships set to "strip" before refitting, and those two *** autofitted at the same time, they could both (instantly and invisibly to the player) strip, dump their weapons into cargo & then reassemble themselves from the shared pool. So if one ship autofits a pair of hammers because it can't get the harpoons it wants, and then you pick up a ship covered in harpoons that you switch to a template that wants torpedoes, they won't be gridlocked forever without player intervention. In my head it sounds like it wouldn't have to take too much effort to make work, but then I don't java so clearly I am the best authority on this and Alex should definitely do everything I think of

that sounds like a terrible idea to me, to be perfectly honest... and not because of how it would need to be coded. ^^

what you're describing would need an entirely new settings thing, because the current autofit options all only apply during autofit of that ship, they aren't saved seperately for each individual ship (as that wouldn't really make sense with their current functions). and then it still needs "player intervention" anyway because you need to specifically enable it for those ships that you know have weapons that another ship would need -- because if you enable it for all ships, you're constantly gonna end up with half-finished or unnecessarily frankensteiny loadouts as each ship tries to take stuff from the others.

the only case where this would work without issues is if two or more ships have exactly the weapons another ship needs, and those weapons are exactly the ones that each ship which currently has them doesn't need, and both of these conditions apply for every single one of the ships involved, perfectly mirroring each other... which is virtually never gonna happen in any not-super-tiny fleet, and those super-tiny fleets are already the ones where any reduction of necessary micromanagement is needed the least anyway.

in short: no.

I had actually thought that's exactly what "strip" did, so that if another ship needed the exact weapon that one ship had and that weapon wasn't even the weapon that ship wanted it'd let the other ship pull off it lol 

[SCC]

I'd say that this would be a terrible idea, since you'd have to go through ships from which weapons were taken and (auto)fit them again. It's super counterintuitive.

[kobeathris]

Would it be possible to add a hot key that does what shift does now in combat, but worked as a toggle instead of push and hold?

[Deshara]

I'd say that this would be a terrible idea, since you'd have to go through ships from which weapons were taken and (auto)fit them again. It's super counterintuitive.

Strip is a behavior that has to be toggled on, and what I was suggesting isn't that ships smartly pull weapons off of other ships, but that having a ship's autofit set to strip it when it autofits send its weapons to the cargo hold so that other ships that need one of those weapons to complete its autofit template would see it's been made available by the autofit and grab it, sending the weapon it's replacing with its desired weapon to the pool, giving a light-printed backdoor method of making the autofit swap guns between autofit ships without having to actually make any of them communicate with eachother what they want

edit: and, more to my point, if a ship "wants" one of the guns off of another ship that isn't set to be stripped when it autofits, it will never get it because that ship won't free up its weapon on it's own, so you're at no risk of your flagship having its harpoons pulled off it by your wingman because nobody sets their flagship to be strip autofitted

[Sy]

Desh.. i really don't mean to be rude, but, again: what you're describing would only work in very specific cases, and would be anything between just pointless and actually actively counterproductive most of the time. and if you have to enable it yourself for these very specific cases anyway, it defeats the entire purpose of reducing the need to manage the weapons transfer manually in the first place.

it's just not a good idea, sorry. there's way too little benefit, with way too many issues attached to it.

[Gothars]

If you want to keep discussing this idea, please open a new thread in the suggestions sub-forum.

[Deshara]

Desh.. i really don't mean to be rude, but, again: what you're describing would only work in very specific cases, and would be anything between just pointless and actually actively counterproductive most of the time. and if you have to enable it yourself for these very specific cases anyway, it defeats the entire purpose of reducing the need to manage the weapons transfer manually in the first place.

it's just not a good idea, sorry. there's way too little benefit, with way too many issues attached to it.

You don't know! I'll show you, I'll show all of you! I'll make my own Starsector, only it'll have blackjack, and-- *sees gothar's reply* eep