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Author Topic: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons  (Read 1148 times)

PaulOverAgain

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On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« on: August 05, 2024, 04:27:52 AM »

During battles with the Luddic Path Holy Armadas, I noticed that they have Sunders in their fleets. I think this is very strange, even though they have other midline ships (Brawler LP and Hammerhead), how could they acquire such an advanced ship and why would they even use it?

Part of the confusion arises from the fact that I don't quite understand the LP's views on the use of energy weapons in general. Some clues are found in Energy Weapon Mastery skill description, "The eye of an angel was found in the small places, hidden there by merciful God in the first moments of creation. Thus its secrets were laid bare for the ignorant and cruel to loose terrible, fiery wrath. We lament." So, not terribly fond of energy weapons, then?
However, upon consulting the wiki, I was surprised to find that the Paters do have access to a wide range of energy weapons, including autopulse lasers, which they naturally use on the aforementioned Sunders. Funny thing is, they don't even have that many ships with the appropriate mounts, with the exception of the Sunder (2 small universal on brawler LP, one medium energy on Venture LP, 4 small hybrid on Hammerhead, 2 large hybrid on Prometheus mk 2).
Well, I suppose, as in other cases (like the use of AM fuel), they hate it, but recognize that it may have its uses, and use the "lesser evil" to destroy the "greater evil", or something like that. Still, the question of them getting their hands on Sunders and advanced energy weapons remains open.

Therefore i suggest:
1) Give LP their own version of Sunder with quirks, maybe some sort of scavenged Lidar array, instead of high energy focus system (and ill-adviced modifications hullmod, naturally)?
2) As an alternative, perhaps some new haphazard ship should be introduced? Something that could fulfill a similar fire support role, but based on a more affordable civilian hull? I think something like a salvage rig with a large energy weapon strapped to it would fit in well with their vision.
3) Even if we assume, that Pathers consider energy weapons a neccessary evil, there are little ways for them to obtain it, other than salvaging or smuggling. Maybe let them lean more into some sort of easily accessible miner systems, with introduction of large mount mining weapon? Something like extraction beam, which allows them to pull smaller ships closer, and halting or slowing larger vessels, so they can actually hit it with Hammer torpedoes. Might create a bunch of balance issues though. Or just let them strap scavenged and re-assembled Thermal pulse cannons, considering they are already (somewhat) in the game.
Now, some of the above probably belong to suggestions, but I really wonder how much Luddics are willing to compromise on the use of forbidden technologies.
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Killer of Fate

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2024, 04:49:27 AM »

Considering Pathers are a very global faction, they could simply convert a few more ships to their own LP variants, like they did with the Brawler. But the thing about it though is that converting lesser ships is far easier lore-wise than larger ones. Hence there are only real LP variants of frigates and maybe some stupid civilian vessels.

With that being sad, I wouldn't mind there being added a low energy requirements energy weapon designed specifically for Prometheus MKII...

Doctorhealsgood

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2024, 05:20:33 AM »

I mean they are already using phase ships (even if it is just the gremlin) so i doubt they have that many reservations about using some lasers as a treat.
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Rusty Edge

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2024, 07:18:39 AM »

No, I don't think it's a contradiction. It's more of eh... A spiritualy journey. But as they say... The devil is in the details.
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Insolent Peon

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2024, 09:35:58 AM »

Consider that we have lasers on battlefields in the present year, but antimatter can't be mass produced. If they're willing to accept the tech required to achieve interstellar travel, most (non-REDACTED) energy weapons should be kosher.

Consider also that fanaticism and logic are frequently in opposition.
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Dadada

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2024, 09:59:54 AM »

No, I don't think it's a contradiction. It's more of eh... A spiritualy journey. But as they say... The devil is in the details.
this

And if some Autopulse lasers and Sunders get, ehem, lost... And scavanged Lidar Array? Nah, let the System HEF + Autopulse stay a source of pain. Glass cannons. :3
« Last Edit: August 05, 2024, 10:02:43 AM by Dadada »
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Bungee_man

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2024, 12:32:01 PM »

The Luddics don't hate shiny things for the sake of hating shiny things, they dislike excess technological advancement, and hard-AI in particular. It's worth noting that the automation and other technology they field is well ahead of anything we have today.

The Church's preference for low-tech ships looks like more of an aesthetic choice, though reduced ship automation, less dependence on not having D-mods, and easier maintenance are also factors. I don't think they have any ideological preference for a super-advanced railgun made by an automated self-assembling factory over a super-advanced pulse laser made by an automated self-assembling factory.
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Rusty Edge

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2024, 02:27:32 PM »

The more moderate Church seems to make compromises when it comes to luxuries and necessities. While the Path makes compromises for the sake of the Holy War.

And what better way of disposing of such tools of wanton destruction than ramming them down the throat of Molech?
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SpaceCat

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2024, 07:12:43 PM »

Most of the basic lasers (non phase/tachyon) might not be particularly heretical.

Their descriptions often use phrases that seem to have been lifted straight out of modern systems / papers.
"Pulse pumped" "sapphire gain medium" or "q-switched", etc.
It's existing laser tech. Came before practical railguns.

In starsector terms, lasers like this are probably the energy weapon equivalent of mortar/machine gun, or hammer torpedo.

It's all the rest of the energy weapons which are the ones that damn your soul. Probably.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2024, 09:26:50 PM by SpaceCat »
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Hoot

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Re: On Sunder, Luddic Path and energy weapons
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2024, 09:19:29 AM »

Thing about bonkers cults is...their version of evil is always fluid based on how well it helps or hinders the desires and goals of the leadership.
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