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Author Topic: Expectations for 1.0  (Read 4085 times)

BigBrainEnergy

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2023, 07:48:24 PM »

Oh, and this video reminded me we really need a better on-boarding experience. Many of his complaints are already non-issues but are caused by a lack of effective communication to new players.

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Dexy

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #16 on: May 28, 2023, 01:23:21 AM »

True. I saw a twitch streamer try the game and he had some difficulty getting started and warming up to the game. He liked it a lot though.
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Gift-of-Life

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2023, 12:58:24 PM »

I would like the UI to be stream lined, and input key use standardized.

I find there is a new page for few options. thinks planets page.
Clean up UI from unused assets. like the upper right button on the station fleet inventory page.

more quests....

combat fps optimization for steam deck/ older computers. swings for 60 to 10fps with explosions, shield effects, and missile trails.
fix memory leaks. so i stop getting the msg about it in game. unless 12 gigs is to few?

 
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Trensicourt

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2023, 07:32:05 PM »

Honestly, just start implementing many of the mods into the base game. Remove the memes, the bloat, and polish the rest. This would get nearly the game to nearly its full functionality. The storylines can all just be expansions.
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xenoargh

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2023, 09:43:55 PM »

1. Victory scenarios, or at the very least, scenarios which result in various stable-ish outcomes and a victory credit roll. It's not really "Mount and Blade in Space" when there's no way to conquer anything or achieve a lasting peace, short of glassing every other human colony in the Sector, which has always felt really nihilistic.

2. Choices that actually matter. Most of the adventures have obvious Right Answers or they're elaborate FedEx quests. More Fallout-esque, "there are several answers, and they all have tradeoffs" adventure scripting would be a huge plus for replayability. Don't get me wrong- I think that Alex and David have actually done really well this last couple of versions in terms of improving the feel of the game and connecting players to the lore. I just think there's more room for interesting stuff, like a Fallout-style ending where the player gets to review their important choices and sees how they affected the end.

3. A thorough revamp of how we relate to Factions once we establish our own. Seriously, the game really needs an official diplomatic system, not, "spend Story Points to get out of trouble until you can't, then glass everybody else".

4. Mechanisms for sharing the Gates with the Factions, which greatly change Accessibility. Allow new ones to be built.

5. Factions should behave dynamically, at least in the most basic ways. For example, every Faction should have a "budget" based on their "GDP", and every 3 months, they should be able to spend some of that "budget" to either improve their Colonies or buy additional fleet assets for <missions>. There isn't any coherent reason why the crippled Colonies must remain so. If they're never allowed to occasionally invade one another, that's fine, although I still think that's a mistake; people play Nexerelin largely because the official game doesn't do what they want. I think that there should also be ways to perma-destroy stuff on Colonies, not just "disrupt" them, so that there are options short of glassing. That should probably cost Fuel, need the local defenses to be Disrupted, and lots of Marines, and take significant amounts of in-game time, like a siege in Mount and Blade did.

6. The missile meta and the gradual erosion of the player's personal power in combat is one of the reasons why I just can't make myself play Vanilla's combat balance any more. It's boring and feels cheap to build a fleet that's designed to launch <some automated attack style> whether it's missiles or fighters, wait for it to work (or save-scum if it doesn't) and then Retreat, rinse and repeat. I want player-ships that are designed for players, require skill and can be effective at tipping the balance into end-game content. I don't think that's where things are.

7. Hyperspace remains either an obstacle-course that doesn't serve much purpose past stymying exploration, or at best a slog. I often think that Hyperspace was a design mistake; that instead this would be a better game design if that part was largely abstracted, so that the interesting parts in Systems could've had more love and time spent on it. I'm currently playing around with having [REDACTED] and Derelicts show up there occasionally in challenging numbers to give players a mountain to climb if they want, with treasures worth the trouble. Might mod in Gates to every System, so that once I've gotten somewhere, it's not a boring slog getting back again.

8. More options for Sector size and other starting conditions that feel roughly balanced. For example, a start with a Venture and a pair of Wolves- a "trader start" that makes sense and won't gimp the player during the Tutorial, etc.

9. A fix for the "corner camper" problems that are inherent to the current combat game design. Sometimes I think that the right answer is simply to make the battlefield so large that it can't happen, or force ships going further than X from the center to flee if they don't turn around quickly enough.

10. More variety of Buildings and Industries. There are mods that add both and look like they'd probably improve the feel.

11. Less reliance on soft caps and more reliance on cost to balance player-fleet power.

12. Less artificial limitations on AI fleet size, or better mechanics to represent situations. If a Pirate Armada's dumb enough to tackle the Hegemony's capital, a huge fleet should erupt from it, representing their strategic-level assets being deployed. It should look like a Somali pirate "fleet" attempting to raid Washington DC- the good ol' Hegemony Defense Fleet should arrive. Same with other Faction capitals; they should be on an entirely different level than they are presently. Same with the difference in feel of a fleet coming to raid your colony, vs. one that's trying to glass it; the second should be a truly terrifying end-game threat level, and if triggered early, should be the start of a strategic death-spiral all the way to "does not have Colonies", rather than something you occasionally fly-swat while your real enemy is a smallish bunch of anti-tech terrorists and unorganized criminals.

13. Full modding access to the ship drawing systems, at least in terms of extensible callbacks. It and the UI are the biggest areas that aren't inherently very moddable, especially the Tactical Pane view, which I've been wanting to mod for ages now. Think about modders adding features like tactical formations, new Admiral commands, etc., to flesh out the game for years to come.

14. On a technical level, putting all ship graphics of a Faction onto a single large sprite sheet at runtime would probably speed things up considerably. Rendering ships in sprite-sheet order would help this. Also would help a lot with VRAM limits, because anything that's not needed can be deallocated.

15. Addressing whatever's causing Pieces to be abnormally expensive (try spawning a hundred of them and watch what happens to framerates when AIs are actively present). It's something either going on w/ collision or drawing, I think, but that's all I've been able to parse from profiling it. I have this probably-stupid theory that they're generating collision circles that are either waaaaaaaay too big or that are tiny, leading to per-frame tests vs. the polygons. But that's probably wrong.

16. Access to explosion events in EveryFrameCombatPlugin. I want to get rid of particle spam.

17. Strongly consider looking at the GPU-driven particle system that's been released or my multithreaded system and implement something like that, as these are areas that are still surprisingly slow. I'd be happy to lend my source for free- the version that's over here in private is considerably better than the public version and now includes an engine system and generic trail system, including a punctual smoke with animation that's surprisingly cheap. If nothing else, a callback to Engine drawing, explosions happening and trails being called by projectiles, etc. would mean fewer complexities and headaches; most of the time spent writing that was spent writing around native systems, abusing gamecode in creative ways, etc.

18. Modernize the Java. I've been using 8 for something like four years now; it's fine, it's faster and it handles memory and garbage-collection better. I understand wanting to stay in a comfortable place and not wreck things, but that's what code forks are for, lol. I'd be stunned if it doesn't compile and run on 8 without a major hitch, though, unless you're doing <something weird> that depended on one of the few things that ever got deprecated in Java, and in that case, there's almost certainly a well-worn workaround on Stack Overflow at this late date, lol. I'd prefer to use the latest JVM that JWJGL supports well, though.

19. Past 1.0, please quit breaking the mods that touch the Economy, Skills, etc. Extensions, yes, whole new behaviors and UIs that deprecate existing functions, no. I get that making the economy work in the way that you really wanted has been hard, but at some point, it needs to be fixed with numbers-nudging rather than new functions; honestly, I hoped it was officially done in 0.95 other than balance, because it's relatively unimportant compared to the stuff higher on this wishlist, imo- the current system is a good-enough balance between accessibility and function, and it's still more complex than I think it ever really needed to be, but most players appear to be happy with it.

I've quit releasing things and I've put off installing 0.96 largely because of the huge headache porting forward anything that touched this stuff deeply became. Merely reading the code to deal with Fleet spawning in 0.95 made my head hurt a bit- it's a spawn event that calls a FleetFactory event that calls a Market, etc., etc.... sheesh, I just want to make a Faction fleet at <place> and have it <do stuff>.

It's like climbing a cliff that grows every time I get to the top, lol. I'll eventually get around to seeing how badly EZ Faction's broken, etc. and sorting through all the stuff in Rebal that will have to be redone or reworked, but after 10 years, I'm tiiiiiired of doing that, lol.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2023, 10:05:23 PM by xenoargh »
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smithney

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2023, 11:00:20 PM »

What do I expect from the release? Sure, an actually good intro experience and th overdue QoL changes Histidine mentioned are a no-brainer. Besides that, many more stories, perhaps a couple new microfactions, more developed endgame. Overall I think the game is basically fleshed out!
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strcat

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2023, 04:57:32 AM »

More simulator options. There's absolutely no reason why we can't pick any ship we want, clutter is a weak excuse when there's a bunch of d-modded ships and 3 Dominator variants. Adding ships manually is tedious. And since the game shifted so much in gameplay, we should be able to put officers in opponents. You will never fight a capital that has zero combat skills. So let me try fighting a realistic opponent. I know the average player is not crazy about this but for us test junkies this would be really cool to have.

And yeah the Codex revamp has been mentioned many many moons ago but I suspect it's being witheld since it's not a very exciting update.

EDIT: Funny thing, ever since campaign started being developed and we slowly got new stuff, my number one thing was faction diversity, so that fighting each of them has a unique feel. And this patch brought us exactly that so I can't say it anymore  :'(

Ideally, it would be possible to choose the ships and refit them including giving them officers. Could allow all the baseline ships including variants of those and also allow all the hidden content that you've seen in the battle with an easy way to unlock it from the beginning via the configuration file.

I usually enable the developer simulator variants but that's really not good enough. Easily beating a Radiant with Paladins and no officer doesn't mean much.
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Gothars

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2023, 05:18:27 AM »

I expect nothing. I already got more out of this game than I could have hoped for. I hope for the dev team that they can bring Starsector to a point where they are satisfied with it, and then be massively successful in sales.

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Grievous69

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2023, 06:22:56 AM »

I expect nothing. I already got more out of this game than I could have hoped for. I hope for the dev team that they can bring Starsector to a point where they are satisfied with it, and then be massively successful in sales.
Same. "Knowing" Alex, it's still going to take a while until that point is reached, I really hope there comes a time when he'll go "alright, everything I wanted to make is done, time for one last polish/bugfix check". Perfectionism is a blessing and a curse, without it, we'd have already seen 1.0 years ago. But we didn't and the game just keeps getting better and better.

Btw I found it funny Gothars that your signature is exactly what your opinion on this thread is already, so you kinda said the same thing twice. Now we just wait for a math thread where Wyvern will be right about the calculations and we have a bingo.
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Dexy

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2023, 11:03:27 AM »

Hyperspace is more interesting with the mod that makes REDACTED show up there.
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Marco_Paulo

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2023, 01:01:31 PM »

The most straightforward, tractable list I can think of:

  • Major factions feel meaningfully strong/responsive, relative to population size. For example, it is no longer possible (or easy, at least) to cheese Chicomoztoc into de-civving by sitting on it with a few thousand marines in between patrols for around a week.
  • Likewise for the economy - every trick to make money feels like an impressive discovery, and they give the game its charm to the point where every review covers at least one, but diminishing returns would encourage the player to explore all of them. Maybe something like the event that occurs after a raid would happen after each method. For example, a player supplying a world whose spaceport he raided might get an event that causes them to recognize what he's doing and drive him off when he arrives to sell, after a few successful endeavors.
  • The new colony threat system is fully added, with every faction's hostile actions integrated into it, and some of the defenses that were useful in the old version but not the new one (like the planetary shield and the military base item) accounted for.
  • Personally, I think it would be really cool if it were joined together with the faction relationships screen.
  • Mission chain six (I think) for the campaign will conclude the story. I think the story hints that the player will have to activate a hypershunt, interact with it, and then something will come through the gates and act as the story's final boss.
  • The new mission chains will also get conclusions, most likely, but that might come after 1.0.
  • The last few AI bugs are patched. This is, by far, the best AI I've ever seen in a game like this, but the nature of the gameplay is such that every small misstep by a friendly ship has an outsized impact on immersion. Very hard to account for all of the variables that determine ideal ship behavior in a way that prevents the occasional catastrophic failure, but I think Alex can do it, if anyone can.

I think that might be it. It looks very close to finished.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2023, 01:03:46 PM by Marco_Paulo »
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Verran

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2023, 07:09:52 PM »

To add my two cents here: first penny is that there is a lot of good stuff here and I agree, wholeheartedly, with the people asking for end-game content, story conclusions, and final bosses. To put down a more unique penny: I would like to see an expansion on the one-off missions/contracts. What do I mean by that? Well, let's first look at what we have in very broad strokes:

We have, overall, three different kinds of contracts: A, A to B, and A to B to A.
Examples of A: A fellow offers to sell us a ship and the player says yes or no. A fellow wants X resource from a colony and the player says yes or no.
Examples of A to B: A fellow asks the player to do a bounty, the player says yes or no, then, if yes, the player goes to location B to fulfill the bounty. A fellow asks the player to deliver X of an item, the player says yes or no, then the player, if yes, goes to location B to fulfill the request.
Examples of A to B to A: A fellow asks the player to extract another person, the player goes to location B to do so, then returns to A.

You get the idea. Now, there is nothing wrong with this system! I still want each of these request types. Rather, I would like to see an addition of a few, maybe, A to B to C or A to B to C then back to A or B. Which could create quests like: The Hegemony wants you to extract an agent from the pirates. You get there only to find that the agent has fled to another location and the pirates know about it. They then offer you money to turn the agent over to them rather than the Heg. The player gets to location C and then needs to decide which way to go and, depending on the decision, could raise and lower relations with the pirates and the Heg.

Big goal here is to have another level of good, basic jobs that the player can pick up.
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Midnight Kitsune

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #27 on: June 09, 2023, 04:17:03 PM »

Honestly, just start implementing many of the mods into the base game. Remove the memes, the bloat, and polish the rest. This would get nearly the game to nearly its full functionality. The storylines can all just be expansions.
Maybe the "sprit" of some mods, sure (Like what Alex did with the current update and Smods and the mod Better Deserved S Mods)
But with the content mods like the faction mods? HIGHLY doubt that will happen. I've read about indie devs that do  this and it always ends up not worth it for anyone. The devs have new "foreign" code to worry about and the modders lose creative control over their own mod. Plus all the LEGAL paperwork as well....
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Lawrence Master-blaster

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #28 on: June 13, 2023, 09:45:28 PM »

One thing I would like is UI redesign to make everything larger.

You do get used it after a while, but good lord that is a lot of wasted space. And that resolution is already lower than Steam average.
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Horselover Manly

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Re: Expectations for 1.0
« Reply #29 on: June 13, 2023, 10:32:35 PM »

One thing I would like is UI redesign to make everything larger.

You do get used it after a while, but good lord that is a lot of wasted space. And that resolution is already lower than Steam average.

When you start the game there is a dialog. If you click the down arrow next to the display resolution you can change the resolution. If you press Options you can change UI scaling.
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