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Author Topic: Expeditions At High Relations.  (Read 1022 times)

Takion Kasukedo

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Expeditions At High Relations.
« on: January 04, 2019, 10:23:03 AM »

Please ignore this post if this has already been validated.

So, as far as I, and possibly others know, expeditions happen regardless of relation, which can be particularly irritating knowing you've done a ton of work to try and increase relations with a faction to see if expeditions will cease, only to find out that expeditions are still underway, due to having more of one commodity than another core-world faction.

Would it be possible in a future release to lower expedition frequency or outright cease any expeditions once relations are high enough? (a good determinate base level for outright ceasing any expeditions from a faction would be 80 - 95, while 50 - 80 would be a good level for reduction of expedition frequency)
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Megas

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2019, 11:15:13 AM »

There is an option to use connections (instead of bribing) to avert an expedition, if you have at least 25 rep with them.  I never tried it (since I did not have the rep at the time).
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RedHellion

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2019, 12:00:43 PM »

There is an option to use connections (instead of bribing) to avert an expedition, if you have at least 25 rep with them.  I never tried it (since I did not have the rep at the time).

I think what he's getting at is that (as has been mentioned previously) it makes little sense that expeditions the size of full-scale war fleets would be sent at an ally with 80+ reputation in the first place the same as if you were at neutral reputation or even hostile. Yes you can use reputation to avert them, but it seems very jarring - especially with the frequency they can be sent.

As has been mentioned in other threads, I think the main issues are:
1) AI factions have such crappy colonies - and the player can easily build such ridiculous money-factory colonies - that it's easy to out-produce every major faction fairly quickly and draw their ire
2) Expeditions, even though they're supposedly "deniable", are in essence full-scale war fleets with the best tech available to the sending faction
3) AI factions apparently have endless supplies of ships, supplies, fuel, and men beyond what their colonies could reasonably produce to send so many expeditions. And smashing them utterly seems to not make any difference
4) Reputation has no impact on frequency of expeditions, size, amount of warning, or diplomatic costs/options. Once you start establishing colonies, it essentially becomes a resource that the player needs to constantly keep up with every faction to avert expeditions or else simply endure and crush the inevitable waves of expeditions. There are so many ways to gain faction reputation, and the player only has so much time. Hopefully the "Orders" tab will also eventually allow friendly fleets to be sent on rep-raising missions.
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Linnis

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2019, 12:33:56 PM »

If your cooperative with them surely you will "comply" with the "industry inspection" expedition. Also supply the inspection fleet with travel supplies and accommodations for a measly 200,000 credits.

Makes sense lore wise and also just bribing everything dont makes much of a dent in your income.
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Megas

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2019, 12:54:51 PM »

If your cooperative with them surely you will "comply" with the "industry inspection" expedition. Also supply the inspection fleet with travel supplies and accommodations for a measly 200,000 credits.

Makes sense lore wise and also just bribing everything dont makes much of a dent in your income.
That sounds more like demanding tribute (from what is likely a stronger opponent after the player finishes building up his main colony).  They are basically doing what Pathers do, extort money or else.  I rather kill them (or abandon my size 3 tech mine right before their expedition reaches the system) instead of paying their tribute.

@ RedHellion:  It just shows how two-faced and evil they are.  Just as player can openly attack an ally and be auto-hostile, they can cause mischief by sending several war fleets (that probably violate 30 ship fleet cap per fleet) to try to burn your colony to the ground.  If they want to be gray-area, they probably should have transponder off.  If we do what they do, rep would be at an automatic -50.

P.S.  For their supposedly high quality, major factions cannot do anything to your faction after your colonies get big and strong.  Pirates will hurt the profit stats, and Pathers do that and knock out industries - all while bypassing your defenses.  In a way, pirates and pathers are the strongest factions despite being weak in a direct fight.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 12:57:11 PM by Megas »
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RedHellion

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2019, 01:16:50 PM »

If your cooperative with them surely you will "comply" with the "industry inspection" expedition. Also supply the inspection fleet with travel supplies and accommodations for a measly 200,000 credits.

Makes sense lore wise and also just bribing everything dont makes much of a dent in your income.

My issue with your comment is the fact that you're talking about the Hegemony inspection fleet, not general faction expeditions. Inspections are looking for illegal AI cores, expeditions are there to raid and shut down your perfectly-legal industries because they're in competition.

I have no issue with the AI core inspections lore or balance wise. I do have the issues I mentioned with expeditions.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 01:19:08 PM by RedHellion »
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Linnis

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2019, 06:10:00 PM »

Oh, I am talking about every kind of expeditions. It's just a tax you pay essentially. Tho if income nerf comes through it might become not possible to bribe everyone everytime.
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RawCode

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2019, 03:58:34 AM »

only issue with faction raids in current version (but this likely to be changed with "high command" implementation) you can't explain faction, that you better to be left alone, permanently.

especially in case of hegemony with AI raids.
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Morgan Rue

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2019, 10:41:57 AM »

I suspect, though I do not know for certain and have not tested, that expeditions are weaker if you have higher relations with the faction sending them.
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iamseron

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Re: Expeditions At High Relations.
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2019, 10:57:59 AM »

Probably going to have to rethink a lot of things about how factions and player colonies work imho. The idea needs some more fleshing out all around.
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