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Author Topic: ships should better avoid exploding enemies  (Read 3059 times)

Sy

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ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« on: May 01, 2016, 09:02:56 AM »

don't know if this has come up before, but i find my ships are way too eager to suicide by getting very close to a big enemy that is about to get blown up.

it's especially problematic for ships that have a forward-movement system, like Burn Drive, often literally ramming a dying enemy. aggressive officers that try to use short-range PD weapons for a little extra damage are also problematic. but i've seen it happen to ships without such mobility systems and piloted by steady or even cautious officers, in situations where there's no discernible reason to get very close to the enemy.

it's understandable that it will happen on occasion when a nearby ship (ally or enemy) explodes unexpectedly and/or the victim simply can't move away for some reason (like during a flameout). but it shouldn't happen when there is no reason to even move so close to an enemy in the first place, especially when it is under heavy fire.


if changing the ai to be better at avoiding this danger isn't possible, i'd say the damage of deathplosions should be reduced. i think it's cool that they do deal damage and aren't just a purely cosmetic effect, but maybe it shouldn't one-shot a similarly sized ship that has taken no significant previous damage.

loosing one of your ships right at the end of a hard-fought battle to a stupid mishap like this is just frustrating. :/

/rant
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Alex

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2016, 12:10:28 PM »

Is this issue mostly coming up for you with mod or vanilla ship systems? I'm asking because this is largely the responsibility of the ship system AI, and if we're talking about a mod-added ship system, that might be the culprit. Not saying a ship won't ever burn drive somewhere it shouldn't, but it's supposed to be fairly conservative with its burn drive usage, and from what I know, it is. I'll take a look if you confirm that you're seeing this happen often w/ burn drive, though.
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Sy

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2016, 12:47:44 PM »

the "ram headfirst into an exploding enemy" is with mod ship systems, yeah. specifically Blackrock and Templars in my case. interesting, i didn't know the ai would treat their systems differently if the function is similar.

it's still a problem with ships just getting very close without using any active system, though. my entire current run was with mod ships, so i can't say if that was an issue specific to it, but i believe it happened in vanilla games in the past as well.
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Alex

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2016, 01:14:38 PM »

Aha - right, then it's a system AI issue.

As far as regular movement, it should be a lot better about that specifically as of the last release. Hard to say if it's mod-related or not, though - for example, if a ship has low deceleration stats, it might have a hard time braking in time, etc.
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Sy

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2016, 01:47:10 PM »

generally speaking, i have definitely noticed ships getting less suicidal in recent releases. which makes these mishaps all the more frustrating. i guess i'll just keep an eye out when i eventually play vanilla-only campaign again at some point. :]

thanks for the replies, and sorry for reporting (potentially) mod issues. i usually try to figure out the cause for any issues, but it's hard for me as non-modder to know where the fault lies, beyond "ship does this thing in these situations". :/
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Alex

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2016, 01:51:06 PM »

... which makes these mishaps all the more frustrating. i guess i'll just keep an eye out when i eventually play vanilla-only campaign again at some point. :]

I can't win :)

Yeah, if you can let me know if you run into it again, that'd help - especially if it's something specific/at least somewhat reproducible.


thanks for the replies, and sorry for reporting (potentially) mod issues. i usually try to figure out the cause for any issues, but it's hard for me as non-modder to know where the fault lies, beyond "ship does this thing in these situations". :/

No worries - as you say, you can't really know, and better safe than sorry!
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Sutopia

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2016, 01:21:34 AM »

It has been an issue for vanilla phase ships for me
The AI rush to fire their weapon once they get enemy back without considering the exploding damage.
Lost an Afflictor due to this, he fired the antimatter into an Enforcer and killed himself into the explosion.
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Since all my mods have poor reputation, I deem my efforts unworthy thus no more updates will be made.

Alex

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Re: ships should better avoid exploding enemies
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2016, 09:51:36 AM »

Hmm. The AI is actually super careful about this, particularly for phase ships - it even considers its own burst damage potential to decide whether an enemy ship is in danger of blowing up. Might've happened because something else chipped in a lot of unexpected damage, or just because it's not really possible to be perfect about this, but it certainly shouldn't be happening as a matter of course.
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