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Author Topic: [0.8a] Starsector+ 3.7.0  (Read 1184042 times)

ahrenjb

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #315 on: October 23, 2014, 01:32:23 PM »

Any idea on when we can expext a 0.65a update for this mod?
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Midnight Kitsune

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #316 on: October 23, 2014, 01:52:58 PM »

Any idea on when we can expext a 0.65a update for this mod?
Not for quite awhile. The modders aren't calling this the modpocalypse
I would expect waiting around a month or more for this to become opperational
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #317 on: October 23, 2014, 01:57:44 PM »

It will take a while.  I have to do a lot of things (the majority of the mod, actually) again from scratch.
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Hopelessnoob

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #318 on: October 25, 2014, 01:32:28 PM »

can't wait to see this mod come out again. I had forgotten just how annoyingly balanced the original Skills were because of this mods wonderful rebalancing of them
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Legendsmith

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #319 on: October 31, 2014, 06:55:22 PM »

can't wait to see this mod come out again. I had forgotten just how annoyingly balanced the original Skills were because of this mods wonderful rebalancing of them
Yeah, I totally agree. I'd love to see a mini mod that just has the skills from Starsector+, since the skills in this mod really are wonderful. I opened up 0.6.5 and thought "Where's the rest of my skills and skill effects?"
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Darloth

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #320 on: November 01, 2014, 02:11:04 AM »

It might be possible to port just the skills and maybe associated hull mods...

Dark.Revenant, would you be interested in / OK with me trying to do this? I don't think a vast amount changed in the combat classes?
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #321 on: November 01, 2014, 03:46:55 AM »

I would recommend waiting, because I have changed some of the skills due to the core mechanics changing.
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ahrenjb

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #322 on: November 04, 2014, 01:59:59 PM »

I think that the nerfs of the Reaper and Harpoon are a little too extreme. The vanilla game had finally made them viable weapons. I don't know that the reaper needed a nerf at all, maybe to 400 instead of 100. Harpoon HP could be 120-130 instead of 100. I also think the rebalance of augmented engines is too extreme, it's supposed to be an improvement over unstable injector. Killing the burn speed bonus doesn't make it very attractive. Everything else looks good.
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #323 on: November 04, 2014, 02:49:40 PM »

Unstable Injector does not have a burn speed increase in the first place.

Also, the Reaper nerf is not that hard; that much of a slower acceleration only makes the reaper 25% slower to reach max range.

I will be adjusting Harpoon HP though.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2014, 07:56:03 PM by Dark.Revenant »
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #324 on: November 04, 2014, 04:56:31 PM »

Reaper and Harpoon were always viable. In Vanilla right now you can literally die to one volley of an AI controlled Dominator's harpoon pods if you're in a destroyer, if you're at 30% or more flux
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ahrenjb

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #325 on: November 04, 2014, 06:42:07 PM »

Reaper and Harpoon were always viable. In Vanilla right now you can literally die to one volley of an AI controlled Dominator's harpoon pods if you're in a destroyer, if you're at 30% or more flux

So you're saying a heavy cruiser with a respectable missile armament can defeat a destroyer with built up flux if the player doesn't do their part to avoid getting hit? Sounds about right to me. The cruiser only has 3 volleys, at that. Missile weapons working as intended. Powerful, but limited in ammo.
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Histidine

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #326 on: November 04, 2014, 07:38:09 PM »

I don't think a three-pod Harpoon volley will even overload a destroyer at a mere 30% flux...

EDIT: Quick calculations
Spoiler
Three pods fire 12 Harpoons at once. Each does 750 base damage, 375 shield damage for a total of 9000/4500.

Base destroyer stats
Enforcer
4000 flux capacity
1.2 shield efficiency
5000 hull integrity
750 armor
Takes 5400 shield damage (135%)
Harpoons getting through at 30% flux: 7 (5250 damage)

Hammerhead
4200 flux capacity
0.8 flux efficiency
5000 hull integrity
500 armor
Takes 3600 shield damage (85.7%)
Harpoons getting through at 30% flux: 2 (1500 damage)

Medusa
6000 flux capacity
0.6 flux efficiency
3000 hull integrity
300 armor
Takes 2700 shield damage (45%)
Harpoons getting through at 30% flux: 0

So I guess you can hypothetically kill certain destroyers at 30% flux with a three-pod Harpoon volley (well I think it still doesn't actually die if at full hull and armor, but close enough). On the other hand, this assumes none of the missiles get shot down by PD or hit an asteroid or wreck; an Enforcer with flak in particular is going to intercept at least three or four of them.
[close]

Although I think we're looking at this the wrong way; I don't think anyone is claiming that the small Harpoon rack is overpowered. If the pod is a problem, I'd make it launch three missiles instead of four.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2014, 08:58:53 PM by Histidine »
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ValkyriaL

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #327 on: November 05, 2014, 01:21:29 AM »

Or.. just have it launch 2 like it used to, and make the other pods the same.
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #328 on: November 05, 2014, 02:57:34 AM »

Nice calculations, but I'm talking about the AI Dominators that show up in high-end bounty fleets and have combat aptitude. Some of them seem to have 10 points missile spec. They will just obliterate your destroyers at random with every volley unless you have flak, due to the raw speed and power of the missiles. I've seen an AI sunder at 10% flux just die to a Dominator that shot harpoons in the opposite direction (it was fleeing) Kind of an annoying side effect of the new 4 shot volleys.

So yeah, it's not completely broken but it feels sort of rough. And its not fun to pilot a ship, spam harpoons or reapers at a target with mildly high flux, and be rewarded with a kill every single time. Reapers are basically point and click auto-murder weapons now, whereas before a fast cruiser or destroyer could actually try to dodge it. The balance between pressuring a shielded target and finishing off a crippled target has been thrown out of whack.

So any balance changes to try to remedy all of this is completely fine in my book. The new anti-clumping missile AI in itself is a massive buff, causes way more harpoons to slip past omnishields and avoid flak.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2014, 03:09:34 AM by Cycerin »
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PerfectDeath

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #329 on: November 05, 2014, 09:49:59 AM »

Pilot a Wolf

Equip Reapers (level 5 missiles means x2 shots each)

Phase Skim behind target (by skimming through them)

Surprise!
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