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Starsector 0.95a is out! (03/26/21); Blog post: Of Slipstreams and Sensor Ghosts (09/24/21)

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Author Topic: [0.8a] Starsector+ 3.7.0  (Read 1174116 times)

DatonKallandor

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #330 on: November 05, 2014, 01:22:35 PM »

Nice calculations, but I'm talking about the AI Dominators that show up in high-end bounty fleets and have combat aptitude. Some of them seem to have 10 points missile spec. They will just obliterate your destroyers at random with every volley unless you have flak, due to the raw speed and power of the missiles. I've seen an AI sunder at 10% flux just die to a Dominator that shot harpoons in the opposite direction (it was fleeing) Kind of an annoying side effect of the new 4 shot volleys.

So yeah, it's not completely broken but it feels sort of rough. And its not fun to pilot a ship, spam harpoons or reapers at a target with mildly high flux, and be rewarded with a kill every single time. Reapers are basically point and click auto-murder weapons now, whereas before a fast cruiser or destroyer could actually try to dodge it. The balance between pressuring a shielded target and finishing off a crippled target has been thrown out of whack.

So any balance changes to try to remedy all of this is completely fine in my book. The new anti-clumping missile AI in itself is a massive buff, causes way more harpoons to slip past omnishields and avoid flak.

So now you need point defenses on your ships. That's a good thing. Pre .65 nobody ran PD because missiles were on the whole crap. Now they're a proper threat and luckily the counter already exists.
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #331 on: November 06, 2014, 03:33:37 AM »

The argument is that nobody ran PD before, and nobody runs PD now either, but should? I'm sorry, but my fleet had several flak-using enforcers, hammerheads with 4x burst PD lasers, and the Sunder I was piloting had nothing but Vulcans for ballistics. The point is, massed missiles are too powerful right now and need to be brought slightly down, and SS+ is doing that.
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ValkyriaL

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #332 on: November 06, 2014, 06:00:33 AM »

I agree with the missile nerf, fielding right now 4 Dominators with 12 harpoon pods together, my fleet will kill ANY fleet in the game, fielding whatever setup they damn well please, it doesn't matter, my dominators kill them, there is no counter except mass flak.
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Darloth

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #333 on: November 06, 2014, 06:57:28 AM »

Is it possible to boost PD's effectiveness against missiles without nerfing the missiles themselves, or making PD too strong vs fighters?

After trying to use them in earlier versions and usually discovering they were rather underwhelming, I -like- having some useful missiles.
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Ranakastrasz

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #334 on: November 06, 2014, 08:59:49 AM »

What I really want is the whole skill setup as a standalone.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2014, 09:03:58 AM by Ranakastrasz »
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ahrenjb

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #335 on: November 06, 2014, 09:22:32 AM »

I always ran PD before, whether ballistic or energy, whatever I could mount. Energy PD was always inferior to ballistic PD, but that's because ships with many energy mounts typically have better shields which compensates for that fact. The new missiles are much more dangerous, I don't think anyone will disagree there, but I don't think they are too much so.

Now, more than ever, proper flux management, shield use, and maneuvering are vital to survival against missile equipped enemies. I don't find that I have much trouble with missiles as long as I can get my shield turned around to intercept, or maneuver so that my PD has more time to address the threat. When I make a mistake, or allow myself to get overwhelmed, or get too eager, that's when I get smoked by missiles. You can still dodge a reaper if you're keeping your enemies at arms length, unless they pop off a smart shot which doesn't happen all that often.

So, the new missiles have increased the difficulty, and as far as I'm concerned, it's been a long time coming. You shouldn't be able to run around in a frigate or destroyer and destroy entire fleets. You should have a very difficult time going head to head with a heavy cruiser in a destroyer. Can you still? Yes, but it's much more difficult than before.

Now, have the new missiles made it that much easier for players? I still don't think so. Ammunition is still very limited. You only have 2-3 volleys with any size mount, and if you don't use them wisely they didn't do you much good anyway.

I feel like missiles are finally balanced, is what it comes down to. This is of course my opinion, but that's why I started the discussion. I'm providing input and feedback, that's all.
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Morrigi

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #336 on: November 06, 2014, 09:30:19 AM »

In my opinion, missiles should be nasty. Since you only get a couple of volleys vs hundreds of rounds for ballistic weapons or effectively infinite ammo for energy weapons, they should do a shitload of damage, but be more easily countered by smart maneuvering, flux management, and PD. I think the new patch does this quite well.
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Dark.Revenant

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #337 on: November 06, 2014, 03:10:01 PM »

Reaper acceleration got nerfed because otherwise they were unreactable; they would appear and then you would have no time to defend.

Harpoons got slightly nerfed because they were a bit too good at tracking and were a bit too tough; you could have three LRPD Lasers all facing the same direction and shoot down none of a harpoon rack's shots.

The rest of the missiles are about the same or even buffed; sabots were made a bit more accurate, atropos is tougher, MIRVs are better, etc.
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Wyvern

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Re: [0.65.1a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #338 on: November 06, 2014, 07:08:55 PM »

Suggestion: Update the thread name to indicate 0.65.1a compatibility; I had been ignoring this mod simply because it didn't look like it had been updated.  (You can change the thread name by editing the first post.)
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Dark.Revenant

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #339 on: November 06, 2014, 07:13:50 PM »

This mod is not compatible yet.
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Creepin

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #340 on: November 07, 2014, 06:47:51 AM »

Is there any convenient way to get mods needed for older (or even for current) version of Starsector+?

I've tried to play 1.10.1 (thankfully, I've kept vanilla 0.62 installed), but all Libs mentioned in the OP are only downloadable in versions higher than listed in OP, same with mods, not to mention few mods are only downloadable as versions for 0.65 at all. I tried it anyway just to make sure it won't work, and, well, it didn't. :) So, any advice on playing 1.10.1 or at least 1.11.1 now provided I haven't stashed libs and mods required to do so months ago, better than going to a dozen of different topics asking for mod authors to send me old versions of their mods? :)
« Last Edit: November 07, 2014, 06:55:30 AM by Creepin »
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stormbringer951

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #341 on: November 07, 2014, 08:58:23 AM »

Is there any convenient way to get mods needed for older (or even for current) version of Starsector+?

I've tried to play 1.10.1 (thankfully, I've kept vanilla 0.62 installed), but all Libs mentioned in the OP are only downloadable in versions higher than listed in OP, same with mods, not to mention few mods are only downloadable as versions for 0.65 at all. I tried it anyway just to make sure it won't work, and, well, it didn't. :) So, any advice on playing 1.10.1 or at least 1.11.1 now provided I haven't stashed libs and mods required to do so months ago, better than going to a dozen of different topics asking for mod authors to send me old versions of their mods? :)

Previous versions of LazyLib are available on Bitbucket. For other mods, you could try using the Wayback Machine, check if it has the mod page cached in the right timeframe (before or shortly after the release date of 0.65) and hope that the download link in that page hasn't expired. Other than that, you're down to asking the mod maintainer or other forum-goers for a download link. Downloads for old versions of Starsector itself are still available through the original download links on the blog.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2014, 09:07:38 AM by synthetic »
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Weapons Group Controls mod - deselect all weapon groups, hold-down hold-fire mode, toggle alternating/linked fire
Captain's Log - throw away your notepad: custom notes, ruins and salvageable reminders
Old Hyperion - for your dose of nostalgia
Adjustable Skill Thresholds - set fleet DP and fighter bay thresholds

Creepin

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Re: [0.6.2a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 1.11.1
« Reply #342 on: November 07, 2014, 12:49:25 PM »

Well, after an evening of careful digging and sifting through respective threads, and with a great link to LazyLib provided by synthetic (much appreciated!) I was able to assemble all the libs & mods in versions mentioned in the OP. Sorry for the ruckus, I'm finally off playing SS+ 1.10.1! :)
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Dark.Revenant

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[0.65.1a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 2.0
« Reply #343 on: November 08, 2014, 04:45:00 AM »

All systems go!  There are a tremendous number of changes.  See the OP for more details on some of them; the full change log is below.  The biggest changes are bolded.

Kestrel-class Cruiser [6.5 Logistics]

Fly like an eagle.  Or like a falcon.  But not quite the same way.

The fast strike cruiser you never knew you wanted.  It's also an excuse to have a large ballistic slot on a midline ship, other than the Conquest.  This thing fills the gap between Falcon and Eagle, but is not a clone of either.  Sprite by Tartiflette.



Download Starsector+ 2.0
Download Mirror
(Requires LazyLib 2.0b (Updated!))
(Requires ShaderLib Beta v1.0 (Updated!))

We also recommend Version Checker 1.2 to notify you when an update is ready.

Download Interstellar Imperium 1.4 (not yet compatible)
Download The Knights Templar 0.9.1 (not yet compatible)
Download Blackrock Driveyards 0.6.6 (not yet compatible)
Download Exigency Incorporated 0.6 (not yet compatible)
Download Shadowyards Heavy Industries v0.5.2.1 (Updated!)
Download The Mayorate v0.8.1 (Updated!)
Download Citadel 0.7.3 (Updated!)

Version 2.0
  • Updated for Starsector 0.65a
  • Compatibility adjustments for ShaderLib Beta
  • Kestrel-class Cruiser added
  • Vent AI tweaked again
  • Starting options expanded
  • Knights of Ludd and Luddic Path removed from the sector (reverted to vanilla), but still available in random battle
  • Lion's Guard available in random battle
  • Omega Serpentis star system removed (replaced by vanilla with Eos)
  • Fleet generation rewritten and improved
  • Random battle fleet generation redesigned
  • Greatly increased loot drops from fleets, decreased XP from trading
  • Increased loot variety; Shadowyards fleets now drop High Capacitance Storage, Templar fleets drop Templar Flux Cores and have tripled loot rates
  • Quadrupled fuel use in hyperspace (4x light years between objects; pixel distance/travel time unchanged), fuel price decreased by 75%
  • High Maintenance added to Excelsior and Revenant
  • Shielded Cargo Holds can now be used in the campaign; unlocked from Logistical Oversight
  • Logistical Oversight and Wing Command reworked
  • Automated Repair Unit now reduces minimum crew size by 25%
  • Augmented Engines now increases fuel consumption by 100% instead of reducing cargo space; burn speed bonus reduced to 1 from 2 (unstable injectors do not increase burn speed, so the +2 bonus is just weird)
  • Wolf shield arc increased to 210 from 150
  • Shepherd burn speed increased to 6 from 5
  • Hammerhead flux capacity increased to 4500 from 4200
  • Sunder deceleration increased significantly
  • Condor and Gemini logistics balance adjusted
  • Avalon logistics increased to 3 supplies/day from 2.5
  • Brawler turning stats buffed
  • Fighter balance adjustments
  • Beam armor hit strength increased to 100% from 50%
  • Mining Laser reduced to 2 OP from 3 OP, PD Laser reduced to 3 OP from 5 OP, LR PD Laser reduced to 4 OP from 6 OP, Burst PD Laser reduced to 6 OP from 8 OP, Heavy Burst Laser reduced to 11 OP from 13 OP
  • Guardian PD System charges/second increased to 1 from 0.5
  • Phase Beam EMP damage increased to 75 from 40
  • Graviton Beam DPS increased to 125 from 100
  • Gauss Cannon charge-up time decreased to 0.5 seconds from 1 second; cooldown time increased equivalently
  • Hurricane MIRV stats buffed in general
  • Light Machine Gun, Light Dual Machine Gun, Heavy Machine Gun projectile speed increased
  • Light Dual Machine Gun ammo increased to 1500 from 1000, range increased to 400 from 300
  • Thumper ammo increased to 800 from 600
  • Heavy Machine Gun range increased to 500 from 400
  • All missiles now self-destruct instead of fading out
  • Reaper Torpedo acceleration reduced to 100 from 500
  • Harpoon MRM hit points reduced to 125 from 150
  • Hornet MRM, Inferno MIRV, Ion Torpedo, and Trebuchet LRM stats and appearance adjusted
  • Front Shield Emitter upkeep bonus reduced to 25% from 50%
  • Prices, fuel usage, and other various stats updated to keep in line with 0.65
  • Ion Torpedo reduced to 1000 fragmentation damage from 2000; does much less hard flux damage on a shield impact
  • Heavy Mauler projectile speed reduced to 600 from 900; much more inaccurate as well
  • Alastor shield coverage reduced to 240 degrees from 270; shield upkeep increased to 0.5 from 0.4
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Oathseeker

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Re: [0.65.1a] Starsector+ Vanilla Enhancement Mod 2.0
« Reply #344 on: November 08, 2014, 04:46:51 AM »

Holy ***! You sir, are a god!
I wasn't expecting this to update for weeks!

Edit: Some nice depth added to the character creation! Looking forward to discovering all this mod has to offer. But the added ships and expanded skill tree alone are enough to make this mod great, especially with the changes the new vanilla build introduced.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 05:16:38 AM by Oathseeker »
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