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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.6a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 553295 times)

Jonlissla

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #330 on: June 11, 2013, 11:10:03 PM »

On that note: Any plans on adding "Support" ships with (Out of combat) repairing/refitting capabilities?  We have freighters for cargo, tankers for fuel, ect.  With the "Combat Readiness" aspect, having a ship that speeds up repairs and re-readying would be very important.

Good idea, I'd really like to see more support mechanics in the game. A drone which flies in front of an enemy ship and has a large shield arc to block damage, or a sensor array on a ship which can be activated and give a accuracy boost to nearby allies, or a mobile platform which can deploy to activate a set of in-built weapons.

Tons of potential.
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Nanostrike

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #331 on: June 12, 2013, 09:50:31 PM »

There's another thing that I have to chime in on:

The "Energy/High-Tech" ships still trump the "Ballistic/Low-Tech" ships by a mile.  Even if the High-Tech ships have a higher FP/Cost and cost more in costs...that doesn't matter in combat.  The fact is that the High-Tech ships are so much faster, better shielded, and having stronger reactors that they can dominate any of the other ships.

They can pretty much engage and disengage at will and, aside from the Hound, none of the lower-tech ships can catch them unless they spend tons of OP on Engine boosts.


This needs to be mixed up.  We need fast low-tech ships, for one.  Something that can regularly catch a Tempest when they try to Phase Skip out of combat to vent.  And we need some high-tech ships with Ballistics and low-techs with Energy Weapons.  Make them the exceptions that shake things up.

And aside from the Vigilance frigate and the Gemini and Hammerhead destroyers, I don't think we have any Midline smaller ships.  I'm not complaining too much here, because I realize it's still early.  But the Tri-Tachyon fleets dominating everything else simply because they're better ships gets old pretty fast.
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PCCL

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #332 on: June 12, 2013, 09:53:52 PM »

1) yes it does matter in combat because the logistics involved means there will usually be less high tech ships on the field at any given time

2) a fast brawler low tech ship might be nice, yes, might like to see that at some point

3) you forgot the brawler, sunder and (if we are counting civvies) valkyrie
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flanker37t

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #333 on: June 13, 2013, 02:27:16 AM »

Small Tri-Tach ships are a lot faster, but that's perfectly normal. Heavier hi-tech ships are slow. Onslaught, Dominator and Enforcer are the fastest ships in their categories. They don't need powerful shields because it takes three anti-matter shots to just break the armor. Their firepower is overwhelming. Conquest is the most agile battlecruiser, it has 25% more powerful generators than the Odyssey, two times more weapons and three times more speed. Sunder with a plasma cannon or three heavy blasters can destroy cruisers and battlecruisers in 1-on-1 fights. I sincerely don't see your point, Nanostrike. ::)
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Nanostrike

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #334 on: June 13, 2013, 09:39:29 AM »

Small Tri-Tach ships are a lot faster, but that's perfectly normal. Heavier hi-tech ships are slow. Onslaught, Dominator and Enforcer are the fastest ships in their categories. They don't need powerful shields because it takes three anti-matter shots to just break the armor. Their firepower is overwhelming. Conquest is the most agile battlecruiser, it has 25% more powerful generators than the Odyssey, two times more weapons and three times more speed. Sunder with a plasma cannon or three heavy blasters can destroy cruisers and battlecruisers in 1-on-1 fights. I sincerely don't see your point, Nanostrike. ::)

I'm referring mostly to the Frigates and Destroyers.  The Tri-Tach ones absolutely destroy their lower-tech rivals ridiculously easy due to Speed being so important and Shields being so much better than armor.  It's been this way from the beginning.  Something needs to be done to shake that up.  Especially in the Frigate department.

Aside from the Hound, ALL Low-Tech/Midline Frigates seem to be crawling compared to the Tempest and Hyperion (Not even counting their teleporters!).  And that's the biggest thing that aggravates me.  It makes them INCREDIBLY frustrating to fight because, if they're well piloted, you can't catch them at all and they can fight until their flux is high, then just retreat, vent, and repeat.

Unless you get a very lucky hit or two on them, there's very little you can do against this.  However, the entire issue would be taken down a peg with some faster Low-Tech/Midline ships.  Make them fragile or whatever to compensate, but just give some comparable speed!

The problem isn't quite as bad with Destroyers and more-or-less vanishes by the Cruiser stage.  But with Frigates, the options are sorely limited.  I'm not saying there's anything wrong with the current ships.  Just that we need more of them to even out some balance issues that are starting to be pretty glaring.
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flanker37t

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #335 on: June 13, 2013, 01:20:11 PM »

Ah, I see and totally agree. Low- and mid-tech frigates suck like a black hole. They are cheaper, you can get four Lashers for the same money as a single Tempest, but the bad thing is that Tempest will destroy all four without breaking a sweat.
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Faiter119

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #336 on: June 13, 2013, 02:15:30 PM »

Ah, I see and totally agree. Low- and mid-tech frigates suck like a black hole. They are cheaper, you can get four Lashers for the same money as a single Tempest, but the bad thing is that Tempest will destroy all four without breaking a sweat.

Remember that ships aren't balanced around a 1v1 scenario though. They are useful in different scenarios.
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Reshy

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #337 on: June 13, 2013, 05:19:41 PM »

Quote
Extra CR cost for suffering a flameout of [sic] weapons being disabled by damage

Doesn't this disproportionately affect Hedgemony forces?  I mean they take armor hits all the time and therefore weapons fall offline much more often than the other two factions.  Also will Automated Repair Unit mitigate the effect of the CR loss?
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Nanostrike

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #338 on: June 14, 2013, 09:24:09 AM »

Ah, I see and totally agree. Low- and mid-tech frigates suck like a black hole. They are cheaper, you can get four Lashers for the same money as a single Tempest, but the bad thing is that Tempest will destroy all four without breaking a sweat.

This was my main point.  I get that Low-Tech ships are good at other stuff.  But right now the gap is so huge that it borders on ridiculous with Frigates.  And it's mostly because of the speed gap.

Also, I STILL can't find a way to make the Brawler useful.  It's just so slow that it tends to just sputter around hopelessly trying to catch anything...
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PCCL

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #339 on: June 14, 2013, 09:33:59 AM »

I use brawlers as small fire support platforms for larger brawls (brawlers, get it?), park them behind cruisers or destroyers with either full anti armor for finishing (dual chaingun and dual LAG) or full anti shield to give your big ships an edge (all needlers if possible, dual HAC and DLAC otherwise)

They aren't meant for small frigate fights, I'll give it that, they're more like pocket destroyers (all the firing profile of the head of a hammerhead with universals instead of missiles to boot, just no PD)
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flanker37t

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #340 on: June 15, 2013, 12:56:02 AM »

I think the problem is that currently players progress in the campaign very-very fast. Maybe in the full game, when one can't buy a Hyperion after destroying a couple Buffalos, players will use Brawlers because they simply have to use something? Restricting some ships to make others useful is not a good thing.

I use brawlers as small fire support platforms for larger brawls

Omens are much more useful as support ships, they are faster, their shields are definitely better, they can obliterate a missile salvo with their EMP and they cost mere 6.6K. Tempests are excellent harassers. Medusa-class is best as a Capital escort.
Also, IMO Brawlers are useless in larger brawls, because the first shot from a capital overloads them, the second finishes them. And they have mobility of a destroyer, they rarely can move out of the harm's way. Brawler isn't even a frigate, it's a gunship! It should be faster, if you think about it.
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PCCL

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #341 on: June 15, 2013, 02:08:13 AM »

omens have no firepower worth a damn as far as cruiser sized battles go. If you let brawlers take cover behind your bigger ships and pop out to fire they can survive quite long. Frigates wise, their single target firepower is amazing. They are glass cannons though
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Nanostrike

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #342 on: June 15, 2013, 04:17:48 PM »

I use brawlers as small fire support platforms for larger brawls (brawlers, get it?), park them behind cruisers or destroyers with either full anti armor for finishing (dual chaingun and dual LAG) or full anti shield to give your big ships an edge (all needlers if possible, dual HAC and DLAC otherwise)

They aren't meant for small frigate fights, I'll give it that, they're more like pocket destroyers (all the firing profile of the head of a hammerhead with universals instead of missiles to boot, just no PD)

I mostly do Frigate-Level skirmishes, so I guess that's why I find them useless.  Against Frigates, they're almost pointless to have, because they just get kited and destroyed.

But I suppose against bigger ships, they could do some serious damage against an overloaded target.



Omens are far superior in the support role, though.  Not only do they use the EMP on missiles, but they frequently fly behind enemy shield arcs and EMP capital ships, bringing down weapons and flaming out engines.  Not to mention that they're fast (Seeing a pattern here?  Fast ships, excluding the Hound, are almost always superior to the slower ones...), have good shields (Another pattern here...), and can pack decent firepower.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #343 on: June 15, 2013, 07:19:29 PM »

About auto-resolve:  I *ABUSE* this feature mercilessly (as in EVERY fight after gaining some ships), for without it, my level soft cap would be in the low 30's, instead of the mid-40's to low-50's.  I can max Leadership and Technology, assemble a fleet that can win all auto-resolved battles against everything including system defense fleets, then max out combat after the power leveling session.

If auto-resolve must go, I like to see experience gains from combat skyrocket to make level grinding less of a chore.  Even if auto-resolve stays, taking time to fight yourself should grant a massive experience bonus to discourage the use of auto-resolve for the sole purpose of power leveling.
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BillyRueben

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Re: Starsector 0.6a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #344 on: June 15, 2013, 07:29:38 PM »

Spoiler
About auto-resolve:  I *ABUSE* this feature mercilessly (as in EVERY fight after gaining some ships), for without it, my level soft cap would be in the low 30's, instead of the mid-40's to low-50's.  I can max Leadership and Technology, assemble a fleet that can win all auto-resolved battles against everything including system defense fleets, then max out combat after the power leveling session.

If auto-resolve must go, I like to see experience gains from combat skyrocket to make level grinding less of a chore.  Even if auto-resolve stays, taking time to fight yourself should grant a massive experience bonus to discourage the use of auto-resolve for the sole purpose of power leveling.
[close]

Chances are there are going to be other ways of leveling up without combat. This was something that always bothered me in Mount & Blade: Why do I get better at trading after killing people? It makes no sense.

Besides, auto-resolve isn't a fun feature, it is a solution to a symptom.
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