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News:

Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

Poll

What would you like to see in Blackrock?

More ships
- 755 (23.7%)
More weapons
- 481 (15.1%)
More campaign features
- 478 (15%)
Space monsters
- 705 (22.1%)
More lore
- 207 (6.5%)
More music
- 131 (4.1%)
More portraits
- 157 (4.9%)
Subfactions
- 277 (8.7%)

Total Members Voted: 1425


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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards  (Read 1790749 times)

AeusDeif

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2040 on: January 08, 2016, 03:36:57 AM »

hey, quick question, is there a way to tweak how rare these ships are in game, specifically in markets? I like the mod but want to keep a predominantly low-tech feel, so I thought it'd be nice to make BRDY tech harder to find.
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Wyvern

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2041 on: January 09, 2016, 10:59:33 AM »

Oh hey, speaking of weapons - I was just digging through the files, trying to figure out why the argus PD systems felt so much weaker than they used to.  And I found some things of note:

The first is that these weapons never got buffed when increased damage from high flux was removed from the game.

The second is that - for reasons I do not fully understand - they underperform against moving targets; an Argus Particle Beam, with its current stats, should be able to take out a salamander missile in two hits (same as burst PD); in actual practice, it requires three.  It looks like this has something to do with the autofire AI not tracking properly - when I add sufficient range mods for it to shoot at a salamander that's still on a straight line approach, it does manage to kill the missile in the expected two shots.

Testing against ships demonstrates some additional foibles.  The big one is that the game engine only calculates beam damage in tenth-of-a-second ticks; so when the Argus PD Array (for example) is "supposed" to fire for .28 seconds for a total burst damage of ~308, it actually only fires for .2 seconds, for a total burst damage of ~220.  (And no, I have no idea why the Codex claims that weapon "should" be doing 235 damage per burst; it's clearly not.)
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Cycerin

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2042 on: January 09, 2016, 11:04:34 AM »

That's due to the way alex altered the way PD beam weapons aim in 0.7 - it seems to punish burst beams with extremely short fire durations.

I've been thinking of ways to combat it but I need to consider options a bit further.

Interesting with the tick mechanic though, I actually wasn't aware of that.

hey, quick question, is there a way to tweak how rare these ships are in game, specifically in markets? I like the mod but want to keep a predominantly low-tech feel, so I thought it'd be nice to make BRDY tech harder to find.

You would need to spend a lot of time tweaking BRDY variants, as well as fleet compositions in the .faction file, which would have undesireable side-effects. So not really.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2016, 11:07:22 AM by Cycerin »
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Adraius

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2043 on: January 09, 2016, 11:08:07 AM »

Oh hey, speaking of weapons - I was just digging through the files, trying to figure out why the argus PD systems felt so much weaker than they used to.  And I found some things of note:

The first is that these weapons never got buffed when increased damage from high flux was removed from the game.

The second is that - for reasons I do not fully understand - they underperform against moving targets; an Argus Particle Beam, with its current stats, should be able to take out a salamander missile in two hits (same as burst PD); in actual practice, it requires three.  It looks like this has something to do with the autofire AI not tracking properly - when I add sufficient range mods for it to shoot at a salamander that's still on a straight line approach, it does manage to kill the missile in the expected two shots.

Testing against ships demonstrates some additional foibles.  The big one is that the game engine only calculates beam damage in tenth-of-a-second ticks; so when the Argus PD Array (for example) is "supposed" to fire for .28 seconds for a total burst damage of ~308, it actually only fires for .2 seconds, for a total burst damage of ~220.  (And no, I have no idea why the Codex claims that weapon "should" be doing 235 damage per burst; it's clearly not.)
Oh wow, I thought I was just crazy.  I've noticed the Argus line of weaponry underperforming as well.  The beams seem to sometimes "slip past" missiles on a guided approach - even very slow missiles, IIRC.  Good to hear you're aware of the issue. =)
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AeusDeif

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2044 on: January 09, 2016, 01:44:45 PM »

hey, quick question, is there a way to tweak how rare these ships are in game, specifically in markets? I like the mod but want to keep a predominantly low-tech feel, so I thought it'd be nice to make BRDY tech harder to find.

You would need to spend a lot of time tweaking BRDY variants, as well as fleet compositions in the .faction file, which would have undesireable side-effects. So not really.

I appreciate the answer. Mind me asking what the side-effects would be?
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2045 on: January 09, 2016, 01:53:37 PM »

Side effects would be that all brdy fleets and markets are completely different. The generation of ships and weapons is now chiefly based on the .faction file of the faction owning the market, and the variants of the ships referred to in that file, then modified by stability.

Thanks for the prompt bug report Wyvern! I'm glad to see that it was a bug so that the Argus line can stay viable.

For the time being I think I'll tweak a few things so that they work better until the patch hits, then revert.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2016, 01:55:09 PM by Cycerin »
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Snrasha

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2046 on: January 10, 2016, 01:58:59 AM »

Question:
I can add Morpheus in special list in a utility mod, who if defeated(and disabled) have big chance of have a boarding this ship?
If no, a other special ship? If no, again, thank you.
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I am pretty bad on english. So, sorry in advance.

Gladiator Society
Add battle options on Com Relay/ Framework for modders for add their own bounty.

Sanguinary Autonomist Defectors A fan-mod of Shadowyard.

Taverius

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2047 on: January 13, 2016, 03:50:47 PM »

So I got bored and decided to sit and get shot at by a Caesar with nothing but PD on my Onslaught, because I wanted to figure out which PD was best. This did not solve my boredom issue.

Anyways, I'm still playing - and its certainly empirical and not scientific - but the Shredder Battery (10 OP) doesn't feel noticeably better than an el-cheapo Flak Cannon (8 OP) at missile-PD. It might even be slightly worse. It is however noticeably better than the Heavy Machine Gun (also 10 OP).

Can't comment on balance here, just presenting my results :)
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No faction is truly established without a themed Buffalo (TAG) variant.

Sy

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2048 on: January 13, 2016, 04:37:25 PM »

i think the primary advantage of the Shredder Battery is that it absolutely murders ships when hitting exposed hull. and it's probably also better against fightercraft, at least the slow/large kind that are reliably hit even without the proximity fuse.
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ProdigyToby

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2049 on: January 15, 2016, 07:38:15 AM »

  Is anyone else getting a weird bug where any weapon group with a scalaron blaster enters battle with autofire turned off?  I was wondering why some of my weapons weren't firing and it appears that even though in the refit screen my weapon groups are set to autofire, those with scalaron automatically turn off when entering battle? 
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Taverius

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2050 on: January 15, 2016, 07:58:19 AM »

Weird, not happening here. Unless you mean on AI ships - they never set ScBs to autofire.
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HELMUT

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2051 on: January 15, 2016, 07:59:42 AM »

I got something like that too but it's not linked to mods. It seems to happen when you let the AI take control of your flagship, it will disable autofire on some weapon group, even when you take back control of it. It can happen when you give an order to your fleet on the command screen and accidentally include your flagship (which automatically engage auto-pilot).
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Taverius

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2052 on: January 15, 2016, 09:26:53 AM »

Yeah, because the AI makes its own decisions about autofire. Sometimes these decisions are questionable, but considering the random variants in SS+ its better than it not doing it.
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ProdigyToby

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2053 on: January 15, 2016, 02:18:40 PM »

Weird, not happening here. Unless you mean on AI ships - they never set ScBs to autofire.

  That might be it.  at the begining of battle I order all of my ships around including mine, then retake control of it once its in the position i want.  So the AI turns off Scalarons?
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:21:57 PM by ProdigyToby »
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Taverius

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Re: [0.7.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.8.1 - Updated
« Reply #2054 on: January 15, 2016, 04:02:10 PM »

The AI makes its own decisions regarding autofire, and it never leaves a group that's only ScBs turned on - its probably set not to autofire Strike weapons.
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