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Author Topic: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter  (Read 2760 times)

naufrago

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AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« on: August 03, 2012, 08:07:41 AM »

Bugs:
Phase Skimmer- Assigning a ship with Phase Skimmer to escort duty causes the ship to phase skim in whatever direction it's heading instead of toward its intended target.
Phase Teleporter- Sometimes teleporting confuses the enemy AI and causes them to drop shields and/or vent flux at inappropriate times.

How to Reproduce:
Phase Skimmer- Fly a Medusa and Wolf into a battle (other combinations probably work, haven't tested). Immediately assign a Light Escort to the Medusa, which assigns the Wolf. When the game un-pauses, the Wolf instantly burns its 3 phase skimmer charges, then begins heading toward the Medusa. It seems like it's activating the Phase Skimmer to get to the Medusa more quickly, but its vector isn't facing towards the Medusa yet, so it just jumps farther away. Reproducible every time.

Phase Teleporter- Grab a Hyperion and equip it with burst pd lasers and phase beams or pulse lasers (I didn't equip missiles, but that may not change anything). Run a simulation and deploy a Venture. Occasionally after teleporting (to its back and side, mainly- if the Venture's front is 12 o'clock, I tend to teleport to about 8 or 7), the Venture will drop its shields and not activate them for several seconds, regardless of the state of its armor. Sometimes happens after the Venture finishes venting flux, sometimes causes the Venture to vent its flux. I'll get a screenshot.

Edit: The Venture doesn't shoot at the Hyperion while the Venture's shields aren't up either. It's like it doesn't see it as a threat at all, for some reason.

Also, it won't let me upload a screenshot due to the following error:
Quote
An Error Has Occurred!

The upload folder is full. Please try a smaller file and/or contact an administrator.

Reducing the file size has no effect. The screenshot wouldn't be much use anyway- it's just me shooting at a Venture with its shields down from the 8 o'clock position while it has zero flux.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 09:35:32 AM by naufrago »
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Griffinhart

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2012, 09:06:26 AM »

I have no input re: your bug report, but for the image, you can try off-site image hosting. I use imgur.com (fast, free, no account required, etc.).

-- Griffinhart
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naufrago

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2012, 09:20:40 AM »

I have no input re: your bug report, but for the image, you can try off-site image hosting. I use imgur.com (fast, free, no account required, etc.).

-- Griffinhart

Well, I deleted the screenshot since it wasn't terribly useful, but I'll keep that imgur.com thing in mind for the future. I didn't realize that it doesn't require an account.
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Wyvern

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2012, 09:23:59 AM »

Possibly related: I've seen a Hyperion, assigned to capture a point, start flying towards it... and then teleport away from it.  Very odd.
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Alex

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2012, 11:02:37 AM »

Hey there thanks for the report, but neither of the two behaviors in the OP are actually bugs :)

With the Phase Skimmer, it's trying to get away from the map edge ASAP - all ships do this, it's just more prominent with the skimmer.

With the Venture, what it's trying to do is turn toward the Hyperion faster - so it's dropping shields and venting flux to get the 0-flux speed and turning boost. Now, that's somewhat futile given the Hyperion's teleporter - but at least it's trying to do *something*. It's not going to fare very well regardless of what it does.
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naufrago

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2012, 01:16:00 PM »

Hey there thanks for the report, but neither of the two behaviors in the OP are actually bugs :)

With the Phase Skimmer, it's trying to get away from the map edge ASAP - all ships do this, it's just more prominent with the skimmer.

With the Venture, what it's trying to do is turn toward the Hyperion faster - so it's dropping shields and venting flux to get the 0-flux speed and turning boost. Now, that's somewhat futile given the Hyperion's teleporter - but at least it's trying to do *something*. It's not going to fare very well regardless of what it does.

I disagree with you about the Phase Skimmer part. If I start a battle with just a Wolf and a Medusa and assign no orders, the Wolf is much more conservative in its use of the Phase Skimmer- it uses one charge, then uses the charges as they come, then uses it a little more aggressively when enemies appear. As soon as you assign it the escort order, it burns all the charges, then turns around to fly towards its escort target.

I think the assumption you're making in my report is that they're starting at the edge of the map. I have JUST a Medusa and Wolf (no other ships in my fleet), so it's using the maps without the nodes, meaning I start far from the edges.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 01:21:31 PM by naufrago »
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Alex

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2012, 07:50:16 PM »

Thanks for clarifying - you're absolutely right. That was a pretty evil bug, too (fixed now).

What was happening is it'd still be intent on doing what it was doing before for a few seconds, but now had more urgency to it from having an order assigned. So it assumed that the direction it wanted to go was towards its new objective (the ship it was assigned to escort), which wasn't the case.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 07:53:02 PM by Alex »
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Shiwanabe

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2012, 05:24:25 PM »

Something I feel is worth mentioning to do with the AI issues when fighting the teleporter is that the 'failure states' area drastically more detrimental to the ship under attack than just raising it's shields and returning fire with what PD weapons it has. (in particular I caused this state fairly commonly when fighting Mules)

Also, there is a third state that can occur which is the ship repeatedly vents flux as it gains it (from said PD weapons I think, can't remember clearly) thus causing it to take all the damage that the Hyperion causes before it falls back.

In regards to what's causing it, it appears to not only be the behavious you described but also something to do with the new behaviour of dropping and reraising shields to rotate them more quickly. Something about the state of having the shields down seems to cause a re-evaluation of their circumstances and they seem to assume the shields were dropped due to maxed flux and therefore start venting to get rid of it, thus taking far more damage than they should've.
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Griffinhart

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Re: AI Issues w/ Phase Skimmer and Teleporter
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2012, 09:17:20 PM »

Something I've noticed while fighting Wolves: sometimes, they like to teleport forward or backward, while facing me, my ship, and my ship's guns.

Teleporting forward isn't so bad, as the Wolf will put incoming shots behind itself (assuming the AI doesn't misjudge its teleport distance vs. incoming fire's velocity and port into the live ordnance).

Teleporting backward usually results in a grievously wounded, or hilariously exploded, Wolf (see previous parenthetical for why).

Is this Working As Intendedâ„¢, or a bug?

-- Griffinhart
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"