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Starsector 0.98a is out! (03/27/25)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 259326 times)

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1110 on: April 22, 2025, 05:24:30 PM »

It appears Rao Orcus no mission bug is not fixed in 0.98 RC8, at least for saves made in earlier version. I met Rao in RC8 though.

Right, that one requires a new save.

null pointer error for buying off the tri tach mercs still exists

Are you on the latest version of the game? That bug is *definitely* fixed, so if it's still crashing somewhere, it's a different issue and I'd love to see the stack trace, if possible!

This is a great strategy, because anything you kill at furthest point will die for sure. If you lure those ship away from fabricator, you may interdict the swarm from reaching the fab. Thus avoiding the "infinite regen corpse wall" effect that protects the fab. Anything fab make will consume CR. If you do it normally, you will find fab surrounded with ships. And any ship that die near fabricator will get instantly reclaimed, and their replacement reconstructed instantly.

(That does indeed sound like a good strategy, though "instantly" here means "like 30 seconds in total", or somewhere thereabouts, so it's still quite possible to push push the Fabricators and take down their defenses directly, though that probably requires a bit more of your fleet overall.)
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Doctorhealsgood

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1111 on: April 22, 2025, 07:14:11 PM »

Huh. That's a first. Not complaining though.
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TK3600

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1112 on: April 22, 2025, 07:17:14 PM »

There is a bit of gap between dead ship to reclaim, but that is not something you can exploit. The ship wreck will block line of sight to fabricator, so you end up waiting it out. The gap between reclaiming and reconstruction feels effectively instant.
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Vanshilar

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1113 on: April 22, 2025, 07:37:36 PM »

The Anubis issue was specific to a ship having fighters, and the flux generation from having "engage" turned on. Basically that amount was framerate dependent and at 30 fps it was enough to make the ship think that it should just keep backing off until it finishes dissipating that final bit of flux, which it never would until it pulled back the fighters.

Huh! Okay then this is something completely different. I still see the frigates that I send to capture objectives (usually LP Brawlers) sometimes running away at low/zero flux when given an Eliminate order on a Glimmer or Lumen, I just haven't reported it yet because by the time I see it, the frigate is already far away so I have no idea what caused it. The times when I'm focusing on the frigates, it hasn't happened yet. I was hoping it'd be fixed. But all I can say right now is "it still happens" and nothing about "what makes it happen" so...guess I'll post something when I see it as it happens and can provide more insight as to what's going on.

So uh why do the mass drivers got a price increase? The heavy costs the same as a Heavy needler and the light more than an antimatter blaster or a light needler

Oh I definitely think the HMD is worth the cost increase. In side-by-side comparison testing on Onslaughts vs double Ordos, the HMD did more damage than Heavy Needlers *and* was more damage/flux efficient (both probably because of the longer range, so it hit shields more often). It'll probably be my go-to moving forward for medium ballistics, along with HVD, depending really on whether or not the ship has Ballistic Rangefinder (and even if it doesn't, HMD may still end up better).

The LMD, though, not so much -- Light Needlers did more damage, though LMD's were more damage/flux efficient. So it's a bit of a tradeoff between if you want more damage output or be more flux-efficient with your weapons.

A lot of the new things feel like they’re mostly there to screw phase ships in particular, which i don’t really understand? Phase AI is already very hard to work with.

I think it's more the player using phase ships, rather than AI using phase ships.

Speaking of things the AI doesn't use well, the Retribution definitely needs a buff - they get eviscerated in the first few seconds of any fight against the Luddic Church. Even piloted well, it's not the equal of SO Aurora or Odyssey, though.
I've generally found the Retribution to be an amazingly un-useful ship... ...Prior to 0.98. Now I have one with 2x each of Kinetic, Seeker, and Unstable Fragment missile systems, and it actually works pretty well.

Actually for me, in 0.97a the Retribution was extremely strong against Ordos -- and in fact, could often beat the Onslaught in terms of damage output, using less DP to boot. It was one of two capitals which could beat Gryphon spam (the Conquest being the other one); for all other capitals I tested, it was better to just use the equivalent DP in Gryphons, no matter the amount of the capitals in the player fleet. I was going to do a 3-minute double Ordos video with an even better time in 0.97a using Retributions instead of Conquests in the middle, except 0.98a then dropped.

I haven't tried Retributions in 0.98a yet but I suspect that it'll perform even better against Ordos now, especially with HMD and especially since it won't be affected by the extra PD very much; in 0.97a, less than 20% of its damage was from missiles, whereas about half of the Conquest's damage was from missiles (and obviously, Gryphons were very missile-centric). If Ordos fleets are now tuned to be more anti-missiles, and thus less strong against straight-up in-your-face tactics, then the Retribution should do very well. (And at some point I'll mess around with the new Threat missiles as well to see if they work better than the standard Harpoons.) So I don't think a buff is needed.

I suspect that the Retribution will also do very well if the player fleet is using a Mk1, since they're both high-damage, in-your-face ships.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1114 on: April 22, 2025, 08:00:52 PM »

There is a bit of gap between dead ship to reclaim, but that is not something you can exploit. The ship wreck will block line of sight to fabricator, so you end up waiting it out. The gap between reclaiming and reconstruction feels effectively instant.

I mean, that can happen, sure! But it also definitely doesn't happen all the time, and it can also be mitigated by maneuvering your ship, more so with more mobile ships, of course.

Huh! Okay then this is something completely different. I still see the frigates that I send to capture objectives (usually LP Brawlers) sometimes running away at low/zero flux when given an Eliminate order on a Glimmer or Lumen, I just haven't reported it yet because by the time I see it, the frigate is already far away so I have no idea what caused it. The times when I'm focusing on the frigates, it hasn't happened yet. I was hoping it'd be fixed. But all I can say right now is "it still happens" and nothing about "what makes it happen" so...guess I'll post something when I see it as it happens and can provide more insight as to what's going on.

I'll keep an eye out for it, as well. I *did* fix something related to it, so hopefully it happens less, at any rate :) Oftentimes stuff like this might have multiple causes.
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SCC

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1115 on: April 22, 2025, 10:26:15 PM »


Actually for me, in 0.97a the Retribution was extremely strong against Ordos -- and in fact, could often beat the Onslaught in terms of damage output, using less DP to boot. It was one of two capitals which could beat Gryphon spam (the Conquest being the other one); for all other capitals I tested, it was better to just use the equivalent DP in Gryphons, no matter the amount of the capitals in the player fleet. I was going to do a 3-minute double Ordos video with an even better time in 0.97a using Retributions instead of Conquests in the middle, except 0.98a then dropped.
It would have been interesting to see.

bestban

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1116 on: April 23, 2025, 12:14:51 AM »

Mouse pointer disappears from the start of the game. Can't play. What could be a solution? Thanks.
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Ripmorld

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1117 on: April 23, 2025, 12:15:16 AM »

Played around with shouded lens after the update , have to admit they are still really bad in my experience. To me they seem more like some form of crutch for certain ships (nova) that have really poor PD placement , or some gimmicky interaction that bypasses limitations (monitor/paragon/mora etc).
Their hitstrength and range is too low for them to be of any amount of significance for anti ship purposes. And even as PD they are reallllly bad PD xP.
  • It doesn't ignore flares, And PDai doesn't make them ignore flares
  • It have horrible flux efficiency for point defense , like seriously this is just a flux hog for no reason
  • It have 400 range that cannot be increased by any means , like your normal PD laser which have 500 range can be increased to 800 range with capital grade ITU, here is can just barely hit out of a capitals frame
  • It is also horribly inconstant , which is one of the worst things you can have for a PD , is that you know for a fact you can't rely on it
The OP shave helped it a bit but doesn't solve the core issue , I understand alex want to make it niche by giving it limitations but this is straight up still just a bad use of OP. I think if alex quartered the flux generation and gave it scaling range to hull size it will be much more acceptable , since while its inconstant and low impact it won't at least be such a flux drain.
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TK3600

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1118 on: April 23, 2025, 12:34:55 AM »

Personally I would not use shround hull mod unless it is kinda OP. The church hating you alone is enough of an inconvenience already. I also have donated a church colony for my ordo farm. This makes the farm unusable.
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Lawrence Master-blaster

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1119 on: April 23, 2025, 04:07:45 AM »

I dunno how intended this is, but when Mk I takes explosive damage on vambraces, some of it passes through onto the actual ship. I.e. the game applies the 21-cell damage matrix to the vambrace and because hull is close enough to the outer cells, it takes damage as well.

(I assume stations are the same, only I never noticed because they're larger?)
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Ragnarok101

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1120 on: April 23, 2025, 06:00:18 AM »

The Astral changes are interesting.

Between the targeting core now being compatible with advanced optics, the Trident getting a fairly major buff, and the buffs to carrier skills, using one as a flagship is actually quite possible. I can run a Longbow+trident+drones horde that takes minimal casualties to PD and can insta-kill destroyers, hard-pressure cruisers, and hammer at capital ships just as well as a 'conventional' ship, with relatively minimal risk to myself since with the energy beam combos the Astral can really reach out and hit someone in a manner similar to the Paragon.

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Mishrak

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1121 on: April 23, 2025, 08:09:53 AM »

@Mishrak: btw, finally had a chance to fight against a "many Hives and Overseets" fleet, that was a fun experience, haha. So many missiles! Managed to do it with my Eagles/Odyssey fleet with some minor losses. Was interesting trying to time the fragment missile waves from the Hives and make sure shields/getting away was an option at the right moment.

Spoiler


[close]
Heck yeah.  Your Doom was AI controlled?  Pretty interesting to see that working.

Speaking of things the AI doesn't use well, the Retribution definitely needs a buff - they get eviscerated in the first few seconds of any fight against the Luddic Church. Even piloted well, it's not the equal of SO Aurora or Odyssey, though.
I've generally found the Retribution to be an amazingly un-useful ship... ...Prior to 0.98. Now I have one with 2x each of Kinetic, Seeker, and Unstable Fragment missile systems, and it actually works pretty well.
full spec details
1x Storm Needler, 2x Heavy Mass Driver, 2x Heavy Mauler, 2x Hellbore, 7x Vulcan, aforementioned missile systems, 55 vents, fragment swarm, resistant flux conduits, hardened shields, armored weapon mounts, s-modded solar shielding (still haven't decided what else to s-mod on it, but it works okay as is).
Officer is level 7 with elite Impact Mitigation, Target Analysis, Missile Specialization, Ballistic Mastery, Polarized Armor, and non-elite damage control and gunnery implants. (I've been considering swapping elite tag from Polarized Armor to Damage Control, but haven't done it yet.)
[close]



As for Threat... Shield the yellow missiles, they're fairly obvious. EMP is annoyingly white-like-everything-else, though. As for tactics... I've had fairly good effect with setting my fleet at the farthest nav point from the fabricators and then bringing my flagship (currently a neural-linked radiant) around to assassinate them. Has trouble with three fabricator fleets, though; my Radiant build is a general-purpose one rather than a missile-heavy burst-damage build and it generally takes two passes per fabricator so there can be CR issues. Still, calling a full retreat after the last fabricator is down is... probably actually faster than my usual mop up the rest of the fleet.

This is a great strategy, because anything you kill at furthest point will die for sure. If you lure those ship away from fabricator, you may interdict the swarm from reaching the fab. Thus avoiding the "infinite regen corpse wall" effect that protects the fab. Anything fab make will consume CR. If you do it normally, you will find fab surrounded with ships. And any ship that die near fabricator will get instantly reclaimed, and their replacement reconstructed instantly.

Another observation is their PD is really good. I thought bomber spam would be a counter to the armor spam, but they gets blocked reliably. When I see the stats on their PD, it dont feel very strong, but it works really well in practice.
This is definitely an interesting strategy.  Trying to fight them straight up has been among the hardest things I've done so far.  I'll have to try this out and see how that plays out.

About finding Threat fleets, you guys might just had bad RNGs. My systems are 90% INFESTED with Threat fleets. Now I do go deep into the Abyss, but I really don't need to look out for them. There's almost too much of them. Also, I never needed to use the Neutrino Detector : at least one Threat fleet is always in range of an Active Sensor Burst. I jump in, launch an Active Sensor Burst and if it doesn't find anything, I get out and find a next system.


Feels like sometimes they just spawn too far away. I've found Threat that didn't show up in initial pings by doing an active scanning pattern around the rock.  Although maybe that's the system you are referring to, I'm unfamiliar with it.

It is just RNG, and it just feels bad when you want to find them and can't.  It's exacerbated by how long it takes to get to them and how slow you move around in the Abyss.  This could probably be relaxed a bit from where it is currently with no adverse affects.  I've been into systems where I've flown around for 2-3 minutes in every direction and found nothing, despite Neutrino pings showing activity.  I've had 4 consecutive systems of doing this before finding one.  I've had ~45 minutes go by once while looking where I didn't find a single threat encounter.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2025, 08:39:09 AM by Mishrak »
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Bungee_man

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1122 on: April 23, 2025, 08:56:56 AM »

Okay, two things about the new build:

* I found a minor bug with the new Salvor's Tally system. If you get survey data for a planet with ruins you've already explored, the salvor's tally will put a permanent "unexplored ruins" item on the relevant system, with no matching set of ruins to explore.

* I've finally figured out how the Anubis works, and I've concluded that it's the most fun, ridiculous ship in the game. I've stuck an HIL, two Paladins, a Swarm Launcher, converted hanger, expanded deck crew, and just enough Flash bombers to get me to exactly 240 DP (by skipping CH on half as many ships as not, and taking ITU instead), and it's the most absurd thing. The HIL might overflux it in normal conditions, but if you're using the fighter bays, low DP, and universal mounts right, it compounds the missile/fighter saturation enormously by forcing shields up and forcing them into a single direction out of the dozen directions dangerous things are coming from. I've skipped hullmods and flux stats that any other ship would have, left a medium universal mount completely empty, forced it into a dozen different unconventional directions that'd be mutually exclusive anywhere else, and the horrible thing I've made not only works, but works exceptionally. In conjunction with my flagship, a much less optimized version of this build beat the special bounty with only a single Anubis lost (due to poor micromanagement on my part).

* Is fragment coordinator bad, or do I misunderstand how it works? I don't ever see any of my ships at high enough fragment count for a capacity increase to be worth having.

If anyone's been doing triple Paladin on the Anubis, I'd encourage you to skip some of the flux/range boosts, add an HIL, and put the rest into missiles and fighters that will get it an opening. It's a great ship, but it doesn't want to be a straight-out brawler that outfluxes the enemy. That's the one role it can't fill.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2025, 09:00:40 AM by Bungee_man »
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Mishrak

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1123 on: April 23, 2025, 10:19:27 AM »

Personally, I like the Threat, but I agree that three fab fleets are a little too easy right now, and that things respawn a little too fast in close quarters. I think you could solve both by buffing Threat ships across the board, but adjusting the fabricator economy so that, while they can build their first fleet out at the same rate, things take longer to spawn in afterwards.

Basically, kills two birds with ones stone - makes smaller numbers of Threat ships dangerous enough that having some DP taken up by more fabricators doesn't cripple their effectiveness, makes fabricator respawn time slow enough that having many fabricators is of real use in keeping numbers up in sustained, high-intensity combat.
So I am not crazy for thinking triple fab is actually easier than double fab.

No, you're not crazy.

3 Fabricator is the easiest of the three Fabricator combinations.  1 and 2 Fab can be very similar in difficulty based on the amount of guaranteed hives and overseers.  My personal experience with the fleet combinations I've used has been that 1 Fab has been the hardest, but it's very close to 2 Fab.

I have zero idea what the difference is between Third and Second Strike fleets if the Fabricator amounts are the same.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.98a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #1124 on: April 23, 2025, 10:25:46 AM »

Mouse pointer disappears from the start of the game. Can't play. What could be a solution? Thanks.

Hmm - a quick solution would be to edit data/config/settings.json and set useSoftwareMouseCursor to true.

IIRC this can happen when you have mouse cursor trails turned on in windows, so if that's the case, turning them off should also do the job.


  • It have 400 range that cannot be increased by any means , like your normal PD laser which have 500 range can be increased to 800 range with capital grade ITU, here is can just barely hit out of a capitals frame

One thing worth nothing here is the 400 range is in addition to the "targeting oval" of the ship, i.e. an approximation of the ship's size, so its range from the center of the ship actually increases with ship size - basically, it covers roughly the same distance away from the ship, regardless of the size of the ship.

I dunno how intended this is, but when Mk I takes explosive damage on vambraces, some of it passes through onto the actual ship. I.e. the game applies the 21-cell damage matrix to the vambrace and because hull is close enough to the outer cells, it takes damage as well.

(I assume stations are the same, only I never noticed because they're larger?)

Ah, yeah, that's how it works - the game doesn't try to figure out if the armor module "should" have blocked this hit or not given the specific geometry of the impact. Hitting *shields* does prevent the splash from hitting other modules, though.


The Astral changes are interesting.

Between the targeting core now being compatible with advanced optics, the Trident getting a fairly major buff, and the buffs to carrier skills, using one as a flagship is actually quite possible. I can run a Longbow+trident+drones horde that takes minimal casualties to PD and can insta-kill destroyers, hard-pressure cruisers, and hammer at capital ships just as well as a 'conventional' ship, with relatively minimal risk to myself since with the energy beam combos the Astral can really reach out and hit someone in a manner similar to the Paragon.

*thumbs up*


@Mishrak: btw, finally had a chance to fight against a "many Hives and Overseets" fleet, that was a fun experience, haha. So many missiles! Managed to do it with my Eagles/Odyssey fleet with some minor losses. Was interesting trying to time the fragment missile waves from the Hives and make sure shields/getting away was an option at the right moment.

Spoiler


[close]
Heck yeah.  Your Doom was AI controlled?  Pretty interesting to see that working.

Yeah, AI controlled, with a level 7 officer with SysEx. Didn't micro stuff, btw - just gave one set of orders right at the start of the battle ("capture" every objective, two Defend orders right at the top middle of the map, maybe a square apart), and that's it. To me it feels like the "capture" orders are pretty important - the way it goes bad for me is when a Skirmish Unit sneaks through and grabs a point and all of a sudden they can build more stuff.


* I found a minor bug with the new Salvor's Tally system. If you get survey data for a planet with ruins you've already explored, the salvor's tally will put a permanent "unexplored ruins" item on the relevant system, with no matching set of ruins to explore.

I'm not sure what you mean by "get survey data" - by what means, by surveying the planet yourself, or in some other way? Trying to figure out how you can get survey data for a planet you've already explored. From some kind of derelict special?

* I've finally figured out how the Anubis works, and I've concluded that it's the most fun, ridiculous ship in the game. I've stuck an HIL, two Paladins, a Swarm Launcher, converted hanger, expanded deck crew, and just enough Flash bombers to get me to exactly 240 DP (by skipping CH on half as many ships as not, and taking ITU instead), and it's the most absurd thing. The HIL might overflux it in normal conditions, but if you're using the fighter bays, low DP, and universal mounts right, it compounds the missile/fighter saturation enormously by forcing shields up and forcing them into a single direction out of the dozen directions dangerous things are coming from. I've skipped hullmods and flux stats that any other ship would have, left a medium universal mount completely empty, forced it into a dozen different unconventional directions that'd be mutually exclusive anywhere else, and the horrible thing I've made not only works, but works exceptionally. In conjunction with my flagship, a much less optimized version of this build beat the special bounty with only a single Anubis lost (due to poor micromanagement on my part).

That's awesome! Sounds like a fun build, makes me want to try it :)

* Is fragment coordinator bad, or do I misunderstand how it works? I don't ever see any of my ships at high enough fragment count for a capacity increase to be worth having.

It's probably not great, just seems like there should be a way to get more fragments if *something* needs them. I could see it being useful for, perhaps, launching more swarms at the start of a battle, or something along those lines. But I wouldn't expect it to be generally great, it's kind of like flix in that you'd usually (but not always) max vents first and capacitors last.


3 Fabricator is the easiest of the three Fabricator combinations.  1 and 2 Fab can be very similar in difficulty based on the amount of guaranteed hives and overseers.  My personal experience with the fleet combinations I've used has been that 1 Fab has been the hardest, but it's very close to 2 Fab.

Just to confirm: is this from RC8, or prior? The Fabs should be a touch stronger in direct combat in RC8; probably not enough to make a huge difference, but still.
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