Fractal Softworks Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); In-development patch notes for Starsector 0.98a (2/8/25)

Author Topic: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?  (Read 1450 times)

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile

Grendel lore, if I remember correctly, states it was meant to be a drone ship. But when they tried to make an AI pilot a phase ship, it freaked out. And broke or something. Went insane. I don't remember. This would explain why there are no phase Remnant ships. Even though Tri-Tachyon's speciality is phase, kinda. Among other things. Well, their speciality currently is dying. HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH! Oh, hi, Mark.

So... When I was thinking like... "Damn, it'd be cool to have a phase remnant ship. Maybe a cruiser. Or maybe a simple frigate would be enough. Though what it would be like?". I guess one of the challenges of designing a phase remnant ship is that phase ships belong to their own specific bloodlines not affiliated with any other design. Harbinger, Afflictor, Phantom, etc. And on the other hand currently Grendel and Gremlin. Meaning, that if we are to receive a Phase Ship, it would have to be a Remnant that doesn't look like a Remnant. And the question is, what would it look like then? Would it be green for eg?

It'd be really cool to have a green Remnant ship. An emerald one perhaps. Just a thought.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2024, 02:41:31 PM by Killer of Fate »
Logged

eert5rty7u8i9i7u6yrewqdef

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 618
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2024, 03:14:05 PM »

Grendel lore, if I remember correctly, states it was meant to be a drone ship. But when they tried to make an AI pilot a phase ship, it freaked out. And broke or something. Went insane. I don't remember. This would explain why there are no phase Remnant ships. Even though Tri-Tachyon's speciality is phase, kinda. Among other things. Well, their speciality currently is dying. HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH! Oh, hi, Mark.

So... When I was thinking like... "Damn, it'd be cool to have a phase remnant ship. Maybe a cruiser. Or maybe a simple frigate would be enough. Though what it would be like?". I guess one of the challenges of designing a phase remnant ship is that phase ships belong to their own specific bloodlines not affiliated with any other design. Harbinger, Afflictor, Phantom, etc. And on the other hand currently Grendel and Gremlin. Meaning, that if we are to receive a Phase Ship, it would have to be a Remnant that doesn't look like a Remnant. And the question is, what would it look like then? Would it be green for eg?

It'd be really cool to have a green Remnant ship. An emerald one perhaps. Just a thought.
"The brainchild of an eccentric admiral who managed to capture procurement authority over an entire frontier sector, the first prototypes were installed with low-level AI core commanders. The AIs became rapidly unstable, even erratic, after only a handful of phase shifts. Subsequently, the precise details of these experiments were suppressed by an obscure intelligence ministry of the Domain and the project saved only by the admiral's personal intervention. With AI unsuitable, the next best disposable resource was tapped, and the Grendel saw its first combat service on the far fringes crewed almost entirely by Domain Armada penal battalions.""
Meaning Gamma cores are absolutely off limits as clearly it was meant to join the Exploratorium Legions which use almost purely Gamma cores. Beta and Alpha cores may work however.
To keep with current lore, it would at minimum require a Remnant phase ship to always be outfitted with a Beta or Alpha core.
Logged

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2024, 03:46:46 PM »

considering Grendel might be using the same phase technology Gremlin does. Maybe it's more horrid to pilot than an average phase ship. And the general stress of being phased is more tolerable for an AI, if it's simply given a different kind of field.

Though considering all phase seems to inevitably affect the person using them. Assuming this on the dialogue we got with phase mercs sent by Tri-Tachyon, which isn't solid proof. Maybe AIs just aren't fit to pilot phase ships in general, with Gremlin and Grendel being exceptionally bad. But other phase ships not being that better either.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2024, 03:48:25 PM by Killer of Fate »
Logged

Megas

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 12640
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2024, 05:31:17 PM »

Do unofficer'ed automated ships even use AI?  If not, then an automated phase ship could prevent installing an AI core into it and remain compliant with lore.
Logged

Doctorhealsgood

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 948
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2024, 03:18:55 AM »

Do unofficer'ed automated ships even use AI?  If not, then an automated phase ship could prevent installing an AI core into it and remain compliant with lore.
I mean automated ships have by definition have to have some intelligence behind it to work. Then again it is implied that even phase ships use automation to support the crew so maybe it is an interaction that happens with how higher grade AI works.

I should remind people of the fact that the Ziggurat was ran by an Omega that then mysteriously disappeared so...
Then again when we refer to that normal rules do not apply
Logged
Quote from: Doctorhealsgood
Sometimes i feel like my brain has been hit by salamanders not gonna lie.

Nettle

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 788
  • making humorous maneuvers
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2024, 04:57:20 AM »

I should remind people of the fact that the Ziggurat was ran by an Omega that then mysteriously disappeared so...
Then again when we refer to that normal rules do not apply

It's not piloted by Omega, but something else, though considering the brief one-time encounter and small pilot portrait, it's understandable to miss this.
Logged

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2024, 05:18:55 AM »

I should remind people of the fact that the Ziggurat was ran by an Omega that then mysteriously disappeared so...
Then again when we refer to that normal rules do not apply

It's not piloted by Omega, but something else, though considering the brief one-time encounter and small pilot portrait, it's understandable to miss this.
I assumed it was piloted by a crew, but the crew eventually went insane and in the process was converted into something inhuman. I mean, this is why the portrait is a guy, but the guy says nothing and something is just singing to you instead.

(something you can actually hear randomly in the game, as I left the system without the Ziggurat killed, suggesting you were going to end up insane too)
Logged

Nettle

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 788
  • making humorous maneuvers
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2024, 05:48:56 AM »

I assumed it was piloted by a crew, but the crew eventually went insane and in the process was converted into something inhuman. I mean, this is why the portrait is a guy, but the guy says nothing and something is just singing to you instead.

The description you get after successfully defeating and recovering it strongly suggests there was never any crew to begin with, even though the ship is clearly not automated.
Logged

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2024, 05:55:03 AM »

I assumed it was piloted by a crew, but the crew eventually went insane and in the process was converted into something inhuman. I mean, this is why the portrait is a guy, but the guy says nothing and something is just singing to you instead.

The description you get after successfully defeating and recovering it strongly suggests there was never any crew to begin with, even though the ship is clearly not automated.

I assumed the crew got turned into ghosts like the portrait implies.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2024, 06:08:03 AM by Killer of Fate »
Logged

Üstad

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 145
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2024, 09:02:25 AM »

I hope there will be an AI phase ship, right now having kinetic weapons are too important when  dealing with Remnants. Them having phase ships would make it more balanced.
Logged

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2024, 09:48:13 AM »

I hope there will be an AI phase ship, right now having kinetic weapons are too important when  dealing with Remnants. Them having phase ships would make it more balanced.

phase ships tend to have really strong abilities to make up for their short-term combat profile. Making them pick up, similarly to carriers, support roles that fill out warships weaknesses. Afflictor increasing anti-armour damage. Shade dealing tons of EMP in strategic maneuvers, DOOM: Eternal removing the entire fighter presence. Grendel having ridiculous firepower for a cruiser. And Gremlin... Not really.

I've heard a dev of this game... I think it was the writer. But it was some time ago, and my memory is made of cotton candy, talking about making Monitor act as a unit capable of buffing an ally to give them extra durability. Perhaps a Remnant phase ship could have the ability to increase an ally's repair rate, shield effectiveness or reducing hull damage. Hopefully to make up for weaknesses of Nova. And possibly future nerfed Radiant.

Maybe to counter the fact that bringing tons of kinetics to defeat Remnants... The solution would be to have a Remnant that buffs armour, but not in a way that would make it be designed to be extremely effective with low tech ships, but high tech ones instead.
Logged

Princess of Evil

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 930
  • Balance is not an endpoint, but a direction.
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2024, 11:21:04 AM »

So far the lore doesn't really like AI having phase. Even the capital's phase skimmer is considered a miracle (although more due to being capital-sized phase).
Logged
Proof that you don't need to know any languages to translate, you just need to care.

Killer of Fate

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2024, 11:45:46 AM »

So far the lore doesn't really like AI having phase. Even the capital's phase skimmer is considered a miracle (although more due to being capital-sized phase).

not really what the description of Radiant implies. The whole point isn't that it's an AI ship that causes the Phase Skimmer to be unstable, but the fact that Radiant weights like forty billion, trillion, morbillion tonnes, and yet can teleport around like it was a freaking cat on a bicycle.
Logged

Beep Boop

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 231
    • View Profile
Re: does Grendel lore imply there will never be an AI phase ship?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2024, 08:40:18 AM »

Do unofficer'ed automated ships even use AI?
They just use CaptainGPT.
Logged