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Author Topic: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known  (Read 1872 times)

SafariJohn

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Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« on: July 31, 2022, 05:57:56 AM »

To encourage using your own ships and discourage using captured enemy ships (without penalizing rare one-off ships like Ziggurat), I suggest halving the supplies per month of ships that you have the BP for.

This would also incentivize using civilian ships early on because most of their BPs are already known.

Another aspect I think would be beneficial is it would make it easier for new players to manage their supplies.


Only thing is I am not sure how to explain this bonus. Maybe add a new "BP Known" line to ship stat cards with a tooltip?
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Grievous69

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2022, 06:14:02 AM »

But once you're producing your own ships, you pretty much don't care about the running fleet costs.

What seems to be an annoyance on the other hand is availability of supplies and fuel. It's so tedious going around markets just trying to top off because you had a mission that's far away. And this isn't even with some crazy fleets, this is a normal 240 DP fleet with 2 capitals. Fuel is especially draining ridiculously fast so I just have Efficiency Overhaul on all cruisers and capitals, and I usually take the fuel industry skill purely to have a more comfortable experience.

Waystations on my colonies are a lifesaver but creating a bunch of colonies in all directions is boring and takes a while.

EDIT: Not to mention the fact that my puny colony has more supplies and fuel than entire star systems in the core.
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gG_pilot

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2022, 10:24:50 AM »

(somewhat snipped)
annoyance  is availability of supplies and fuel. It's so tedious going around markets just trying to top off because you had a mission that's far away. This isn't even with some crazy fleets, this is a normal 240 DP fleet
I usually take the fuel industry skill purely to have a more comfortable experience.
Waystations on my colonies are a lifesaver.
Fuel economy is not balanced. In the  first I though that my fleet will cause a global fuel crisis, by sucking all sources dry. Then I found out, the game  dont notice the shortage I created. Then I worked with way-stations (samee  as Grievous) and buy out all stockpile available to make my own stockpile in the planetary storage. Then I found a cure in a form of a an Industry skills which reduces consumption and rises salvage amount of fuel. This way I can fly almost endless. So the cure to wrong economy is not rely on economy to supply fuel, but  main character's skills.

Unfortunately, supply share  the story, but  no happy ending here. Therefore solution since mid game is stockpile into planetary storage all possible supply units which are available from way-station.
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Serenitis

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2022, 01:10:50 PM »

As an avid explorer I can say that getting hold of most, if not all the blueprints is not difficult at all.

The single most effective thing you could do to make this workable is remove the blueprint packages.
Or at least break them each up into multiple smaller packs and make them much less common.
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SafariJohn

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2022, 02:29:21 PM »

As an avid explorer I can say that getting hold of most, if not all the blueprints is not difficult at all.

The single most effective thing you could do to make this workable is remove the blueprint packages.
Or at least break them each up into multiple smaller packs and make them much less common.

BP packages are nice, but making the drop tables stingy would suck. Maybe smaller BP packages would be better than the few big ones, I dunno.

I'd like to see BP acquisition tied closer to challenges like beating Remnant stations or bounty missions given by contacts, and I'd like there to be more ways to get specific BPs you want. Sucks that you can't get your commission faction's BPs except by luck and raiding.
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Schwartz

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2022, 02:57:59 PM »

This strikes me as too powerful - running supply costs matter a lot for expedition planning and just as a general 'clock' on the player - but how about something similar that fits thematically, like

Ships with known blueprints have damage repaired 25% quicker?
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Oni

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2022, 06:05:34 PM »

I would like there to be an advantage to using your own faction's ships (assuming a commission) rather than just whatever salvage ships were laying around, if only so my fleet follows a theme instead of a random mix of whatever I could grab.  :P

Maybe somebody could create a mod like "Commissioned Crews" that adds a mod to your ships if you know the blueprint (also if your faction, be it by commission or Nexerelin alliance, knows it) that gives you some kind of bonus or advantage. Hopefully with a config and a bunch of True/False options to customize what advantages you think knowing a blueprint would give you (enhancing ship repair speed/efficiency for example).

It'd be interesting.
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Serenitis

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2022, 02:07:28 AM »

The main issue with giving a buff based on blueprints known is how easy they are to acquire.
Blueprint packs are how you get the vast majority of them, and they're so common it's not unusual to find multiples of them into double-figures.
Single prints are elusive enough that its not so much of an issue.

It comes down to what you want this buff to be...
Something big like the global maint. savings etc. would need prints to be much harder to find than they already are in order to not quickly trivialise logistics.
Something small enough to not care about the player having every print (and every buff), is also small enough for the player to not really care about it either.

Another avenue to consider is just straight up ignoring packages.
Only single prints give buffs.
That way you avoid the (lack of) rarity issue, and now there's always value to finding a single print.

Alternatively,
Spoiler
randomise the buff given by knowing a print. Almost any ship stat could be adjusted (probably not burn or DP).
You'd have to set this up to allocate which prints get which buff during sector-gen so savescumming makes no difference.
But you could have every game giving different buffs to different ships.
You'd definitely want to split up or ignore the packs for this though...
[close]
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Darloth

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2022, 03:32:38 AM »

How about an incremental bonus for every duplicate of the blueprint that you learn?

It can be pretty small for getting one-of, but then a faction start in Nex for example could give you several copies to begin with so you get a larger bonus for those.

Rationale could be that the blueprints aren't perfect either after sitting so long, and so by comparing copies of the same blueprint the design can be improved.

Potentially max CR for things you know better might be good?  If it's something small like 5% per blueprint then it won't get overwhelming, but getting max CR is somewhat difficult otherwise and it would stack up pretty well?
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Oni

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2022, 12:39:06 PM »

It could also be a challenge mode, where supply costs for all ships are doubled if you don't have the blueprint. If we're spitballing ideas.
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SafariJohn

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2022, 07:32:47 PM »

It could also be a challenge mode, where supply costs for all ships are doubled if you don't have the blueprint. If we're spitballing ideas.

Someone posting that is what prompted this, but I think that would feel suckier than supplies and CR already do.
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alexwtb234

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2022, 10:20:27 AM »

thats a neat idea, knowing your ship design helps the crew to do maintenance  efficiently after all
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Big Bee

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2022, 11:54:56 AM »

I'd be pretty happy about this. Normally I always feel like it's pretty much mandatory to get the industry skills that reduce supply and fuel costs, so I end up with few, if any combat skills of my own, so my flagship is usually underpowered compared to other ships with officers that actually got skills that buff their ship.
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Targun

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2022, 07:16:35 AM »

Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known

Never provide exact numbers in your suggestion except when you have expert game mechanics knowledge and really did your math on it. It will needlessly antagonize people who think your number is too extreme ;)

I like the idea because it actually gives reason to hunt for those BPs even though i have several backup ships stashed from bounties.

From the 'roleplay' point of view I think more realistic would be somehow lowering repair cost.
Service/and repair seems more affected by construction knowledge than everyday maintenance.



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Jackundor

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Re: Halve Maintenance Cost if BP is Known
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2022, 10:48:25 PM »

To encourage using your own ships and discourage using captured enemy ships (without penalizing rare one-off ships like Ziggurat), I suggest halving the supplies per month of ships that you have the BP for.
halving supply costs for ships with bps you know doesn't do that, since well, the enemy may have said ships too. Also, why would we even want to do this? i already only take destroyed ships very rarely bc i don't like dmods on my ships and restoring them is expensive.

also, this doesn't only affect captured ships, it affects all ships, derelicts you found while exploring, ones that you bought from markets etc. And while it's not a giant debuff that makes it unnviable to run ships you don't have the bp's for, it would be fairly annoying to have to pay more supplies for a cool ship just bc you don't have it's bp
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