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[Shogouki]

Will do and then I'll post if that doesn't work.

[PieceOfGood]

I noticed that now the power of modifications is also scaled by deployment points. I play with the setting `battle size = 1000`. I love epic battles, so many ships attack me at once, and in order to resist this horde, you need to have an almost full fleet of ships.

For greater fairness, could you also consider scaling from the “battle size” setting? Or some other way. Otherwise, all modifications like "Guerrilla" become worse than the standard ones and I am forced to roll back to version 1.8.4, where this mechanics did not exist.

the mechanic has always existed, it was just broken. the multipliers didn't change at all before, and the tooltip has always said what your fleet should have for maximum effect. the effect multiplier is scaled by 37.5% of the maximum battle size, so it's already scaled by battle size. it only takes into account combat ships, so cargo ships don't count unless they aren't tagged as Civilian or don't have the Civilian-grade hullmod or that hullmod isn't disabled by the Militarized Subsystems.

additionally, some exotics have campaign effects, so i can't make the exotic type work based on a combat condition (number of ships deployed in combat).

GUERRILLA is intended to be a force multiplier for small fleets. it should be used as such.

Thank you, this explains a lot.
I'll do some optimization.

[Shogouki]

try updating magiclib

That did it, sorry about that! 

[presidentmattdamon]

I noticed that now the power of modifications is also scaled by deployment points. I play with the setting `battle size = 1000`. I love epic battles, so many ships attack me at once, and in order to resist this horde, you need to have an almost full fleet of ships.

For greater fairness, could you also consider scaling from the “battle size” setting? Or some other way. Otherwise, all modifications like "Guerrilla" become worse than the standard ones and I am forced to roll back to version 1.8.4, where this mechanics did not exist.

the mechanic has always existed, it was just broken. the multipliers didn't change at all before, and the tooltip has always said what your fleet should have for maximum effect. the effect multiplier is scaled by 37.5% of the maximum battle size, so it's already scaled by battle size. it only takes into account combat ships, so cargo ships don't count unless they aren't tagged as Civilian or don't have the Civilian-grade hullmod or that hullmod isn't disabled by the Militarized Subsystems.

additionally, some exotics have campaign effects, so i can't make the exotic type work based on a combat condition (number of ships deployed in combat).

GUERRILLA is intended to be a force multiplier for small fleets. it should be used as such.

Thank you, this explains a lot.
I'll do some optimization.

thanks for keeping an open mind. i'm open to suggestions for things that would make your playstyle more fun for you, like new exotic types since that's what changed for you. i prefer to keep them as campaign conditions, like GUERRILLA for campaign fleet size and PURE for using less bandwidth and exotics, so the player is incentivized to do things differently in fleet and ship building than they normally would.

[PieceOfGood]

And thank you!

I had to leave some interesting ships in the shipyard, which made the battles more intense and requiring more deliberate tactics, but overall it became even better. Now you don’t need to carry so many Supplies and Fuel with you, and you can also somewhat cross this upper limit, since the changes come just as smoothly.

In general, I would take the liberty of calling your work global, since it greatly changes the feeling of the game, sharpening all the features related to battles, and the battles in this game are excellent!

I have three suggestions, if I may.

• It would be extremely convenient to be able to invert the entire list of “upgrades/exotics” with one button when scanning a fleet. It's very tiring to do this every time with those huge lists of fleets that I encounter with `battle size = 1000`.
• Also, it would be very cool if exotics did not disappear from ships after a battle if the ships managed to escape from it. Since valuable modifications come across very rarely and, in addition, can end up on ships that are 100% destroyed in battle, leaving no chance of getting them as a trophy, you have to reload such a battle again and not completely destroy the enemy fleet in order to increase the chance of the desired ship appearing among the trophies . I also tried the other way around, destroying all other ships in the enemy fleet and leaving them alive only with the necessary modifications, so that I could then attack them again and thus also increase the chance of their capture, but it turned out that after participating in the first battle, those who escaped from it and subsequently captured, they no longer have exotic modifications. Although these are the same ships.
• I have Paint's image editor open to take screenshots of the most interesting specimens when I look at the scanned list of the enemy fleet, because in the final list of possible trophies it is impossible to know whether there are those that interest me among them. If it is possible to add the same scanning of an already defeated fleet, this would greatly improve the quality of interaction with the mod, eliminating the need for an intermediary.

It’s also interesting to know your opinion on how exotics are sold on planetary markets. In earlier versions, I came across exotics of "GUERRILLA" quality, if from time to time I looked at the market of the same planet. Now I don’t come across them, but it could just be random within a typical situation.

[presidentmattdamon]

And thank you!

I had to leave some interesting ships in the shipyard, which made the battles more intense and requiring more deliberate tactics, but overall it became even better. Now you don’t need to carry so many Supplies and Fuel with you, and you can also somewhat cross this upper limit, since the changes come just as smoothly.

In general, I would take the liberty of calling your work global, since it greatly changes the feeling of the game, sharpening all the features related to battles, and the battles in this game are excellent!

I have three suggestions, if I may.

• It would be extremely convenient to be able to invert the entire list of “upgrades/exotics” with one button when scanning a fleet. It's very tiring to do this every time with those huge lists of fleets that I encounter with `battle size = 1000`.
• Also, it would be very cool if exotics did not disappear from ships after a battle if the ships managed to escape from it. Since valuable modifications come across very rarely and, in addition, can end up on ships that are 100% destroyed in battle, leaving no chance of getting them as a trophy, you have to reload such a battle again and not completely destroy the enemy fleet in order to increase the chance of the desired ship appearing among the trophies . I also tried the other way around, destroying all other ships in the enemy fleet and leaving them alive only with the necessary modifications, so that I could then attack them again and thus also increase the chance of their capture, but it turned out that after participating in the first battle, those who escaped from it and subsequently captured, they no longer have exotic modifications. Although these are the same ships.
• I have Paint's image editor open to take screenshots of the most interesting specimens when I look at the scanned list of the enemy fleet, because in the final list of possible trophies it is impossible to know whether there are those that interest me among them. If it is possible to add the same scanning of an already defeated fleet, this would greatly improve the quality of interaction with the mod, eliminating the need for an intermediary.

It’s also interesting to know your opinion on how exotics are sold on planetary markets. In earlier versions, I came across exotics of "GUERRILLA" quality, if from time to time I looked at the market of the same planet. Now I don’t come across them, but it could just be random within a typical situation.

you've got all good suggestions there. i'll take a look at #2 sooner since it seems to be a bug with recovery of ships with modifications.

as for planetary markets, there was a bug in previous versions where the market wouldn't refresh at all. because of that the market data would continuously contain the same exotics and upgrades even when you bought them. the recent fix for that only makes it refresh every 30 days, and doesn't affect how the exotics and upgrades themselves are generated. so it's just luck!

[Juason]

In my heavily modded game, Exotica Upgrades aren't generally applying to most ships.  I first noticed it on my VIC ships, along with some IX ships.  But it appears to be somewhat random.  When I say the Upgrades aren't working, I can see them in the Exotica screen.  But the Exotica mod is missing and the bonuses are not applying.  Chipping them with an actual EXOTIC "fixes" whatever was wrong and usually makes the mod appear and the other upgrade bonuses to apply. 

Playing with it some more, if I remove all Exotica and re-apply them, sometimes it is fixed.  But not always.  I found if I start with Commissioned Crews it breaks.  So I'll instead do like the Armor one and then Crews and Engines.  It takes some work to get it sorted out. 

Any idea what might be going on here?  Thanks!

[Shogouki]

I had a quick question about the Hacked Missile Forge damage reduction.  Does the damage reduction only apply to direct damage from the missile or does it also apply to any secondary damage that a missile causes like with the PRV Skata that causes anomalies to erupt that do fragmentation damage over time?

[presidentmattdamon]

I had a quick question about the Hacked Missile Forge damage reduction.  Does the damage reduction only apply to direct damage from the missile or does it also apply to any secondary damage that a missile causes like with the PRV Skata that causes anomalies to erupt that do fragmentation damage over time?

that's a mod-by-mod case, as it's scripted damage, so i can't say that i know. the best way to know is to ask the Prv author if that missile's secondary explosions are affected by missile weapon damage modifiers.

In my heavily modded game, Exotica Upgrades aren't generally applying to most ships.  I first noticed it on my VIC ships, along with some IX ships.  But it appears to be somewhat random.  When I say the Upgrades aren't working, I can see them in the Exotica screen.  But the Exotica mod is missing and the bonuses are not applying.  Chipping them with an actual EXOTIC "fixes" whatever was wrong and usually makes the mod appear and the other upgrade bonuses to apply. 

Playing with it some more, if I remove all Exotica and re-apply them, sometimes it is fixed.  But not always.  I found if I start with Commissioned Crews it breaks.  So I'll instead do like the Armor one and then Crews and Engines.  It takes some work to get it sorted out. 

Any idea what might be going on here?  Thanks!

i've taken a look and i can't identify what's going on here.

[PieceOfGood]

How to check if "Temporal Conduits" is working?

I play on Kassadari ships and with the "Forced Overdrive" module, the flow of time on the ship is permanently increased by 30%. This value is reflected in the list of effects in the lower left corner of the game interface during battle, if you control such a ship. Since both cases are about the flow of time on a ship, I expected that when using "Temporal Conduits" this property would contain a new value, but it does not change.

Can you confirm that this works?

---
And one more thing. Over the past three days (about 36 hours of play), since the update to 1.8.5, I have come across only three exotics of "GUERILLA" quality. Two while searching ruins on planets (Phased Fighter Tether) and one encountered on an enemy ship (Reactive Damper Field), useless to me. In general, it seems that ships are now less likely to be equipped with any exotics, since battles have become much easier. This is especially noticeable in clashes with the Iron Shell faction, which used to be very difficult to defeat, but now they are like ordinary trash.

I found a changelog for 1.8.5 on GitHub, which talks about the innovation.

I think something needs to be done about this. Considering that the strength of the player’s fleet only grows over time and this happens not only from the presence of exotics (which can be easily found on planetary markets), then even with the rare appearance of exotics of a different quality on enemy ships, the player’s fleet becomes very strong quite quickly and There are no restrictions other than physical ones for this.

Thus, the rest of the game world quickly becomes decrepit, ceasing to be of interest. After all, if I don’t feel the intensity of the battle, don’t get the expected dose of dopamine for surviving this difficult battle, saving all, or almost all, of my ships, and simply sweep away the enemy with one glance, then why waste time on this, if it will only be interesting the first few times, and the rest will be predictable.

Maybe it’s worth returning the abundance of exotics that was before, simply by ensuring that the chance of keeping ships with exotics rarer, and/or costing an additional 1/2/2/3 “Story points” for restoring such a ship with exotics depending on the quality? And the installation/removal of exotics at shipyards should also cost an additional large amount of money and the condition is that on this planet there is heavy industry upgraded to “Orbital Works” with “Pristine Nanoforge” installed. That is, at least until the player has created his own house and acquired such a factory, he will have to be good friends with the Hegemony, or the faction for which this condition is met.

Thus, such upgrades will become more conscious, the road from their possession to use will become longer and more difficult.

The player will still go through this path. The only question is the incentives and the pleasure received for receiving the next gameplay modifier.

In addition, I think that it also makes sense to tie planetary markets for exotics only to the main factions, and not to all planets, and to give access to the player only if they have a high reputation, as well as to give a guaranteed opportunity to purchase exotics of any quality, but for a quality higher than usual , some game events must be executed. For example, capturing a planet from Tri-Tachyon, if we are talking about buying from Hegemony, or carrying out raids on the entire system, or saving the system from the invasion of a large AI fleet... An accepted task can be failed with a complete reset of reputation. In this way, the player proves his loyalty to the seller’s side, and will also be forced to cut off his access to the markets of another faction, which may also have exotics of other types, which he also needs, but cannot be purchased on the market of one faction, so as a type it is context dependent.

Or implement faction points, which could be earned by making long-distance expeditions, handing over cores to AI, in general, doing some kind of work for the faction, and only for these points would you be able to purchase exotics, and even better, upgrades.

Probably, the last proposal will be even more user-friendly, and also less linear, since the number of faction points received can be tied to the calculated complexity of the work performed, and not just to the fact of its completion.

In addition, this would greatly add to the need for roleplaying, increase the gameplay and thereby smooth out the player’s entry into the last stage, when he no longer cares about anything.

Oooh, I would have played this game from the very beginning, and more than once...

[PieceOfGood]

Returned to version 1.8.4. So the dynamics of the game and the tension created in battles are much higher and more interesting.

I hope you can figure out how to make the use of exotics more common by enemy fleets.

It would also be great to have some kind of mechanic for trading one type of exotic for another. Also accompanying the player with certain difficulties. Since it happens that randomness throws up completely unnecessary exotic green quality upgrades for a very long time, unless you plan a more controlled way to obtain similar upgrades, such a mechanic would be very reasonable.

[Shogouki]

Those are some good ideas.  I've also noticed the drastic decrease with even some decent sized fleets not containing a single exotic.  I also really like it when mods like this make the NPCs just as powerful as the player so finding a way to increase the number of exotics appearing on opponents without drowning the player in them would be awesome.  If that's something that's difficult to code perhaps making it a setting that can be changed in game with LunaLib would be another option?

[PieceOfGood]

I support this.

And one more idea on how to add more control to the extraction of exotic modules while complicating the process itself: make it so that after defeating an enemy fleet, if its ships had such modifications with a quality higher than usual, then exotic shards of the corresponding one would be added to the resulting list of extraction quality, and removing the installed modules would turn them into these unified shards in the same way, with the only difference being that if you remove these shards, more would be guaranteed, but you would have to spend a lot of money on “Orbital Works” with “Pristine Nanoforge” .

Exotic shards could then be exchanged for entire exotic modules in the appropriate markets, with a less favorable exchange rate the worse the relationship with the faction that owns this market.

In this way, it is possible to organize the emission of the value that exotic modules represent and supply them to enemy fleets without sparing the player. That is, make it so that even if the enemy fleet has the maximum number of different types of exotic modules of green quality installed on all ships, then when you defeat it, the final loot will not contain even a quarter of the required number of exotic shards to exchange for a whole module.

[Shogouki]

I support this.

And one more idea on how to add more control to the extraction of exotic modules while complicating the process itself: make it so that after defeating an enemy fleet, if its ships had such modifications with a quality higher than usual, then exotic shards of the corresponding one would be added to the resulting list of extraction quality, and removing the installed modules would turn them into these unified shards in the same way, with the only difference being that if you remove these shards, more would be guaranteed, but you would have to spend a lot of money on “Orbital Works” with “Pristine Nanoforge” .

Exotic shards could then be exchanged for entire exotic modules in the appropriate markets, with a less favorable exchange rate the worse the relationship with the faction that owns this market.

In this way, it is possible to organize the emission of the value that exotic modules represent and supply them to enemy fleets without sparing the player. That is, make it so that even if the enemy fleet has the maximum number of different types of exotic modules of green quality installed on all ships, then when you defeat it, the final loot will not contain even a quarter of the required number of exotic shards to exchange for a whole module.

I don't know if that would be very easy to code but anything to increase the NPC's use of exotics while not making them really easy to acquire for the player would be awesome.

By the way, you mentioned that you switched back to the previous mod version and I was wondering if that's save breaking for any save files that already had the latest version or if you can downgrade without problems?

[Uther Phobos]

I've noticed that Equalizer Core behaves oddly on modules. It seems the core applies to the module during simulations, but will instead apply to the main ship in "real" battles for some reason.