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[Amazigh]

Literally better off just downsizing mediums to IR pulse than mounting kinetic blasters. Saving OP on that, too.

Yes, because in exchange for a relatively minor increase to anti-armour DPS i definitely want to have 150 anti shield DPS, rather than 500 anti shield DPS.

[Hiruma Kai]

you're looking at flux/damage, try considering comparing weapon DPS rather than flux efficiency.
Because while the IR may be more flux efficient, it's doing less raw effective DPS (i think?)

It isn't. IR pulse is higher DPS against both armor and hull as well, at all armor values.
Literally better off just downsizing mediums to IR pulse than mounting kinetic blasters. Saving OP on that, too.

That doesn't sound right to me against hull.  Raw armor maybe but quick checks against residual armor and hull doesn't agree with that statement.

Let's compare 150 energy DPS (in 50 point chunks) versus 250 DPS kinetic (in 250 point chunks).

It's clearly not true versus 0 minimum armor (150 < 250).
50 minimum armor (so 1000 fresh armor), implies 75 DPS < 178 DPS against hull.  (50/100 * 150 = 75, 125/175 * 250 = 178).
100 minimum armor (so 2000 fresh armor), implies 50 DPS < 138 DPS against hull. (50/150 * 150 = 50, 125/225 * 250 = 138).

Against armor itself, since 150 DPS > 125 DPS, IR pulse laser does out do a Kinetic Blaster at many armor levels.

And certainly against shield, it does a factor of 3.3 less damage as compared to the Kinetic Blaster (150 vs 500).

[JJ842]

I'm also a bit bummed about the awesome-looking Sindrian variants being a strict downgrade, even though the in-lore reasoning is sound (and hilarious). How about giving the "special modifications" d-mod the added effect of allowing for an additional s-mod to be built into the hull as long as the ship isn't restored? Something about the engineers involved coming up with truly innovative ways to implement the supreme executor's ill-advised suggestions with only a slight decrease in performance, which could be built upon to increase the hull's effectiveness (which won't happen in Sindrian service for obvious reasons) with additional effort. That way there would be an incentive to actually use the cool looking ships

[Grievous69]

LP Venture gets a brand new different system from the original one, and the only Diktat capital that's a different class somehow, has the same FMR system as Pegasus... I bet that's still useful but it seems rather disappointing, not sure if I even want to get one Executor just to try it out. So basically the only difference between the two ships is that one has downsides, bruh.

Also imagine being Alex, developing and playtesting all this great content, talking about it in a big blog post, only to have 60% of the conversation fixated on one minute thing most players won't even care about once the update drops. Feelsbadman

IR Autolance: I don't see how it's stepping on Burst PD's toes since it can't target missiles. Sure it will probably be much better for anti-fighter work but that's not even the role of PD weapons, and it will surely be better against shielded fighters. I'm always shocked to hear people think Burst PD is not good. What do you use for PD then? I find everything else underwhelming and demanding of many more slots, when 2-3 Burst lasers give you plenty of protection. And we don't even know how good IR Autolance tracks.

I agree that Heavy burst laser is in a weird spot, having a high OP cost for a PD weapon of its power, while fighting slots with assault options. It's usually the small mounts you're left with to fill in.

[Embolism]

LP Venture gets a brand new different system from the original one, and the only Diktat capital that's a different class somehow, has the same FMR system as Pegasus... I bet that's still useful but it seems rather disappointing, not sure if I even want to get one Executor just to try it out. So basically the only difference between the two ships is that one has downsides, bruh.

Feels like the Executor should have High Energy Focus to lean more into the GIGACANNON and Andrada's energy fetish.

Also imagine being Alex, developing and playtesting all this great content, talking about it in a big blog post, only to have 60% of the conversation fixated on one minute thing most players won't even care about once the update drops. Feelsbadman

Yeah... I guess people (like me) only speak up about what we don't like than what we do like.

For what it's worth Alex I do love all of this <3

[RedBaronFlyer]

I'm also going to throw my (admittedly useless) opinion into the ring and say I'm a bit unsatisfied with where the Diktat is going. The rework kind of feels like the treatment an overpowered thing gets in a multiplayer game (i.e., wrecked to the point of uselessness, any long-time Team Fortress 2 players should know what I'm talking about)

I'd be much more in favor of the Diktat working the other way around, where the Lion Guard is elite. At the same time, the regular navy is mainly incompetent, underfunded, composed primarily of conscripts, and using old (or poorly maintained/equipped ships). Where the regular navy exists primarily to keep order and make sure the populace doesn't get too wild, while the Lion Guard exists to actually get stuff done.  The best example I could think of this would be Sadam's Iraq, where the regular (conscript) army was absolutely massive, but was using the oldest stuff and (usually) performed extremely poorly or flat out surrendered to Coalition forces meanwhile Sadam's republican guard got the good stuff and formed the most potent and most capable fighting forces (but their equipment was still outdated compared to the coalition's equipment)

The Diktat would then be like most military dictatorships where the most significant danger is the military itself. The way that military dictators counter this is by having some sort of force to counteract the normal military (loyalty via the appointment of family/clan members, secret security (like the KGB or DGS), a smaller more elite army that directly answers to the dictator)

The "incompetent out of touch bodyguard with a competent army" (like the Praetorian Guard getting beaten by regular legionaries later on during the crisis of the third century) would really be better in line for the Hegemony (kinda), Persean League (formed by the stronger/more influential Persean League planets to exert force on less influential league members), or even the Luddic Church (religious inquisition/bodyguards to the Ludd-Pope).

I'm perfectly fine with Philip going senile while the state apparatus continues to function properly (for as long as it can, rather). But I question if the Diktat is going to "feel" intimidating after this update. Also, I got no idea why anyone would bother getting the Executor compared to the Pegasus, it seems like a pirate or luddic path thing but even pirate and luddic path stuff have upsides. The executor as it is seems like it will just instantly overflux. Its flux dissipation is 815 with 34 vents but produces 3210 flux with the loadout included in the blog post. Even Onslaughts would struggle to operate with horrid flux stats like that.


Also please keep in the built-in solar shielding for all the Diktat/Lion Guard stuff, it at least makes them somewhat desirable to seek out.

[jamplier]

I'd be much more in favor of the Diktat working the other way around, where the Lion Guard is elite.

But the Lion's Guard is the elite force, using the newest and "best" equipment.

Both the normal military and the Lion’s Guard get access to the Executor; the Lion’s Guard however are the only ones lucky enough to also have full access to the fruits of the weapons program.

Also, I got no idea why anyone would bother getting the Executor compared to the Pegasus

There is no reason. That's the point. It's to add flavor to the faction. It's stuff that seems good on paper, but doesn't work well in practice. The ships and weapons are essentially Wunderwaffe which underline the fact that the Diktat is a cult of personality, with Andrada potentially getting disconnected from reality.

But I question if the Diktat is going to "feel" intimidating after this update.

I'd say the only mistake Alex made in this whole thing was to lay his intentions so bare in the blog post. I think finding out while playing that the ship with the GIGACANNON is not as intimidating as it sounds would have been a cool experience, and would have been fun for a player to realize on their own that the SuPrEme EXeCuToR fell into the trap of believing in Wunderwaffe.

And as an aside, I really don't care if a cool looking ship isn't that good. While the combat is really good, world building and atmosphere is a very big part of Starsector, so making a new ship to purely serve that purpose seems ok to me (even if it is useless to the player).

[Grievous69]

I think that's the point most of us here made, adding flavour is nice but it has to be interesting. Having 2 ships in the game where one is worse in every single way is dumb. And I don't mind bad ships existing, like Buffalo MkII. Mudskipper that blows itself up, Gremlin. Now imagine there's another "Gremlin" in the game, called differently, and it's outright better than the original one while costing the same. What point is there to the original now? You could again argue "flavour" but this isn't an immersion sim, or a book.

Might as well disable the option to get a Diktat commission. If you're a collector and want the ship, you also want exclusive weapons which you can only get by destroying said ship (and then recovering it). If not, Executor serves the lone purpose of being a gimp ship. Give it a different system, give it some extra stats, anything. A beautiful capital that's a joke/trap feels so out of place in this otherwise gem of a game. You can easily make something "not as good as the average" while satisfying lore nerds while also still making an interesting decision from a gameplay perspective. Since this is a video game.

EDIT: For example take Thumper. It was a bad weapon inferior to other options, yet you could argue it's meant to be bad, pirates are using it anyways who cares, etc etc. Now tell me the game isn't better when you actually have to decide if it's a good idea to use it. I know the comparison is not the same but the point stands,

[Megas]

Heavy Burst Lance is a mini-Phase Lance that...
* Has +200 range over Phase Lance if the captain has elite Point Defense.
* Much better efficiency and does not spike flux into overload at a bad time.
* Can target and shoot down missiles.

If the only long-range options are Graviton Beam, Tactical Laser, or Heavy Burst Laser, Heavy Burst Laser looks attractive.  Will have to see if IR Autolance will be useful enough to use instead of burst lasers.

Literally better off just downsizing mediums to IR pulse than mounting kinetic blasters. Saving OP on that, too.

Yes, because in exchange for a relatively minor increase to anti-armour DPS i definitely want to have 150 anti shield DPS, rather than 500 anti shield DPS.

High-tech ships generally have the mounts to support multiple IR Pulse Lasers, but have trouble supporting more than one or two blasters and will probably leave mounts empty due to insufficient dissipation and/or OP.

[IronWombat]

I think people are overlooking a very important reason for players to collect LG ships regardless of if they are any good or not: parading an entire trophy fleet of Lion's Guard ships, that you couldn't possibly have come by legitimately, around Askonia while laughing maniacally.

P.S. very excited about the new changes. Can't wait to get my hands on the shiny pew-pew missiles.

[Wyvern]

My suggestion for the Lion's Guard: Keep the base hulls as they are in the blog post. Then give them a high chance of having one-to-three s-mods, and allow those s-mods to stick around when the player captures them.

My experience from playing with mods that allowed player capture of s-modded ships is that the random chance almost never s-mods the things a player would. So you might get an Eagle with, say, Advanced Optics, and Heavy Armor, and Flux Coil Adjunct. Is that better than a regular Eagle? Well, if you don't have tons of story points to spare, yes! Is it better in the long run? No, no it is not.

But the key here is that it's fun to play around with, and occasionally interesting to see how far you can leverage some sub-optimal choices of built-ins, and still fills in the same story-space of an 'elite' group with more funding than sense.

[Candesce]

I think people are overlooking a very important reason for players to collect LG ships regardless of if they are any good or not: parading an entire trophy fleet of Lion's Guard ships, that you couldn't possibly have come by legitimately, around Askonia while laughing maniacally.

Pft.

Y'know, being able to get away with that has a fun implication: there's enough people who've stolen, pirated, salvaged, and traded Lion's Guard trophy ships that the Sindrian Diktat can't just get away with declaring anyone in possession of one to be an enemy of the state.

That, or no one's willing to be the person to put in writing that someone unauthorized has gotten a hold of elite Sindrian equipment, and so everyone just pretends not to see the obvious.

[Grievous69]

I just had the greatest loadout idea for Pegasus ever, 4 Pilum catapults. I CAN'T WAIT to see the absurdity, although I fear it won't be as good as it is in my head.

[Megas]

I think people are overlooking a very important reason for players to collect LG ships regardless of if they are any good or not: parading an entire trophy fleet of Lion's Guard ships, that you couldn't possibly have come by legitimately, around Askonia while laughing maniacally.

Pft.

Y'know, being able to get away with that has a fun implication: there's enough people who've stolen, pirated, salvaged, and traded Lion's Guard trophy ships that the Sindrian Diktat can't just get away with declaring anyone in possession of one to be an enemy of the state.

That, or no one's willing to be the person to put in writing that someone unauthorized has gotten a hold of elite Sindrian equipment, and so everyone just pretends not to see the obvious.

Not as bad as parading around automated ships piloted by AI cores (which they do not care about, yet lore would make people think they should), or flying around with Ziggurat (which seems to be one everyone cares most about).

[Atlasreturns]

It's got Fast Missile Racks; two large missile slots is enough to where it's still useful.

To be honest I have somewhat of a suspicion that the Executor will be the ship no one ever touches only being seen at the bottom of Tierlists or when farming the SD for weapons.
The Pegasus flux stats are really bad so I don't really see the advantage of the two energy slots compared to losing it's missiles. At best this is a straight-up downgrade to the Pegasus, at worst a Battleship that even with a sensible loud-out will never perform effective. I can't really imagine a niche or situation where I would want the Executor in my fleet.

Also why would Andrada copy the Pegasus in the first place? I feel like as an Ex-Hegemony Admiral he'd prefer the Onslaught with his improvements. Maybe removing the Thermal Pulse Cannons to make place for his **absolutely** superior Gigacannons? I feel like taking one of the most known Ships in the Sector which is also the common Capital ship from your ex-employer, giving it a minor overhaul because obviously you as famed Admiral have worked out the ships deficits and then naming it after yourself would be very in character for the Supreme Executor.

Also wouldn't it be possible to shuffle the mounts on LP Ships to be more energy heavy and then equip them with one or two kinetic blasters?