Fractal Softworks Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Planet Search Overhaul (07/13/24)

Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 27

Author Topic: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2  (Read 52368 times)

Candesce

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 277
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #30 on: April 30, 2022, 12:26:12 PM »

if you remove the d-mod and your build would have had Solar Shielding anyway, then they're up to par.
Hmm.

Solar Shielding is a logistics hullmod - does the built in one on these ships count against the limit?

Not that I expect there were many builds that called for Solar Shielding and multiple logistics mods, but it's a thought.

... Insulated Engine Assembly and Efficiency Overhaul, maybe, or a fleet that wants a lot of High-Resolution Sensors...
Logged

AcaMetis

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 489
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #31 on: April 30, 2022, 12:27:34 PM »

So how difficult is a Gigacannon to find on a...shall we say "very open-minded" market? Because I am definitely going to want to test that thing on a Sunder ;).
Logged

IonDragonX

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 816
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #32 on: April 30, 2022, 12:29:49 PM »

That the blast-proof paneling has the opposite of its intended effect and that the conduits were left exposed for some very good if perhaps not immediately obvious reasons. If that's what you're asking? Not quite sure.
Ok that's good to know, thought the blast-proof paneling had some hidden positive effect
Perhaps the the blast proof paneling would work if the explosion never entered a corridor/enviro area. However, should an explosion ever penetrate that, the paneling would effectively channel the explosion to the entire corridor/enviro area because the force could not leave.
Logged

Caymon Joestar

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 158
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #33 on: April 30, 2022, 12:31:09 PM »

I had something longer typed but stupid phone app crashed and deleted it because no auto save but tl:dr of what I was gonna say

PL: Neat. Hope new missiles are good.

Diktat: Overall, I’m not really a fan. The lore direction makes the diktat and the lion into the bog standard evil incompetent dictatorship where every other faction has something more than that going for them besides pirates. (I’m also no lore expert so maybe even also the pirates)

If the lion was able to become a High ranking admiral and have so many hegemony officers mutiny and join him into making the diktat and keep it running for 25 years. Him seemingly being so incompetent doesn’t make any sense. Let alone the people working under him for officer choices and etc.

If they have the ability to make cool weapons based on the omega weapons (even with assistance from TT) then why can’t they afford to have solar shielding without reducing their OP? It doesn’t sense to me from a lore perspective/what I know of them currently and gameplay perceptive too when even LP ships get SO built in and doesn’t lose any OP either and only get a dmod that can just be restored to get rid of.

How could the LG not have been in a Major war when the Second AI War occurred during their time? Did everyone just ignore them or something?

I’m not sure how to feel about the diktat not wanting carriers, do they get anything in exchange for that? Like maybe some light high tech splash to go with their mainly Midline Line up?

Maybe it’s just me but I feel it would be more interesting if the diktat/The Lion weren’t so seemingly... unbelievably incompetent as they seem to be heading outside of the weapons department. I can believe being somewhat incompetent but personally, it would be more interesting for them to be lead by a Competent but still flawed leader rather standard evil dictator that doesnt anything right.

Remnant: yay, more of them coming
Logged

Timid

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 640
  • Personal Text
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #34 on: April 30, 2022, 12:32:22 PM »

Hmm.

Solar Shielding is a logistics hullmod - does the built in one on these ships count against the limit?

Not that I expect there were many builds that called for Solar Shielding and multiple logistics mods, but it's a thought.

... Insulated Engine Assembly and Efficiency Overhaul, maybe, or a fleet that wants a lot of High-Resolution Sensors...
Built-ins do not count against the limit.

Alex

  • Administrator
  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 24875
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #35 on: April 30, 2022, 12:50:16 PM »

I'm glad that the LG Special Modifications is more annoying than truly debilitating. That said, will the officer levels and S-mods be skewed toward the LG as opposed to Regulars? I think it would be pretty cool for the best/most decorated of the Regulars to all be promoted into the LG.  Their superior captain skills and the S-mods that they bring with them would more than over-compensate for the Special Modifications. It would be also running with the lore-wise hubris of Sindria, removing the greatest talent pool from the military that has the most responsibility.

Ah, bad news I'm afraid:
Quote from: blog post
The officers of the guard are selected for loyalty and doctrinal purity over all other considerations.


Solar Shielding is a logistics hullmod - does the built in one on these ships count against the limit?

Built-in mods don't count for that, IIRC.


So how difficult is a Gigacannon to find on a...shall we say "very open-minded" market? Because I am definitely going to want to test that thing on a Sunder ;).

Impossible! It's too hot of an item.


How could the LG not have been in a Major war when the Second AI War occurred during their time? Did everyone just ignore them or something?

More than likely, poltics. I'd imagine personal charisma and politics are Andrada's forte. That's precisely the sort of thing that would let him do what he's actually done in the Sector. Someone who was instead just a competent or even brilliant military leader would've had no chance.

I’m not sure how to feel about the diktat not wanting carriers, do they get anything in exchange for that? Like maybe some light high tech splash to go with their mainly Midline Line up?

Hmm, I'm not sure I understand this framing - why would they? Carriers aren't "better"; so what they get in exchange is just "more non-carriers". If you mean for purposes of variety, though - I think having a more... homogenous? ... ship lineup actually helps their fleets stand out more when you're fighting them.
Logged

Screech9791

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 48
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #36 on: April 30, 2022, 12:57:02 PM »

I'm glad the Persean League is getting an actual fleet doctrine now instead of just generic midline spam with high and low tech ships mixed in.
When will they get actual music?
Logged

David

  • Global Moderator
  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 967
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #37 on: April 30, 2022, 12:58:27 PM »

Maybe it’s just me but I feel it would be more interesting if the diktat/The Lion weren’t so seemingly... unbelievably incompetent as they seem to be heading outside of the weapons department. I can believe being somewhat incompetent but personally, it would be more interesting for them to be lead by a Competent but still flawed leader rather standard evil dictator that doesnt anything right.

To address this and similar comments, there is (and will be) more to the Sindrian Diktat than just a military built on loyalty over competence. I do also think authoritarian dictatorships tend to fare poorly in running a competent high-tech military in particular, and particularly when left to rot for a long time, for logically consistent and historically-supported reasons vs. how media portrayals tend to make them look ultra-competent both in their own propaganda and in opposing narratives. But this line of thought risks getting wildly off-topic...

-- Back to my point: I look forward to exploring why this all happens, what it means for various parties involved, and throwing some scifi fun into the mix then blowing it up in the player's face, if they are so inclined. I don't want to get into spoilers for upcoming stuff so I guess all I can say is that the point of the Sindrian Diktat is not "lol look at how much they suck".

(..... I actually do think the Expanse has a very interesting take on the whole theme and narrative of scifi military dictatorships, though I don't want to spoil the last three books by going into it at all.)
Logged

Inventor Raccoon

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 480
  • Digging through trash for a hydroflux catalyst
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #38 on: April 30, 2022, 01:01:31 PM »

Loving all that you're putting out here, I'm excited to see the factions stand out from each other where they might have not before.

... also, the Lion's Guard being turned into the, ah, """elite""" forces of the Diktat because everything they use is based on the Faultless Will and Vision of the Supreme Executor Philip Andrada Who Is Definitely Not A Complete Narcissistic Lunatic is absolutely hilarious, especially the unique energy weapons that would hypothetically be fantastic if somebody with any sense of loadout design (perhaps an upstart spacer suddenly rising to fame) got their hands on them.
Logged

Cycerin

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • beyond the infinite void
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #39 on: April 30, 2022, 01:03:50 PM »

Fun stuff. I'm picturing the GIGACANNON as kind of like a PPC out of Battletech, except with poor range. Does that fit? Better have a kickass firing noise regardless of how awful it is.
Logged

IGdood

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 209
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #40 on: April 30, 2022, 01:05:57 PM »

Maybe there can be a small positive buff to a LG ship in that arrogance and hubris give a bit of a morale boost?

Fanatical loyalty and doctrinal purity give a CR boost or ....?
Logged

Hiruma Kai

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 901
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #41 on: April 30, 2022, 01:13:00 PM »

Really cool blog post.

I think the blog shows you really, really like the Orion drive, considering there's 2 more ships using variations on it. :)

Overall, I like the Persean League's new laser missile identity.  Although, I do kinda wonder if that's a bit limiting for the Persean League's Pegasus to be only mounting Hydra and Dragonfire torpedoes.  Essentially only 3 variations.  All Hydra, all Dragonfire, and a mix.  Of course the player won't be restricted in that way, so perhaps not an issue.  And Mercenaries likely can have fully random loadouts for these things.  And as the blog post is titled, it does uniquify the Persean league.

With the discussion of the Paragon, Odyssey, and Astral for Tri-Tachyon, will Odysseys be showing up in actual TT fleets more often?

I like the added Remnant ship diversity.  I do wonder if the high tech Orion device (Nova Burst) will end up feeling any different from Plasma Burn.  Certainly looks cool though. 

I will admit my initial reaction to the Sindarian Diktat's Lion Guard is similar to a number of other posters.  Gameplay wise, it is unusual to have the less common, harder to acquire ships be straight downgrades, despite how minor those downgrades might be.  Story wise however, it makes perfect sense.  Essentially it reframes the Lion's Guard as closer to pirates than say, the XIVth battlegroup, in terms of their combat effectiveness, simply due to the nature of the politics.  The Supreme Executor has more in common with Kanta than the High Hegemon.  So gameplay wise, you'll interact with them like pirate ships instead of XIVth battlegroup ships.  They are easier to destroy enemy whose salvagable ships you typically ignore instead of consider using.  And if you do use them, it's because you don't have anything better, and you ditch them as soon as you do have something better. 

My biggest issue as a gamer is their sprites look too good. :)

I do wonder how that poor effectiveness impacts bounties?  If a fleet with Lion Guard ships and "elite" fitting is intended to be easier to defeat, does that mean you'll run into more Sindarian Lion's Guard themed bounties early on/at low difficulty, but then they phase out for basic Sindarian fleet ships as the bounties go up in difficulty?  Or are Lion's Guard purely around Sindaria and don't show up in bounties?  Or simply not enough difference in effectiveness to really worry about?
« Last Edit: April 30, 2022, 01:14:49 PM by Hiruma Kai »
Logged

Dri

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1405
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #42 on: April 30, 2022, 01:22:46 PM »

I was not expecting you to make the Lion's Guard into a bunch of primped-up gimps lol
Logged

Caymon Joestar

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 158
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #43 on: April 30, 2022, 01:25:39 PM »


I’m not sure how to feel about the diktat not wanting carriers, do they get anything in exchange for that? Like maybe some light high tech splash to go with their mainly Midline Line up?

Hmm, I'm not sure I understand this framing - why would they? Carriers aren't "better"; so what they get in exchange is just "more non-carriers". If you mean for purposes of variety, though - I think having a more... homogenous? ... ship lineup actually helps their fleets stand out more when you're fighting them.

Well the thing is that PL also primarily uses Midline also, and unless I missed something in the blog post, that’s not changing. So couldn’t one argue that PL is already homogenous in that aspect for midline? And since the lore drop from the new weapons tells us that TT is helping the diktat behind the scenes, wouldn’t it be more interesting to have HT sprinkled in to differentiate them more? Otherwise it will just feel like PL without the carriers and primarily just falcon and eagle/etc spam. Which I feel would make them boring to fight in the long run.

Maybe it’s just me but I feel it would be more interesting if the diktat/The Lion weren’t so seemingly... unbelievably incompetent as they seem to be heading outside of the weapons department. I can believe being somewhat incompetent but personally, it would be more interesting for them to be lead by a Competent but still flawed leader rather standard evil dictator that doesnt anything right.

To address this and similar comments, there is (and will be) more to the Sindrian Diktat than just a military built on loyalty over competence. I do also think authoritarian dictatorships tend to fare poorly in running a competent high-tech military in particular, and particularly when left to rot for a long time, for logically consistent and historically-supported reasons vs. how media portrayals tend to make them look ultra-competent both in their own propaganda and in opposing narratives. But this line of thought risks getting wildly off-topic...

-- Back to my point: I look forward to exploring why this all happens, what it means for various parties involved, and throwing some scifi fun into the mix then blowing it up in the player's face, if they are so inclined. I don't want to get into spoilers for upcoming stuff so I guess all I can say is that the point of the Sindrian Diktat is not "lol look at how much they suck".

(..... I actually do think the Expanse has a very interesting take on the whole theme and narrative of scifi military dictatorships, though I don't want to spoil the last three books by going into it at all.)

Hopefully that is case. I’ll wait for the update then
Logged

HiddenPorpoise

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 20
    • View Profile
Re: Uniquifying the Factions, Part 2
« Reply #44 on: April 30, 2022, 01:27:54 PM »

I'd be tempted to give the modification package a 2% hull durability bonus that any fine officer could point to while also being completely not worth it.
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 27