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Author Topic: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.  (Read 2411 times)

Axetongler

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Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« on: April 20, 2022, 04:13:11 PM »

First of all, I feel there isn't much of choice when it comes to missions, realistically there can only 3~6 of bounties that can be taken at a time, and similar amount of exploration, both can be less with choosing who to fight/who to help.
Since it's like that, for me there is not much of "planning" I can do when it comes to hyperspace travel, so it really doesn't matter if I know which direction slipstreams are going.
Additionally, even if I managed to utilize it, it still hurts me when I try to go back, which makes slipstreams negate itself.
And then they doesn't always go for the location I'm looking to.

For my feel, shortened hyperspace travel due to the slipstream happens really rare (which can be rather small bonus because it's usually short or goes weird direction), yet the amount of forced emergency burn because of crossing slipstream is so much, I don't know if it's bias on my side or I'm actually getting lot more hurts than benefit in this situation.
Wish they will be either less hindering to cross, or much more rewarding to use (I don't know how to make it rewarding though).
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Amoebka

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2022, 02:10:38 AM »

For what it's worth, I feel the same way. 90% of the time they are actively harmful.

They can be nice when you just randomly fly system to system trying to find stuff and don't care about directions, but that's an extremely suboptimal way to play in general.
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Grievous69

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2022, 02:18:27 AM »

I feel like slipstreams really helped to make hyperspace more interesting but since so many players find them annoying, I propose a simple fix. Make it way easier to just pass through them. So no fancy maneuvers like using Emergency burn, cancelling Sustained burn and finding the thinnest part (going in the opposite direction should still push you back tho). Sure this would make them feel less impactful, and to that I say screw it, anything to make travel less frustrating.
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Megas

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2022, 05:13:01 AM »

I was lucky to have streams frequently cross my system or path near it.  Occasionally, streams went the way I wanted to go, and my fleet rode them.  One time, from my system to a bounty.

That said, streams were no better than 50/50 in my favor, and crossing streams in the way are an annoyance.
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SafariJohn

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2022, 06:09:08 AM »

IMO the main reason they are so annoying to cross for many people is because every time it happens you are reminded how slipstreams were supposed to make travel faster.

I think if slipstreams were shorter, more random, and a little more numerous - think like connecting adjacent constellations - they would be easier to avoid and actually useful more often.
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Great Wound

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2022, 06:14:31 AM »

Since it's like that, for me there is not much of "planning" I can do when it comes to hyperspace travel, so it really doesn't matter if I know which direction slipstreams are going.

Any easy fix would be to make the slipstreams visible on the map so you could plan a journey accordingly.

I think a good solution would be to make slip streams spread out more thinly but add a buffer zone around them that clears hyper space storms that way transit becomes a choice. In which case it would also be beneficial to have slipstreams form a circuit/loop around the core worlds so taking streams is always an option. It would give a player more choice in their utility.

"Do I take a detour and ride slip streams closer to my destination or do I go the direct route and risk being thrown off course by hyperspace storms".

michail

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2022, 08:52:28 AM »

They'd be flne if it were not for the combination of forced movement and the scale. I don't think reducing the scale would completely remove the annoyance without making them useless. It might even make it worse: if the overall length of slipstreams remains the same, but is distributed among a larger number of shorter slipstreams, more of them will be in the way. Axing the forced movement is the way to go IMO, assuming it's technically viable.

I think if slipstreams were shorter, more random, and a little more numerous - think like connecting adjacent constellations - they would be easier to avoid and actually useful more often.
I don't want to avoid anything in hyperspace to get from point A to point B on an average mundane trip. Travel doesn't have to be exciting, I just want to get there with minimal hassle. If I can't, I want to have meaningful interactions during travel. Dodging obstacles or taking an obvious shortcut is not a meaningful interaction. Deciding whether or not to fight pirates/[REDACTED] or whether to take a small detour to investigate something is.
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Delta_of_Isaire

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2022, 04:17:40 AM »

I feel like slipstreams really helped to make hyperspace more interesting but since so many players find them annoying, I propose a simple fix. Make it way easier to just pass through them. So no fancy maneuvers like using Emergency burn, cancelling Sustained burn and finding the thinnest part (going in the opposite direction should still push you back tho). Sure this would make them feel less impactful, and to that I say screw it, anything to make travel less frustrating.

Agreed this is the main trouble with slipstreams. Crossing them without E-burn is too cumbersome, and since E-burn costs fuel and supplies I always feel bad about using it for what is clearly a non-life-threatening situation.

Aside from this slipstreams are fine IMHO. I find useful slipstreams at a reasonable frequency.
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Megas

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2022, 06:11:36 AM »

Agreed this is the main trouble with slipstreams. Crossing them without E-burn is too cumbersome, and since E-burn costs fuel and supplies I always feel bad about using it for what is clearly a non-life-threatening situation.
Agreed.  Also, the player needs to manually steer the fleet to cross the stream.  If player tries to autopilot through, the fleet gets sucked down the stream, e-burn or not.

Slipstreams are the bane for those who just want to autopilot through the sector.
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Kakroom

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2022, 03:24:14 PM »

Agreed this is the main trouble with slipstreams. Crossing them without E-burn is too cumbersome, and since E-burn costs fuel and supplies I always feel bad about using it for what is clearly a non-life-threatening situation.
Agreed.  Also, the player needs to manually steer the fleet to cross the stream.  If player tries to autopilot through, the fleet gets sucked down the stream, e-burn or not.

Slipstreams are the bane for those who just want to autopilot through the sector.

On the one hand I sympathize with the aim to cut down on the player alt-tabbing every 10-20 minutes just so they can go to a location a couple dozen lightyears away.

On the other hand I do feel like "remedying" that with "potential inconvenience" is... not a satisfactory solution. Ideally manual travel would be more engaging, rather than autopilot travel being more potentially irritating

I think the ghosts edge on contributing to the former while (my opinion on this has changed over time) slipstreams contribute to the latter. Ghosts are weird and do cool stuff that make you glad you hyperspaced. Slipstreams are more often than not a looming problem that require naught but an emergency burn (and a present eye) to fix. Apart from some visual/mechanical flavor they're boring.
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Megas

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2022, 03:30:48 PM »

I think the ghosts edge on contributing to the former while (my opinion on this has changed over time) slipstreams contribute to the latter. Ghosts are weird and do cool stuff that make you glad you hyperspaced. Slipstreams are more often than not a looming problem that require naught but an emergency burn (and a present eye) to fix. Apart from some visual/mechanical flavor they're boring.
The ghost that orbits the fleet and spams its version of Interdiction Pulse is annoying too.  As soon as I see a fast ghost trying to orbit my fleet, it is an automatic IP of my own to make it disappear.

The only ghost that is interesting is the rare one that warps in as an Ordos fleet, and only if I have Automated Ships to loot and recover the hulls.

The other ghosts are effectively ambient or background effects.
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Yunru

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2022, 02:05:45 AM »

The ghost that orbits the fleet and spams its version of Interdiction Pulse is annoying too.  As soon as I see a fast ghost trying to orbit my fleet, it is an automatic IP of my own to make it disappear.
And in doing so, you also drive away the loot ghosts, that exhibit very similar behaviour.

Megas

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2022, 05:26:38 AM »

And in doing so, you also drive away the loot ghosts, that exhibit very similar behaviour.
I have yet to see a ghost that does not ping after it orbits my fleet.  The pinging ghosts block s-burn with their IPs, which make them an annoyance.
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Amoebka

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Re: Slipstream feels unrewarding for how annoying it can be.
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2022, 08:56:51 AM »

To be fair loot ghosts are useless anyway. They only have ~5 ly range, and often point to the system you just looted. 90% of time it's just ruins, too, which actively makes me ignore them. If they at least only spawned for exciting stuff they would be worth investigating.
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