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Author Topic: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)  (Read 95628 times)

chrizeren

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2022, 01:58:44 PM »

Im loving the ship designs. They fit really well.
I dont know if this is a little nitpick-ish, but it doesn't seem like the ships in my colonial defense fleets ever use the interstellar federation weapons, even if i prioritize them over vanilla weapons.
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BHH

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2022, 11:13:15 PM »

some how most the ships only require 10 DP, and I use command to get all blueprints but still miss some ships in this mod
Ok, I cross checked with two prominent mods the values for Supply per Deployment and Month, CR per deployment, CR regeneration per day. I adjusted them to more reflect the modern standard for their size class.
I also noticed the prices were not as high as the new version sets everything. I made the ships more expensive, but it probably isn't enough yet. Waiting for more feedback.

Update is uploaded in first post.

Thanks a lot ;D, also I fund a orbital laser that cost 950 dp and wonder where is it used.
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Vandermeer

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2022, 06:03:55 AM »

Im loving the ship designs. They fit really well.
I dont know if this is a little nitpick-ish, but it doesn't seem like the ships in my colonial defense fleets ever use the interstellar federation weapons, even if i prioritize them over vanilla weapons.
Yes, same with the ships actually. I already had this listed under "issues" in the first post. It is the same actually with any ship mod out there. For some reason your personal faction seems to ignore your preferences most of the time. Not sure what to do about that, or if there is just something I misunderstand about the mechanic. Others welcome to comment and educate me on the problem.

Thanks a lot ;D, also I fund a orbital laser that cost 950 dp and wonder where is it used.
I have no idea either; it always came with the mod. Well, I can make an educated guess, because if you look into the graphic folder for the ships, you can see an "earthcracker" design, which looks like an orbital or satellite. It was unrealized in the original mod, but I would bet that it was meant to mount such a weapon/ should have come with it inbuilt.

Currently you would need to custom mod some hull to have over 950 ordnance though. :P
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Draconas

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2022, 03:14:53 PM »

So far I'm really liking weapons/ships, only a few comments;

Weapons;
Cain - Any chance on a tone down of the impact? not a big fan of flash banging myself every few seconds with a single weapon, and having more than one is just Eye Cancer.

Cain/Hadron Accelerator - tone down firing sounds just a tad, they are quite loud for their power (Superweapons arsenal BFG Ultra would make sense being that loud with its huge power and low ROF, but these fire fast enough to warrant a volume decrease)

Ships;
The ships look great, but mechanically I feel they are missing something, few people I play with agree. They are missing flavour, by that I mean Built In mods specific to the faction (think Shadowyard's engines or Apex armor). You could add that extra stats into a built in hullmod or other specific hullmods to give them that extra edge. Think something similar to the XIV group buff or on the other hullmod side the range extender the Paragon has, but make it slightly less (think other ships have hullmod like this, Gown from Scalartech maybe)
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Melcyna

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2022, 04:57:13 AM »

Hadron Accelerator IS basically a super weapon,
I mean it hits for 9750 dmg (x2 to shields).

It will overload most ship that had their shield up in one shot unless that ship is using fortress shield or similar shield efficiency enhancing ability and have battleship grade flux cap.

and even against armor (where it 'only' does 4875 dmg), well...
I mean, that's basically like getting smashed by a Reaper torpedo, ok Reaper does x2 to armor, but you know... that's still basically torpedo grade damage (and it does twice the dmg than Reaper to hull) in a super fast pin point precise shot... and anything that tries to bring their shield up against it is basically going to get overloaded instantly.

So imho, that sounds about right... I mean weapon that can hit harder than a Reaper torpedo (to shields and hull at least) with one shot (at a pretty long range at that) ought to sound like they mean business.

But yeah I agree with the ships themselves, they feel a bit odd next to other mods where each ships usually have some sort of flavor unique to them.
That said, I really like their visual designs (as well as some of the ships weapon arc) so I still use them even if they don't exactly have special flavor other than those 2.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2022, 05:08:34 AM by Melcyna »
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Vandermeer

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2022, 08:19:37 AM »

So far I'm really liking weapons/ships, only a few comments;

Weapons;
Cain - Any chance on a tone down of the impact? not a big fan of flash banging myself every few seconds with a single weapon, and having more than one is just Eye Cancer.

Cain/Hadron Accelerator - tone down firing sounds just a tad, they are quite loud for their power (Superweapons arsenal BFG Ultra would make sense being that loud with its huge power and low ROF, but these fire fast enough to warrant a volume decrease)

Ships;
The ships look great, but mechanically I feel they are missing something, few people I play with agree. They are missing flavour, by that I mean Built In mods specific to the faction (think Shadowyard's engines or Apex armor). You could add that extra stats into a built in hullmod or other specific hullmods to give them that extra edge. Think something similar to the XIV group buff or on the other hullmod side the range extender the Paragon has, but make it slightly less (think other ships have hullmod like this, Gown from Scalartech maybe)
Regarding the ships I wouldn't want to change anything. Adding this extra flavor of specialty might have become a trend over time in the mods, but the original of Interstellar Federation is rather old -up to the beginning days of Starsector-, and I want to keep it original. I also think that the rather unique layout of the ships (or as Melcyna says, the weapon arcs) are in some sense their individual touch.
That being said, if I hear enough people pointing this out and maybe even coming up with ideas, I could probably just make another special version with flavor upgrades in them, like I already did with the higher stats one. I will see.

For the weapons: Yes, the Hadron is a superweapon, and you normally can pretty much only get it via console (or amazing luck), so this is working as intended. For the Cain, ...that is actually my favorite weapon out of the mod, and I usually go all out with them on the big carrier ship. I personally love that every single shot you can fire every couple seconds seems like some blistering blinding calamity has just descended. The weapon seems like it compacted a solar flare and hurled it towards some unsuspecting -soon to be lava- little spaceboat. The destruction is so great that the screen flashes and breaches the fourth wall through the harm of the users eyes as well. ;D ;D
I am unlikely to change that. In fact, if I could also add screen shake to it too, I probably would. ;)
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Oni

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2022, 10:12:31 AM »

I have a question, the Weftin version let the Independents have access to the ship set and I actually kinda liked that since it gave them their own thing.
I don't think this is it's own faction, though I could be wrong, so do these only exist as blueprints to find or does anyone get it by default?
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connortron7

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #22 on: April 08, 2022, 12:52:00 PM »

Im loving the ship designs. They fit really well.
I dont know if this is a little nitpick-ish, but it doesn't seem like the ships in my colonial defense fleets ever use the interstellar federation weapons, even if i prioritize them over vanilla weapons.
Yes, same with the ships actually. I already had this listed under "issues" in the first post. It is the same actually with any ship mod out there. For some reason your personal faction seems to ignore your preferences most of the time. Not sure what to do about that, or if there is just something I misunderstand about the mechanic. Others welcome to comment and educate me on the problem.

Thanks a lot ;D, also I fund a orbital laser that cost 950 dp and wonder where is it used.
I have no idea either; it always came with the mod. Well, I can make an educated guess, because if you look into the graphic folder for the ships, you can see an "earthcracker" design, which looks like an orbital or satellite. It was unrealized in the original mod, but I would bet that it was meant to mount such a weapon/ should have come with it inbuilt.

Currently you would need to custom mod some hull to have over 950 ordnance though. :P
The earthcracker was once a "boss" enemy back in the super early days of starsector, back when we only had 3 factions and 1 star system, it would orbit the sun and ear through your fleet, but would give great loot for the time.

Vandermeer

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #23 on: April 08, 2022, 12:56:28 PM »

I have a question, the Weftin version let the Independents have access to the ship set and I actually kinda liked that since it gave them their own thing.
I don't think this is it's own faction, though I could be wrong, so do these only exist as blueprints to find or does anyone get it by default?
No, they only exist as blueprints. In the first historic conception of the mod by Keptin, they were actually their own faction, though the game mechanics were vastly different then. I was struggling to decide whether they should become a faction in the new age. Before you could very tightly ally with one side, essentially making that empire yours. But now, since 4x mechanics exist, the only faction that is truly ever "your side", is the one you found yourself, so that is already in.
My thinking process was thus that having to share these cool unique designs with some random other spawned faction that is never actually on your side, kind of takes away from them being "your ships"/"your empire". So I decided against placing them as their own faction.
Decision open to council though.


The earthcracker was once a "boss" enemy back in the super early days of starsector, back when we only had 3 factions and 1 star system, it would orbit the sun and ear through your fleet, but would give great loot for the time.
Ohh, I never saw that part. Interesting. This mod is truly a fossil. :)
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Oni

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #24 on: April 08, 2022, 01:15:03 PM »

I have a question, the Weftin version let the Independents have access to the ship set and I actually kinda liked that since it gave them their own thing.
I don't think this is it's own faction, though I could be wrong, so do these only exist as blueprints to find or does anyone get it by default?
No, they only exist as blueprints. In the first historic conception of the mod by Keptin, they were actually their own faction, though the game mechanics were vastly different then. I was struggling to decide whether they should become a faction in the new age. Before you could very tightly ally with one side, essentially making that empire yours. But now, since 4x mechanics exist, the only faction that is truly ever "your side", is the one you found yourself, so that is already in.
My thinking process was thus that having to share these cool unique designs with some random other spawned faction that is never actually on your side, kind of takes away from them being "your ships"/"your empire". So I decided against placing them as their own faction.
Decision open to council though.....
Well, you could always give "weaker" versions of the ship set to the Independents as their "faction" ships, and the make "elite" higher power ones (in the same vein as the XIV variant ships) that have to be found (either as salvage or blueprints).

Lots of fun ways you could do that, in-built D-Mods for the "weaker" ships (Degraded Template for example), or take a page from the XIV and give them a stat buffing mod, give the elites a fancy paint job, etc.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2022, 01:18:47 PM by Oni »
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elite24

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2022, 11:40:38 PM »

some how most the ships only require 10 DP, and I use command to get all blueprints but still miss some ships in this mod
The deployment point costs I had overtaken from the original mod, so I guess this is a balancing issue now appearing in the new 0.9 era. Back then frigates actually cost more to deploy than capitals, so you will see these costs going down to 5 even on battleships in the current state.
I agree that this needs correcting. I will cross reference this with other mods later and release a version where this cost pyramid is the right way around.

As for the blueprints, yes, I experienced this issue too and had asked in the forum, but nobody got an answer for me. Currently the only way to get the rarer designs through console is to add the item "ifed_ship_package2" manually, which will give you all the missing designs. Don't ask me why the command line mod doesn't include these blueprints, because they certainly exist.

The blueprints being split into two packages because of how the ships are tagged in ship_data.csv. the tag section controls what blueprint packages each ship falls under. Most of the ships are under ifed_ship_bp, but some are under ifed_ship_bp2, and the prototypes (mk. 2s) are under rare_bp. ifed_ship_bp and ifed_ship_bp2 tags are part of the mod, defined in data/campaign/special_items.csv. This means that a player needs to find both blueprint packages to unlock most of the Federation ships (they are effectively split between two packages, believe Shadowyards does something similar). rare_bp is base game tag, and means that the ships aren't part of any package, and will only be dropped as single blueprints (think paragon, hyperion, etc.). Up to you if you want to change any of the functionality here. Also noticed that the Titan/Ocean class Battlecarriers have inconsistent text, still referring to them as the Titan (always liked the titan name, but probably conflicted with another mod back in the day maybe?). Also you might want to consider adding the NO_AUTO_ESCORT ship hint to the carriers, depending on how you want them to play.

As for making the mod it's own faction, I personally am a big fan of that idea, as that gives me a lot more opportunity to interact against the ships (and fight against them!). Plus the Federation has a nice style that could be expanded upon. However, you could also double down on making them a special "player only" faction by adding some lore and story to the world, and take advantage of the new story features to make it clear why only the player has access to these ships. You could even add campaign missions where the player has to build up this new fleet. Obviously more work either way, but it would add some nice spice.

And speaking of spice, I have no issues with the idea of "modernizing"/uniqifying the faction a bit via ship systems. Probably could use the tune up, but whatever systems are added should fit the theme of the ships/feel like it fits (for example, I could imagine a system that drastically expands weapon firing arcs so a federation ship could bring it's full arsenal to bare for a short period - though don't know how to explain turret suddenly being able to turn more, ahh minutia). Might add a bit more life into the faction and make it feel more modern, but also isn't necessary. I'll have to play test the ships a bit to see if anything sticks out!
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Vandermeer

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #26 on: April 11, 2022, 08:47:25 AM »

As for the blueprints, yes, I experienced this issue too and had asked in the forum, but nobody got an answer for me. Currently the only way to get the rarer designs through console is to add the item "ifed_ship_package2" manually, which will give you all the missing designs. Don't ask me why the command line mod doesn't include these blueprints, because they certainly exist.

The blueprints being split into two packages because of how the ships are tagged in ship_data.csv. the tag section controls what blueprint packages each ship falls under. Most of the ships are under ifed_ship_bp, but some are under ifed_ship_bp2, and the prototypes (mk. 2s) are under rare_bp. ifed_ship_bp and ifed_ship_bp2 tags are part of the mod, defined in data/campaign/special_items.csv. This means that a player needs to find both blueprint packages to unlock most of the Federation ships (they are effectively split between two packages, believe Shadowyards does something similar). rare_bp is base game tag, and means that the ships aren't part of any package, and will only be dropped as single blueprints (think paragon, hyperion, etc.).
The problem here is however that the "allblueprints" command gives me all the bps associated with the ifed_ship_bp tag, and also all the rare_bps. For some reason it does not give me the ifed_ship_bp2 ones, even though they are of a blueprint package like the other. I have seen it done this way in other mods (like the Hiigaran one), where this worked fine.
I must be doing something wrong here obviously, but I cannot spot it. This is the only tag on those ships, and the principle is just duplicated for the "bp" and "bp2" packages.

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Also noticed that the Titan/Ocean class Battlecarriers have inconsistent text, still referring to them as the Titan (always liked the titan name, but probably conflicted with another mod back in the day maybe?)
Good spot. Yes, that happened in the unbalanced version, because I later shifted to actually calling both versions (mk1 and 2) "Ocean" in that one. Is corrected.

Quote
Also you might want to consider adding the NO_AUTO_ESCORT ship hint to the carriers, depending on how you want them to play.
Done. I actually expected for CARRIER + COMBAT in tandem to work this way, but good to know that wasn't it. Though I have also not seen any strange behavior until now honestly, but better be sure.
Uploads are refreshed with these little changes.

Quote
As for making the mod it's own faction, I personally am a big fan of that idea, as that gives me a lot more opportunity to interact against the ships (and fight against them!). Plus the Federation has a nice style that could be expanded upon. However, you could also double down on making them a special "player only" faction by adding some lore and story to the world, and take advantage of the new story features to make it clear why only the player has access to these ships. You could even add campaign missions where the player has to build up this new fleet. Obviously more work either way, but it would add some nice spice.
Well, since this is like 70% for my own use, and only 30% to honor Keptin's contribution and keep the flame alive, I will certainly not do the story thing. I do actually play in a very RP fashion in my own game, starting with a mysterious Ares-class inheritance on my lv1 nobody with no money. Then working myself up to the first grand rEdacTdd system exploration to receive/unearth a Yukon (..via console) following "my relatives diary". With that and more new information(after finding all non-rare bps), I ventured deep into my massive map to found the federation on the technology in the distance, which slowly gives me access to the rest.
My officers have story too, but the thing is: I can make all this up in my head. Doing work for popups that are already spoilered to me, just isn't worth it for my own use.

Not to mention heavy modding like this could actually scare away future potential updaters. I mean, if people actually like it, they will then demand to only play the story laden version in the future, which might be more difficult to maintain.
No, my 30% mission here is also egoistic to a degree, that I hope to maybe spur others to keep this alive should there be another major update. ..Because then I don't have to do anything anymore. ;D


That being said, since it was in the original, I can see on your other point how having an option to make them a faction could be interesting just under the "I want to fight these ships as enemies" lens.
I will see to it in time, though I am currently too busy to look into it. Perhaps in 2-3 weeks.

Quote
And speaking of spice, I have no issues with the idea of "modernizing"/uniqifying the faction a bit via ship systems. Probably could use the tune up, but whatever systems are added should fit the theme of the ships/feel like it fits (for example, I could imagine a system that drastically expands weapon firing arcs so a federation ship could bring it's full arsenal to bare for a short period - though don't know how to explain turret suddenly being able to turn more, ahh minutia). Might add a bit more life into the faction and make it feel more modern, but also isn't necessary.
Well, that turret idea is not taken.
Waiting for other ideas. Since they kind of seem of the iPod clean faction, perhaps something techie with shield hits?
Hmm, I already advertise their unique armor technology in their description, so something related to that would actually feel the most right to me.
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CriticalMG

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #27 on: April 17, 2022, 10:16:24 PM »

I really like the ship designs! On a minor note, some of the weapons/ships are lacking descriptions. Some flavor text would be a nice addition  :)
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Droll

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #28 on: April 27, 2022, 04:40:29 PM »

I find the idea most of the weapons being limited ammo interesting as a balancing factor. I'm surprised that the unbalanced version has this.

Hypothetically, how easy would it be for someone to mod the mod so that these weapons had "infinite" ammo? Edit 2: Literally as easy as a .csv file edit

Edit: Also, the quad lancer torpedo looks weird on the Auria Battleship, specifically talking about the large universal hardpoint at the center. The sheer size of the torpedoes partially cover over the 4 nearby medium mounts.

In fact, IMO the lancer torpedoes in general are quite large.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2022, 06:31:29 PM by Droll »
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Vandermeer

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Re: [0.95.1a] Interstellar Federation (refurbished)
« Reply #29 on: April 28, 2022, 07:36:38 AM »

I find the idea most of the weapons being limited ammo interesting as a balancing factor. I'm surprised that the unbalanced version has this.

Hypothetically, how easy would it be for someone to mod the mod so that these weapons had "infinite" ammo? Edit 2: Literally as easy as a .csv file edit
Yupp, ammunition handling is pretty well integrated into the standard game. I agree that it serves well for balancing, but also flair (rare munition adds imagination of massive projectiles), which is why I left it there for the amped up version too. Note though that ammunition capacity is still greatly enhanced in the balanced version, so I basically never run out except for serious invasion battles where enemies come around with 10 battleships and such.

Quote
Edit: Also, the quad lancer torpedo looks weird on the Auria Battleship, specifically talking about the large universal hardpoint at the center. The sheer size of the torpedoes partially cover over the 4 nearby medium mounts.

In fact, IMO the lancer torpedoes in general are quite large.
I also realized this problem, but I didn't want to change the original, since this was the intent of the author. It is somewhat better on the Antares for which I presume it was made, but yeah, they generally seem a tad bit too big.

I really like the ship designs! On a minor note, some of the weapons/ships are lacking descriptions. Some flavor text would be a nice addition  :)
I will do that when I have time next week again.
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