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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.86-RC3)  (Read 989467 times)

c plus one

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #645 on: February 05, 2014, 02:46:39 PM »

you are playing them wrong then..ive played them and never once was i in any danger....even worse if you carrier fleet them...they are unstoppable once you master them...I mean the antedilluvians can get them but they are in progress...plus they still win most of the auto matches.....the one thing that is even bad about neutrinos is the super bomber...its ai doent launch the bomb at all in 96% of battles...it just lumbers about trying to dodge small things

Edited to fix the quote tags -- SeaBee

Don't tell me I'm playing anything wrong in a singleplayer sandbox game. Just don't.

SilverSilence! that is sig-worthy, bro.


as far as i can see, and i've been playing this mod since well before i signed up on the game forum, FlashFrozen never made any claim that Neutrino Corporation is in close balance with any other mod or even with any given part of vanilla. And FF just explicitly reminded the world that this mod is labeled as overpowered, period. frankly, i like +95% of it as it is. even rolling back a nerf or two would be good. now, if i dont even mind often getting my airlock doors blown off by this faction (defeat should always be educational! lol), then i surely dont mind also being in the Neutrino driver's seat and doing a bit of roflstomping myself.

FlashFrozen''s also just made it plain that he's not going to bow to outside demands that significantly contradict his own development vision, whether they might come from a possible 'lone gunman' or even an entire mob of them. I admire him for that.

And no, i'm not >implying that FF is a perfect god and we must mutely grovel at his feet! :D It's cool to listen to player suggestions that're helpful and polite, but a mod-maker is under zero obligation to act upon any of them, either. NC simply is what it is, and certain very vocal critics need to accept that and move on. it's FlashFrozen's party - we're the guests in his house.

a small minority appear to have a really hard time understanding this; IDK why. They might not agree with him (at ALL), and that's honestly fine too, but they need to understand it regardless. However, a player that's apparently trying to 'blame' that basic reality on other players? I don't get that at all. To put it mildly, the recent blunt claim of 'you are playing them wrong then' is not being helpful.

dudes, if somebody expects from a given mod a result that's not different from what vanilla SS gives them, i humbly suggest that perhaps somebody should consider playing another mod. ::)

Anybody with a complaint can simply tweak their own copy of the mod to fit their personal tastes - FlashFrozen just explicitly invited anyone who's getting dusted by NC to do that very thing to weaken it. We are in a 1-player game that has no competitive multi-player powerlevelling aspect, so tweak away and don't worry about it.

Modding gives mod-players huge flexibility in extending and changing the official game, but we can and should change the mods themselves whenever we wish - either based on nothing more than fun whims, or as we feel is 'necessary'. don't be shy about doing that. Sometimes it seems there's a really irrational allergy about that in some game communities.

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Quote from: Lopunny Zen
you are playing them wrong then..

Don't tell me I'm playing anything wrong in a singleplayer sandbox game. Just don't.

FasterThanSleepyfish

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #646 on: February 05, 2014, 03:29:54 PM »

Nice job on the feels-to-text transition, no rant required!

Anyways, there will always be people who will never get it, it's just a fact of life. Gotta deal with those someday.
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Flare

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #647 on: February 05, 2014, 11:52:08 PM »

dude ballistics dont do jack...like i said they have normal armor and the shields sponge the damage too much...even the ai has an idea where to point it and the allied ai has no idea how to fight it..they just plow ahead at the shields in vain. Why not have normal range and powered shields..this team is very unique as it is...ive never lost with this team and its easy to take on anything you want...it took me short time to take over the galaxy with this team...point is the shiled range may seem like the downside but they have as many ships as you(perhaps more) they have way more power and survivability...even the auto battle makes them win alot. Other then that the team is very cool looking and the unique weapons brings out their charm

Ballistics create hard flux that can't be vented. You just need to to have good timing when their shields come down to either vent or relieve flux. Other than that, the main feature of ballistics is that some of them are pretty inaccurate, inaccurate enough sometimes to shoot wide of the tiny shield and into the hull. In any case, I don't feel like the neutrino weapon have good weaponry. In most cases, you can let down your shields sometimes because there's such a long delay before the next salvo.
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"Now witness the firepower of this thoroughly buggy and unoperational batt... Oh, hell, you know what? Just ignore the battle station, okay?"

Amurka

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #648 on: February 06, 2014, 12:23:03 AM »

Not everyone has the know-how or the time to go through the code and "tweak" OP mods down to fun play-levels. Most of us probably just want to grab the file and go...

So MY proposal is that those people with the know-how, or someone who has ALREADY tweaked it closer to vanilla, post their faction file here on the forums, so the rest of us don't ALL separately need to waste our time...
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Flare

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #649 on: February 06, 2014, 01:19:03 AM »

You'd probably stand a better chance of getting that if you include a please in thar and avoid all-capping words :P.
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The battle station is not completely operational, shall we say.

"Now witness the firepower of this thoroughly buggy and unoperational batt... Oh, hell, you know what? Just ignore the battle station, okay?"

Erick Doe

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #650 on: February 06, 2014, 06:12:09 AM »

Not everyone has the know-how or the time to go through the code and "tweak" OP mods down to fun play-levels. Most of us probably just want to grab the file and go...

So MY proposal is that those people with the know-how, or someone who has ALREADY tweaked it closer to vanilla, post their faction file here on the forums, so the rest of us don't ALL separately need to waste our time...

That's fine. But those who wish to post their tweaked versions have to request permission of the mod's original author first.
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Lopunny Zen

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #651 on: February 06, 2014, 06:16:02 AM »

and yeah they make hardcap but your dead by then and they flux it in half a second
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Punch Clock Horrors

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #652 on: February 06, 2014, 07:49:28 AM »

I can attest to the fact that Neutrino vessels are weak against swarms.
I got pulverized in a Banshee when fighting against an astral and a bunch of strike craft. Their side was  90 fleet points and it was overkill.
Neutrino ships are essentially built around requiring that you try and outmaneuver them and pick them apart one at a time.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2014, 10:19:42 AM by Punch Clock Horrors »
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Silver Silence

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #653 on: February 06, 2014, 08:03:25 AM »

Long range ballistic weaponry such as Gauss Cannons from the vanilla game, or Cains from the IFed can push Neutrino flux levels up relatively quickly. And so long as you keep yourself in range of them with the long-range weaponry, Neutrino ships will be fearful of venting their flux, even though it literally takes them 1-2 seconds to do it. Large Neutrino ships such as the Banshee can be clipped as they turn broadside to use their beamers, you can shoot fore or aft, preferably aft so that you burn out their engines and cast them adrift, making it much easier to maneuver around them and keep putting damage into the edges of the ship.

Most Neutrino ships use beamers while a couple use the new batteries which fire projectiles instead. The beamers can be tanked easily though it's ill-advised to try it in a ship like an Onslaught or a Conquest because both have horribly in-efficient shields even after hardening and in the case of the Onslaught, little in the way of passive flux venting. The ones with long-range projectiles are harder to deal with and certainly require multiple ships to attack them with, or just another Neutrino ship of your own that cares not for such shenanigans. You quite simply don't want to take on Neutrino ships with low-efficiency shields or low-tech ships as such ships often come with weak shielding.

Not everyone has the know-how or the time to go through the code and "tweak" OP mods down to fun play-levels. Most of us probably just want to grab the file and go...

So MY proposal is that those people with the know-how, or someone who has ALREADY tweaked it closer to vanilla, post their faction file here on the forums, so the rest of us don't ALL separately need to waste our time...
There's no code to skim through. Starting from the starsector folder, wherever you may have installed that, you go mods > neutrino mod > data > hulls and in the hulls folder, somewhere at the bottom will be a shipdata file. This can be opened in Excel, though I, myself, use OpenOffice to do this. A prompt appears in OpenOffice. All you need to do is make sure that the only separator acknowledged is the comma (,). Then something like this will appear. It all looks like random words and numbers with lots of mentions of Neutrino, but all we need to do is scroll to the right until we find the stats for the shields. Here, you can just go through all the shield efficiency numbers and change them to somewhere around 0.6-7. This will severely weaken Neutrino shields and make them much less tanky without adjusting any other aspects of the ships. For reference, "0.2" means that for every 10 points of damage, only 2 points will go toward raising flux. At "1.0" efficiency, 10 damage will translate into 10 flux build-up. "5.0" efficiency would mean 10 damage translates into 50 flux build-up. The lower this number is, the less damage the shields take, though I believe an efficiency of 0.0 breaks the game and I don't know how many zeroes you can put in before that breaks the game (as in setting efficiency to 0.001 which would mean a thousand damage translates into 1 point of flux build-up, or going even further than that). It takes maybe two minutes to do this, in which time you could probably start up the game and start a fight though not finish it. It's really not that long.

@Erick Doe
How about a guide showing how to adjust files and leaving users to do such things of their own volition? Also, you removed the Antediluvians from your signature of mods? R.I.P. ?


NINJA EDIT: Agreed. Neutrino shields might be strong, but they can only exist in one place at any given time. Numbers will win fights against Neutrino ships though not without losses unless you're just flying a fleet of Paragons.
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Amurka

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #654 on: February 08, 2014, 02:30:42 AM »

Not as bad as I thought. Thanks for teaching a man to fish.
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Dragar

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #655 on: February 08, 2014, 02:52:34 AM »

Kadur is also pretty good against Neutrino since they have lots of big angry guns with big angry missiles along with fighters/bombers that have the same load out of big angry armament. Also good against the Valkyrie too. Though Kadur Valk fights are pretty funny because they just become these giant armor vs armor slugfests.
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Lopunny Zen

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #656 on: February 11, 2014, 07:53:51 AM »

I can attest to the fact that Neutrino vessels are weak against swarms.
I got pulverized in a Banshee when fighting against an astral and a bunch of strike craft. Their side was  90 fleet points and it was overkill.
Neutrino ships are essentially built around requiring that you try and outmaneuver them and pick them apart one at a time.

Thats with every ship alone and the banshee has almost no options against fighters since its missile based and is meant to much bigger ships in the face so of course you lost...that ship never goes alone...but the problem is usually they have the same amount of ships then you and their carrier fleets are far worse then everyone elses except the Interstellar Federation since they have the heavy fighter with sabots that helps a little bit and the Titan Carrier which is VERY expensive to properly equip let alone make my advanced equipment. Aside from that their real enemies are gone right now until 1.0 which were Antediluvian's
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HELMUT

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #657 on: February 11, 2014, 08:11:37 AM »

It's not because Antediluvians aren't updated that Neutrinos are unbeatable. In my most recent campaign, i wrecked them with a bunch of Condors, Thunders and Gladius. Condor for long range fire support (it force the enemy to block the Pilums with their shields, leaving the way open for the fighters), thunders for disabling their PD, Gladius for the armor damage. The Warthog works well too but i find them too slow for my taste. And no, Neutrinos never outnumber you (i don't know for Exerelin though), their ships have a pretty big logistic points cost so unless you field massive capitals ships like the Ifed Titan, most of the time you fight them three against one.

Personally i rarely use ships classes higher than destroyer against them, waste of logistic points. No bombers as well, the AI always know when they're unleashing their payload and raise their shields just in time. I don't even bother to take down their shields, just let the heavy fighters doing the job.
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FlashFrozen

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #658 on: February 17, 2014, 11:28:52 PM »

Nothing new to say just testing out gifs and stuff and learning how awful it is to deal with them.

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Hehe.
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Piemanlives

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Re: Neutrino Corp. (v. 1.75)
« Reply #659 on: February 17, 2014, 11:58:30 PM »

HAMMERS!!!!
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This is called me throwing my missile swarm at you, and by swarm I mean massacre, and by missiles... I actually just mean missiles, there's actually not much to it really.
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