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Author Topic: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?  (Read 2510 times)

Kanjejou

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Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« on: December 06, 2021, 01:18:30 PM »

Tried brawler the fixed gun make is super meh. and Vigilance seem to be built to be an overpriced Pilum carrier

any good use for those ships?
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Jaghaimo

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2021, 01:31:26 PM »

I use Brawlers. It is a pocked Hammerhead. Especially the LP version, which comes with a built-in SO. Dual Assault Chaingun, dual Sabots, and you can kill any frigate or destroyer.
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Grievous69

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2021, 01:54:08 PM »

Vigilance is getting reworked in the upcoming patch. And yeah I also don't get Brawlers, pocket Hammerhead is a nice description but why would I ever need that? It's like 3 times less firepower with more weaknesses but I guess it's faster, yeah pass on that even if it was less DP.
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Thaago

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2021, 02:04:08 PM »

I like Brawlers, they just aren't "hunting" frigates because of their speed (unless SO, but even then they are bit slow for the role). They make really good escorts for destroyers and cruisers though, as they can 1v1 (nearly) any other frigate that tries to flank and even hold off destroyers. I don't use HVD/Mauler, as the lack of DPS neuters the ship and also costs a ton of OP.

Vigilances... yeah I hope the buffs are enough. Ok for missile spam I guess? But you only need to pay a little more to get Shrikes which are also good light gunboats.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 02:05:56 PM by Thaago »
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Amoebka

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2021, 03:08:36 PM »

I don't really know how people make Brawlers work. The AI is having a seizure every time there is a missile or a fighter wing on screen, because the ship has no turrets.
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Linnis

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2021, 05:53:38 PM »

Use brawlers together with some fighters like talons. When brawlers can just shoot uninterrupted they are pretty good firepower for its op cost.

Definately not a ship you can just let it do whatever it wants.
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Kos135

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2021, 07:26:29 PM »

and Vigilance seem to be built to be an overpriced Pilum carrier
The Vigilance is actually the most efficient pilum platform per deployment cost. 5 deployment points, 1 pilum + fast missile racks (instant reload every 15 seconds, basically a free 2nd pilum). But of course you have to bring a lot of them to reach critical mass with your pilum spam, if you only have a few pilums they'll just get chewed up by enemy PD.
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Thaago

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2021, 07:30:47 PM »

In smaller skirmishes, the Vigilance can lay down a lot of Salamanders thanks to its system. And on a per DP basis its a good source of both Pilums and Harpoons for support fire. But its just so fragile, and also slow, and has a narrow shield, and has either a poor turret pd with no main weapons or no pd at all, that its hard to keep alive.

I've had moderate success with Ion beam + Salamanders as a distraction/lockdown ship, but its just not really worth the hassle.
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Kos135

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Re: Vigilance and Brawler anybody do use them?
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2021, 08:44:20 PM »

I once had an idea for a pilum-centric fleet. A Hyperion as my flagship. 4 Pirate Falcons with 4 sabots for a bit of stopping power and disabling ships to make them vulnerable to the pilums, and 2 tactical lasers to give them a little damage-dealing ability and encourage the AI to space itself from enemy ships. 4 Condors with Thunders for PD and the two fighter-related skills (8 is the max number of wings before you start losing out on their bonuses), and of course pilums, for an effective 8 pilums. All 9 officers on the Falcons/Condors.

The bulk of the fleet is of course comprised of Vigilances, 21 of them, which brings the fleet's total DP up to 220 leaving 20 for non-combat ships. The Vigilances obviously have pilums bringing the total effective pilum count up to 50, and graviton beams which are mostly for influencing the AI's behavior, same as the tac lasers on the Falcons.

The idea is to have the entire fleet camp in a corner while the Hyperion scouts to establish line of sight with the enemy. As soon as we have line of sight, the fleet begins cranking out pilums. Unless the enemy closes the distance quickly they will fill the entire map with pilums and the enemy will be overwhelmed.

There are obviously some matchups where this gimmick won't work. For example, a large tanky ship with lots of PD turrets would probably be able to wade through the pilum cloud and shred through the Vigilances, assuming the Falcons can't overload it with sabots. The minelayers that Star Fortresses are equipped with could also hard-counter this fleet. If the minelayer's range extends to the corner of the map then this fleet would be completely useless against a Star Fortress. I'm honestly not sure about the range on the minelayers.
Frankly, any station aside from the crappy ones used by Pirates and LP would probably hard-counter this fleet.

And yes I do realize that this fleet isn't optimal. It's just a fun little idea I've had that I haven't bothered to test yet.

As for Brawlers, I don't really use them. I have used the Luddic Path Brawler a few times and those can be pretty nasty. Give them 2 assault cannons and they can punch far above their weight, but obviously the built-in safety overrides hullmod makes them a bad choice for lengthier battles. It's very nice for early game battles against soft targets like merchant caravans though.



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