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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.95.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 248899 times)

Fenrir

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #390 on: November 22, 2021, 12:30:33 PM »

Thank you - this is actually fixed for the next release! It's the "Fixed issue where multiple custom raid objectives would show up when only one of them should have given the context" item in the patch notes.

Oh that's what that term mean! I used to wonder what did it mean and it's clear now, thank you for your work!   :D
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Fenrir

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #391 on: November 22, 2021, 02:33:32 PM »

Light-years map legend no longer shown in star system map view, only in hyperspace

I just realized that the hyperspace terrain tooltip claiming about legend had wrongly labeled 1 grid = 1 light-year which is the case in system view, in hyperspace view one "big" grid is no longer further segmented into 9 smaller grids and one "grid" should equals to 3 light-years. Although the vanilla auto-pilot clearly labels the distance to target but I believe people would like to calculate distances to estimate their supply and fuel costs exploring multiple outer systems in series.


Also a few thoughts about the skill system remake, first of all there is no better word than "stunningly awesome" I could think about to describe the new mechanism. I believe the "Industry" could be renamed as "Engineering" as it will no longer have much to do with "Large scale industrial planning and production" but fairly amount about "Repair and maintenance skills practical applications and field creative solutions", also a few re-location of skills between "Technology" and "Industry" can be made as I believe Tech leans more to "Theocratical" and Indus can be more "Practical". For example moving "Automated ships" to Indus as more practical applications nowhere to find in any manual are applied to "tame" a rouge ai ship (and also solve the "neural link - auto ship" problem mentioned in blog as a side-effect).
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #392 on: November 22, 2021, 03:27:30 PM »

I just realized that the hyperspace terrain tooltip claiming about legend had wrongly labeled 1 grid = 1 light-year which is the case in system view, in hyperspace view one "big" grid is no longer further segmented into 9 smaller grids and one "grid" should equals to 3 light-years. Although the vanilla auto-pilot clearly labels the distance to target but I believe people would like to calculate distances to estimate their supply and fuel costs exploring multiple outer systems in series.

Hmm - it's definitely 1 light year per smaller cell side. The bigger 3x3 cells are 3 light-years a side.

Also a few thoughts about the skill system remake, first of all there is no better word than "stunningly awesome" I could think about to describe the new mechanism. I believe the "Industry" could be renamed as "Engineering" as it will no longer have much to do with "Large scale industrial planning and production" but fairly amount about "Repair and maintenance skills practical applications and field creative solutions", also a few re-location of skills between "Technology" and "Industry" can be made as I believe Tech leans more to "Theocratical" and Indus can be more "Practical". For example moving "Automated ships" to Indus as more practical applications nowhere to find in any manual are applied to "tame" a rouge ai ship (and also solve the "neural link - auto ship" problem mentioned in blog as a side-effect).

Ah - that I think illuminates the problem with calling it "Engineering" :) Since then it becomes closer to Technology and it's harder to make distinctions. Of course,  most of that is fairly arbitrary anyway. But, generally speaking, Industry skills are about improving resilience, while technology is a mix of exploration and other-stuff that sounds more or less higher-tech.

"Theoretical" and "practical" get really blurry - e.g. is it an understanding of the theory of how AI cores/automated systems work that enables the use of automated ships, or is it an understanding of some specific more practical applications? It'd be very easy to argue either way.

Glad you're into the skill changes overall, though, thank you!
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Fenrir

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #393 on: November 22, 2021, 03:33:16 PM »

Hmm - it's definitely 1 light year per smaller cell side. The bigger 3x3 cells are 3 light-years a side.

Sorry I didn't make it clear, I was trying to say that the hyperspace map did not segment the bigger "should be 3x3"cell like how it did in "in system" map and just look like "a" cell and can cause confusions.

Glad you're into the skill changes overall, though, thank you!

No reason not to go through the up coming very interesting design  :D
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #394 on: November 22, 2021, 03:36:07 PM »

Sorry I didn't make it clear, I was trying to say that the hyperspace map did not segment the bigger "should be 3x3"cell like how it did in "in system" map and just look like "a" cell and can cause confusions.

Ah, I see what you mean. At least the ruler in the bottom left helps with that, but yeah.
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SonnaBanana

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #395 on: November 22, 2021, 04:59:54 PM »

Any new colony structures/industries coming up? They're even more interesting than colony skills.
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DaShiv

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #396 on: November 23, 2021, 02:56:53 AM »

I would wager that the nature of Sabots providing extremely easy overloads (or, while not particularly relevant in this instance, shutting down the entirety of a ship's weaponry and easily winning the flux war) compared to needing a sustained combination of various weapons does make this fight significantly harder than without them.

Hmm. I wonder if maybe halving the EMP damage on the Sabots would put them in a better place, then. I still think they need to have an effect when armor-tanked, but the specific numbers on it, on the other hand...

And, hm, just making the AI better about armor-tanking Sabots could make a big difference here, though that's tricky.

Sorry I missed this earlier, but re: Sabots.

I appreciate the design intent for Sabots have some effect both when blocked and when unblocked by shields; however, I believe this also means that Sabots scale differently with increased ammo. Higher ammo count for HE missiles can be somewhat covered up either by wastage vs shields or lack of enough openings while enemy shields are down, but since Sabots are effective either way thanks to EMP, increased Sabot ammo feels much more impactful than increased HE missile ammo.

For high tech ships, especially ships like Aurora and Fury with multiple medium missiles, Sabot pods in 0.95a provide much more sustained shield breaking than in 0.91 due to increased max ammo per pod from 24 (+100%) to 36 (+200%), especially since it's even easier to reach now with build-in s-mod and officer skills without being forced to spend a huge pile of OP. In fact, currently many (most?) builds w/ Sabot pods no longer need to allocate other resources against shields. Rather than reducing the Sabot's impactfulness via reducing EMP damage, perhaps it makes more sense to return the sustainability of Sabot pods back closer to the 0.91 value of 24 max per pod. Either:
  • Decrease Sabot Pod base ammo to 10, max of 30 with all bonuses; or
  • Decrease Sabot Pod base ammo to 8 and also reduce OP cost to 8, max of 24 with all bonuses.
This way Sabots can still remain impactful in smaller scale battles (or when used judiciously by the player), but most Sabot ships (especially high tech ships) will be forced to carry more supplemental anti-shield weaponry for larger battles instead of relying on Sabot spam to always carry them through.

I think most will agree that even back when Sabots pods were 12 base and 24 max, they were already considered extremely strong.
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Grievous69

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #397 on: November 23, 2021, 03:06:59 AM »

Sabots are the only kinetic missile in both small and medium mounts, they're always going to be an easy choice on high tech ships. You can nerf them as much as you like and people will continue to spam them, up until the point when they get so nerfed they'll never be worth using. It's a nightmare of a weapon to balance properly purely because there's no alternative. Kinetic burst damages that costs no flux will be crazy good in all scenarios, that's just the nature of the game.
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ubuntufreakdragon

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #398 on: November 23, 2021, 03:19:01 AM »

colony wishlist:
adminstartor cap -> soft cap any further admin gets 5 times the payment or something like this.
military base give system wide stability bonus
upgrade for way station to stockpile resources
item for aquaculture similar to the one for farming + adds lobster.
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TerranEmpire

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #399 on: November 23, 2021, 05:00:47 AM »

colony wishlist:
adminstartor cap -> soft cap any further admin gets 5 times the payment or something like this.
military base give system wide stability bonus
upgrade for way station to stockpile resources
item for aquaculture similar to the one for farming + adds lobster.

seconded
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IonDragonX

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #400 on: November 23, 2021, 05:27:29 AM »

colony wishlist:
adminstartor cap -> soft cap any further admin gets 5 times the payment or something like this.
military base give system wide stability bonus
upgrade for way station to stockpile resources
item for aquaculture similar to the one for farming + adds lobster.
These are great suggestions. Would support.
Please remember that there is a Suggestions Forum for these while this is a Patch Notes thread.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #401 on: November 23, 2021, 06:05:06 AM »

For high tech ships, especially ships like Aurora and Fury with multiple medium missiles, Sabot pods in 0.95a provide much more sustained shield breaking than in 0.91 due to increased max ammo per pod from 24 (+100%) to 36 (+200%), especially since it's even easier to reach now with build-in s-mod and officer skills without being forced to spend a huge pile of OP. In fact, currently many (most?) builds w/ Sabot pods no longer need to allocate other resources against shields. Rather than reducing the Sabot's impactfulness via reducing EMP damage, perhaps it makes more sense to return the sustainability of Sabot pods back closer to the 0.91 value of 24 max per pod. Either:
What other resources against shields?  Without heavy mounts, there are no other good options!  They get stuck with energy weapons that are not very efficient compared to ballistics.  If they use blasters, they are inefficient.  If they use pulse lasers, they cannot hit-and-run and need time to drill armor, and they are probably need Energy Mastery to be efficient enough (which prevents getting Gunnery Implants, which is good for everyone.)

And I do not want less Sabots without Expanded Missile Racks.  They already have low enough ammo as it is.

For high-tech ships that cannot use Plasma Cannon, it is getting SO and lots of guns, getting Sabots and Missile Racks, or maybe getting all the flux you can get and leave all mounts except the main gun empty.

Sabots are the only kinetic missile in both small and medium mounts, they're always going to be an easy choice on high tech ships. You can nerf them as much as you like and people will continue to spam them, up until the point when they get so nerfed they'll never be worth using. It's a nightmare of a weapon to balance properly purely because there's no alternative. Kinetic burst damages that costs no flux will be crazy good in all scenarios, that's just the nature of the game.
And the second iteration with wide spread and AI always dropping shields to eat no more than half of the spread was a "so nerfed" moment.
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Hiruma Kai

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #402 on: November 23, 2021, 06:48:40 AM »

I do have a question about core worlds.  I may have missed it in the thread, but are NPC administrators losing access to ground operations and space operations as well as the player?  If so, are core worlds being modified to take into account a loss of up to 30% accessibility and -2 stability?  That strikes me as a pretty big hit for a number of worlds which typically are on the edge of just enough accessibility and/or stability with administrators.

Take Culann for instance.  In a brand new game, it sits at 86% accessibility (hostile with Hegemony, Church, Pathers, and Pirates does that).  If I edit the administrator to only have Industrial planning, the planet starts the game in shortage of supplies and ship hulls (due to it's military base), and surplus of metals, crew, and marines.  Given Culann is essentially the Tri-tach manufacturing world, it seems a bit odd for it's default state being insufficient access.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #403 on: November 23, 2021, 07:18:32 AM »

@ Hiruma Kai:  Good point about loss of skills dropping stability.  Do any of those worlds also have Free Port and/or Commerce?  The last thing we need is a planet (without quest armor) that will decivilize shortly after it takes a -3 stability penalty from pirates or raids.

Culann losing stability will be a bummer.  It is THE planet to raid for so much exclusive high-tech stuff.  It also has perma-Pather cells thanks to its alpha admin, and I am not chasing Pathers for core worlds' sake.

P.S.  If Culann really has an alpha admin, it should get Hypercognition.  Maybe just drop the human face since the Pather cell makes it very obvious who is running Culann - an alpha core.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2021, 08:40:23 AM by Megas »
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #404 on: November 23, 2021, 09:24:01 AM »

I do have a question about core worlds.  I may have missed it in the thread, but are NPC administrators losing access to ground operations and space operations as well as the player?  If so, are core worlds being modified to take into account a loss of up to 30% accessibility and -2 stability?  That strikes me as a pretty big hit for a number of worlds which typically are on the edge of just enough accessibility and/or stability with administrators.

Take Culann for instance.  In a brand new game, it sits at 86% accessibility (hostile with Hegemony, Church, Pathers, and Pirates does that).  If I edit the administrator to only have Industrial planning, the planet starts the game in shortage of supplies and ship hulls (due to it's military base), and surplus of metals, crew, and marines.  Given Culann is essentially the Tri-tach manufacturing world, it seems a bit odd for it's default state being insufficient access.

Culann is actually fine - its admin, which is *totally* not a front for an Alpha Core, has the new Hypercognition skill. I haven't noticed any other problems, though it's possible I might have missed something. Happy to double-check anything else specific!

item for aquaculture similar to the one for farming + adds lobster.

Hah, don't think I haven't thought about this already!

(The other stuff: thoughts noted! Definitely too late in the release cycle to want to be messing with anything like this now, though.)
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