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Author Topic: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.  (Read 1312 times)

intrinsic_parity

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2021, 12:34:03 PM »

Alex, I have noticed that the linked fire mode override by AI can be reproduced quite easily in simulation mode when sending a ship against other ones where at least one has fighter bays.
Even when just a single enemy fighter is in range and is within the weapon group's overlapping firing arc, it aims and fires linked non-PD guns individually instead of aiming and firing the entire group as intended. This causes the weapons to not only be out of loading sync when engaging ship targets (which generally are a priority), but also misaligned, which cascades into long lasting asynchrous firing during a continuous firing engagement, which ruins the intent/benefit of a burst loadout, dissolving the sole purpose of the linked fire mode setting.
Linked fire mode just means that all weapons that can fire at the selected point at the selected time will fire simultaneously. It sounds like some of your weapons did not fire because they had no target to fire at, but that is intended behavior. Linked fire mode is not intended to be a way of managing weapon cool downs. It just makes all the guns shoot at once.

I think you are vastly overestimating the complexity of the auto fire and linked fire behaviors. They are super simple rules (auto fire = always fire if something can be shot at, linked fire = fire everything that has the cursor in its arc at once). They are not systems that do anything complicated.

why is the AI disabling my autofiring setting because my piloted ship was accidentally in the group I selected to give a tactical command to? And I thought to just have given plenty clear examples why the firing mode should not be overridden by the AI. Why ignore something useful?
The AI turns auto fire on/off as its mechanism for making complicated decisions about flux levels. That is the only way it can manage weapon groups that are not the manual fire group. The AI is only allowed to manually fire one group at a time (same as the player), so in order to use more than one group at a time it manages other groups by turning auto-fire on and off. It needs to be able to toggle auto fire in order to use these groups in any way other than 'all guns always shoot'.
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #31 on: September 17, 2021, 01:13:29 PM »

Linked fire mode just means that all weapons that can fire at the selected point at the selected time will fire simultaneously. It sounds like some of your weapons did not fire because they had no target to fire at, but that is intended behavior. Linked fire mode is not intended to be a way of managing weapon cool downs. It just makes all the guns shoot at once.
I don't comprehend how you got the idea of writing this.

Of course is linked fire intended to fire simultanuously. As I have clearly explained, the AI is ignoring this even for non-PD weapons just when a single enemy fighters is nearby who is within the shared arc of the linked weapons. The consequence is that both guns are misaligned and out of reloading sync, which ruins the intent of linked fire for burst weapon ship loadouts like the mentioned Tempest with dual Phase Lances.

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I think you are vastly overestimating the complexity of the auto fire and linked fire behaviors. They are super simple rules (auto fire = always fire if something can be shot at, linked fire = fire everything that has the cursor in its arc at once). They are not systems that do anything complicated.
The only reason why you could possibly think this is because you didn't bother with reading what I have said, multiple times, all the time.

Yes, exactly, the autofire and linked mode SHOULD be very simple and clear things! The problem is that it is not because the AI is totally pointlessly overriding the mode setting, which causes several frustrating side effects that even Alex had to check about.

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The AI turns auto fire on/off as its mechanism for making complicated decisions about flux levels. That is the only way it can manage weapon groups that are not the manual fire group.
First of all, you just contradict to what you have claimed just a line before. And no, it is not about that! Manual and automatic firing both simply doesn't trigger when the firing would directly cause an overloading (perhaps with some additional threshhold). This is fine and is no excuse for the AI to override the firing mode.

If I want further flux level considerations to be made, then I should disable the group's automatic firing mode. So there is simply no reason to disable the autofiring mode that I have decided for.

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The AI is only allowed to manually fire one group at a time (same as the player), so in order to use more than one group at a time it manages other groups by turning auto-fire on and off. It needs to be able to toggle auto fire in order to use these groups in any way other than 'all guns always shoot'.
How is the convoluted concept I am complaining about an excuse for itself?!
That even I, with my high-latency synaptic connections, can handle to switch between manual firing groups and trigger them, then so can a 5 GHz OoO CPU within a microsecond. The implementation is totally pointlessly convoluted, as I have explained exhaustingly.


Guys, I think I have been very patient here about quite a trivial and clear issue and the impression I get from most is that you don't even bother to fully read what I say, perhaps just because Alex initially indicated to disagree with what I was saying or perhaps some cannot deal with the thought that this was implemented badly for all those years.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2021, 01:19:39 PM by sqrt(-1) »
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #32 on: September 17, 2021, 01:17:23 PM »

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Hiruma Kai

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #33 on: September 17, 2021, 01:18:24 PM »

Auto-fire isn't an AI setting though, it's a player-assist setting.
It's like complaining that your saw is a terrible hammer: Of course it is, it's not supposed to be a hammer.
If this was truly the case (which it of course isn't), why is the AI disabling my autofiring setting because my piloted ship was accidentally in the group I selected to give a tactical command to? And I thought to just have given plenty clear examples why the firing mode should not be overridden by the AI. Why ignore something useful?

I'm going to agree with Yunru, it's a player assist at start of combat setting.

The reason for your weapon selection/autofire state changing is as soon as you give your ship a tactical order, you are no longer piloting it, the autopilot is.  It's not your ship anymore in terms of commands, and thus acts like any other AI ship.

If you put the ship under AI control, why would you expect it to act different from any other AI controlled ship?  I personally expect it to act like an AI ship, and my guess is that would be most player's expectations.  I'll note, as soon as you do anything (like select a weapon group), it goes back to being under player control, so clearly weapon group selections and autofire status are considered important for the AI to function, and if it doesn't have full control of those, will hand everything back to the player.

So here is my stab at explaining what I see is the miscommunication.  There are two very distinct features being discussed here in regards to the autofire toggle on the loadout screen, as opposed to in combat autofire status.

1) Convenience feature for the player reducing the number of shift-number button presses at the beginning of each and every fight.

2) Fine grained AI control determining when weapons fire.

I totally agree that the autofire toggle on the loadout screen does nothing for AI ships, but on the other hand, that is not its intent.  It is purely a convenience for me, the player, to save on pointless repetitive motions.  It means I don't have to stretch my left hand awkwardly to hit shift-7 every fight to turn my point defenses on my Onslaught or Paragon.  I would object if that convenience feature was taken away by combining it with a fine grained AI control setting which has absolutely nothing to do with how I fly my flagship at the beginning of each fight. 

If such a fine grained AI control were added, it should be a different toggle, as Alex suggested, or completely new screen intended for AI control stuff, and not remove features that are currently used by, I would guess, most players for flagships.

As for autofire in combat itself, it is intended to be an in combat toggle, for both the player and AI.  Removing the option from the AI's pool of options seems like it could only hurt the general ship case, and breaks the symmetry between AI and player piloting, while perhaps helping some small parameter space of highly optimized loadouts.  The game would likely be poorer for it (or harder, as all the default loadouts for the AI would need to be tweaked to take into account this new autofire behavior, and thus be much more optimized flux wise) and the parameter space of loadouts that are viable would shrink.

I think this feature request would need to be a new feature, and not interact with the current autofire logic and settings, but be its own new thing.  It also feels like such an override of the basic AI should be hidden behind a tutorial explaining in detail what the general effects of each would have on the AI, and intended only for advanced players who understand what it's going to do to ship behavior.  And not on the standard loadout screen. 

In summary, changing logic to not touch autofire once set is likely easy for Alex.  However, I fear there would be complicated repercussions for every single ship and combat, that would not be as easy to handle.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2021, 01:28:13 PM by Hiruma Kai »
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Yunru

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #34 on: September 17, 2021, 01:26:15 PM »

Auto-fire isn't an AI setting though, it's a player-assist setting.
It's like complaining that your saw is a terrible hammer: Of course it is, it's not supposed to be a hammer.
If this was truly the case (which it of course isn't), why is the AI disabling my autofiring setting because my piloted ship was accidentally in the group I selected to give a tactical command to? And I thought to just have given plenty clear examples why the firing mode should not be overridden by the AI. Why ignore something useful?
1) Just because you want it to be something else, doesn't make it something else. No matter how much you whine that it's broken because it's not the thing you want it to be.
2) It turns off precisely because  it's not AI controls and you just enabled the AI.

Deshara

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #35 on: September 17, 2021, 01:32:01 PM »

games just arent gonna be exactly what you want them to be. you would like it if the AI respected the fire mode you set at ship build. so would I. that just wouldn't be good for the game tho. its the sort of thing that if it were to exist would need to be a mod, or a very deeply buried setting that defaults to "off" (which isnt gonna happen bc that bloats the game's QA budget unnecessarily). that just isn't the game that this is, and that's okay
« Last Edit: September 17, 2021, 01:36:17 PM by Deshara »
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I cant be blamed for what I said 5 minutes ago. I was a different person back then

intrinsic_parity

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #36 on: September 17, 2021, 01:34:24 PM »

Linked fire mode just means that all weapons that can fire at the selected point at the selected time will fire simultaneously. It sounds like some of your weapons did not fire because they had no target to fire at, but that is intended behavior. Linked fire mode is not intended to be a way of managing weapon cool downs. It just makes all the guns shoot at once.
I don't comprehend how you got the idea of writing this.

Of course is linked fire intended to fire simultanuously. As I have clearly explained, the AI is ignoring this even for non-PD weapons just when a single enemy fighters is nearby. The consequence is that both guns are misaligned and out of reloading sync, which ruins the intent of linked fire for burst weapon ship loadouts like the mentioned Tempest with dual Phase Lances.
Yes, that is how linked fire works, but your idea of 'intent' is not correct. It is a tool for the player and works decently with some weapons like missiles for the AI. Using it for weapons with different arcs will not work.

What it sounds like you want is for the AI to do cool-down management to sync weapon firing, which is much more complicated and also situational. For instance, delaying firing to sync cool downs at the wrong moment can miss a window for dealing hull/armor damage, or even miss a kill, and more generally, you lose a lot of DPS by syncing firing sometimes. Also if weapons have different cool downs, it's not obvious what the desired behavior even should be... should the AI fire the faster firing weapon less often? or should the AI fire the faster firing weapon at max ROF and only fire the slower firing weapon on every second cycle? What happens if you havethree different cool-downs? It's not something that should be handled by a simple toggle, and it's not even something with an obvious solution.

If I want further flux level considerations to be made, then I should disable the group's automatic firing mode. So there is simply no reason to disable the autofiring mode that I have decided for.
That's not how the AI works. If you could lock one group on auto fire, and all the other groups not on auto fire with the current system, the AI would only ever be able to use one of the non-autofire groups at a time, which is obviously not desirable and much less effective than what we have now. It sounds like you want non-autofire groups to still fire at 'the right' times, but that is simply not how the AI works. The only times weapons can fire are 1. when they are auto fired and 2. when they are in the single group that is manually fired. In order to do anything beyond that, you have to fundamentally rework how the AI functions.

I think maybe this is what the disconnect in all these conversations is?
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Thaago

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #37 on: September 17, 2021, 01:35:57 PM »

Auto-fire isn't an AI setting though, it's a player-assist setting.
It's like complaining that your saw is a terrible hammer: Of course it is, it's not supposed to be a hammer.
If this was truly the case (which it of course isn't), why is the AI disabling my autofiring setting because my piloted ship was accidentally in the group I selected to give a tactical command to? And I thought to just have given plenty clear examples why the firing mode should not be overridden by the AI. Why ignore something useful?

A proper anecdote would be "It's like randomly overwriting the setting of a speedometer in a car with the 'explanation' that you can manually control the accelerator."

It really is the case. It even says so in the tooltip. The AI is changing the autofire settings when you set your flagship to AI control because thats how it controls its non-manual weapons, exactly how the player does. There is nothing "random" going on at all. If you don't want the AI to take control of the weapon groups... don't set your flagship to AI control. Its annoying when it happens sure, but its not a 'wrong' behavior or a bug, its just a consequence of a misclick. The same way that hitting eburn by mistake is an annoying thing to happen, but not a bug, just user error.

Re: linked weapons getting desynchronized because a target is only in one arc: Linked weapons have two different behaviors depending on if they are in "manual" control or autofire control. In "manual" control they all fire when clicked. In autofire control they fire at targets of opportunity independently. Its always been that way and its not a bug, or the AI doing something weird: the same thing is true on the player ship. Thats just how linked works. There's no overriding or anything going on.

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... Guys, I think I have been very patient here about quite a trivial and clear issue and the impression I get from most is that you don't even bother to fully read what I say, perhaps just because Alex initially indicated to disagree with what I was saying or perhaps some cannot deal with the thought that this was implemented badly for all those years.

Its more that you have ideas about how weapon groups and settings work that are just incorrect. People keep telling you how things actually work and then you dismiss them and insist that you are correct. Like:

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Of course is linked fire intended to fire simultanuously.
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Autofire is supposed to autofire.

Neither of these things are true - the first depends on manual vs autofire control and its very much intentional because otherwise how would groups with disparate arcs work, and the second has never been true. I'm not saying that they are inherently bad ideas, but they just aren't what the terms mean in the game as it currently is.
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #38 on: September 17, 2021, 02:25:45 PM »

I'm going to second agree with Yunru, it's a player assist at start of combat setting.

The reason for your weapon selection/autofire state changing is as soon as you give your ship a tactical order, you are no longer piloting it, the autopilot is.  It's not your ship anymore in terms of commands, and thus acts like any other AI ship.

If you put the ship under AI control, why would you expect it to act different from any other AI controlled ship?  I personally expect it to act like an AI ship, and my guess is that would be most player's expectations.  I'll note, as soon as you do anything (like select a weapon group), it goes back to being under player control, so clearly weapon group selections and autofire status are considered important for the AI to function, and if it doesn't have full control of those, will hand everything back to the player.
I have responded multiple times:

  • You don't need to explain to me what the behavior is that I am complaining about.
  • You cannot excuse a bad implementation with the bad implementation itself.
  • The firing mode settings should not be overridden by the AI because the purpose and consequences of them are identical to the one for manual piloting. There is just zero reason to override them!
  • Frustrating side effects, which even Alex has to check for, like the changed autofiring mode when getting manual control back from common, unintended AI triggering (which is a clearly bad implementation too), is obviously unacceptable

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So here is my stab at explaining what I see is the miscommunication.  There are two very distinct features being discussed here in regards to the autofire toggle on the loadout screen, as opposed to in combat autofire status.

1) Convenience feature for the player reducing the number of shift-number button presses at the beginning of each and every fight.
That's a very convoluted way of describing the player's intent to define what what weapons should fire automatically, which is identical to what I want the AI to not ignore.

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2) Fine grained AI control determining when weapons fire.
No! As I have explicitely stated multiple times, it's exactly the same 'feature'! I solely want the AI to automatically fire certain weapons!
That the fundamental motivation for enabling autofiring of certain group is a an intent/reflection of prioritization, is the same for both manual piloting and AI control.

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I totally agree that the autofire toggle on the loadout screen does nothing for AI ships, but on the other hand, that is not its intent.  It is purely a convenience for me, the player, to save on pointless repetitive motions.  It means I don't have to stretch my left hand awkwardly to hit shift-7 every fight to turn my point defenses on my Onslaught or Paragon.  I would object if that convenience feature was taken away by combining it with a fine grained AI control setting which has absolutely nothing to do with how I fly my flagship at the beginning of each fight.
You don't understand the reasons of your own actions then or you are an awful pilot.

If you truly would only care about an automatic trigger, then you would put all weapons into autofire mode. Any half-decent pilot knows that a ship build, particularly those who intent to exploit speed and burst damage, can only be fully exploited by manually firing certain kinds of weapons depending on the circumstances.

As I have explained multiple times, there is ZERO reason to let the AI ruin the ability to reflect intentions with firing modes, which are generally identical between manual piloting and AI control!

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If such a fine grained AI control were added, it should be a different toggle, as Alex suggested, or completely new screen intended for AI control stuff, and not remove features that are currently used by, I would guess, most players for flagships.
Where are you even getting the idea from that I allgedly intent a more "fine grained AI control"?!

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As for autofire in combat itself, it is intended to be an in combat toggle, for both the player and AI.
As I have explained before, as someone who takes down more than tenfold larger enemy fleets by piloting vanilla ships with all kinds of loadouts, toggling autofire during combat is an edge case for lame flux battles with lame capital ships by lame pilots who cannot cope with switching between weapon groups.
Since the motivation for this (lame reactions) are no practical reason for the AI, is only emphasizing how void even this irrelevant edge point of poor pilots is.

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Removing the option from the AI's pool of options seems like it could only hurt the general ship case, and breaks the symmetry between AI and player piloting, while perhaps helping some small parameter space of highly optimized loadouts.  The game would likely be poorer for it (or harder, as all the default loadouts for the AI would need to be tweaked to take into account this new autofire behavior, and thus be much more optimized flux wise)
That's just vague assumptions without any reasoning.
If I want the AI to consider beyond avoiding directly causing an overload, I should simply disable autofiring. It's that simple and so perfectly identical with manual piloting.

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and the parameter space of loadouts that are viable would shrink.
What?! Allowing the AI to override the sole way of effectively defining the intent of a burst damage ship build is shrinking the variability of loadouts?!

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I think this feature request would need to be a new feature, and not interact with the current autofire logic and settings, but be its own new thing.  It also feels like such an override of the basic AI should be hidden behind a tutorial explaining in detail what the general effects of each would have on the AI, and intended only for advanced players who understand what it's going to do to ship behavior.  And not on the standard loadout screen. 

In summary, changing logic to not touch autofire once set is likely easy for Alex.  However, I fear there would be complicated repercussions for every single ship and combat, that would not be as easy to handle.
As explained above and in multiple replies before, the idea that what I intend requires the addition of another firing mode setting, is entirely to the contrary of what I was saying.
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #39 on: September 17, 2021, 02:36:37 PM »

1) Just because you want it to be something else, doesn't make it something else. No matter how much you whine that it's broken because it's not the thing you want it to be.
I have explained why the AI overriding is pointless, ruining the ability to enable a more proper use of certain ship builds for AI piloting and is causing several awful side effects that even Alex has to check.

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2) It turns off precisely because  it's not AI controls and you just enabled the AI.
Are you seriously pretending that it is fine that someone has his 30 minute battle ruined because of the absurd implementation that AI control is activated just because some group commands were issued and thus my autofire settings were overridden without my explicit command?!!

No one here, even Alex, even had an idea for two days what could have caused the issue and now everyone pretends as if this is dandy! RIDICULOUS!
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Yunru

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #40 on: September 17, 2021, 02:42:05 PM »

1) Just because you want it to be something else, doesn't make it something else. No matter how much you whine that it's broken because it's not the thing you want it to be.
I have explained why the AI overriding is pointless, ruining the ability to enable a more proper use of certain ship builds for AI piloting and is causing several awful side effects that even Alex has to check.
Yes, you have. Because you refuse to accept that it's not a feature for the A.

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2) It turns off precisely because  it's not AI controls and you just enabled the AI.
Are you seriously pretending that it is fine that someone has his 30 minute battle ruined because of the absurd implementation that AI control is activated just because some group commands were issued and thus my autofire settings were overridden without my explicit command?!!
No, it definitely isn't okay. You should get your situational awareness checked, it could be a serious condition.

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No one here, even Alex, even had an idea for two days what could have caused the issue and now everyone pretends as if this is dandy! RIDICULOUS!
Everyone could of told you it was because you somehow gave ship command to the AI. I know for myself personally, you were just too toxic for me to care to help.

sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2021, 02:55:34 PM »

Yes, that is how linked fire works, but your idea of 'intent' is not correct. It is a tool for the player and works decently with some weapons like missiles for the AI. Using it for weapons with different arcs will not work.
Of should weapons with opposite fire arcs not be put into the same weapon group. This has nothing to do with the subject of intent of different firing modes for different groups!

Do you have a guess why one e.g. would enable autofire for a kinetic weapon group and disable autofire for a HE weapon group?! When you have found the answer (which I am tired of repeating again and again) ask yourself why you believe that the motive for this is allegedly different for a manually and AI piloted ship!

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What it sounds like you want is for the AI to do cool-down management to sync weapon firing, which is much more complicated and also situational. For instance, delaying firing to sync cool downs at the wrong moment can miss a window for dealing hull/armor damage, or even miss a kill, and more generally, you lose a lot of DPS by syncing firing sometimes. Also if weapons have different cool downs, it's not obvious what the desired behavior even should be... should the AI fire the faster firing weapon less often? or should the AI fire the faster firing weapon at max ROF and only fire the slower firing weapon on every second cycle? What happens if you havethree different cool-downs? It's not something that should be handled by a simple toggle, and it's not even something with an obvious solution.
You clearly got lost in a total misunderstanding of what I am talking about, again.
All I simply want is that the AI does not override the linked/automatic firing mode, just because a lone fighter is wizzing in front of my ship, which ruins the entire purpose of the ship's intended role!

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That's not how the AI works. If you could lock one group on auto fire, and all the other groups not on auto fire with the current system, the AI would only ever be able to use one of the non-autofire groups at a time, which is obviously not desirable and much less effective than what we have now. It sounds like you want non-autofire groups to still fire at 'the right' times, but that is simply not how the AI works. The only times weapons can fire are 1. when they are auto fired and 2. when they are in the single group that is manually fired. In order to do anything beyond that, you have to fundamentally rework how the AI functions.

I think maybe this is what the disconnect in all these conversations is?
That you start this nonsense again of explaining how some aspects of the pointless autofiring mode override, that I entirely want to eliminate, works, right after I have just explained to you why this is absurd, only shows that you too entirely lack a genuine intent to even try to understand what I am saying.
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2021, 03:22:08 PM »

It really is the case.
Please stop this ridiculous pretentiousness! You just as Alex had no idea what could cause my initial complaint, you even sent out your admiration to Alex that he was able to figure this out.
A harder proof for making clear that this is a convoluted mess of side effects can't be made!

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It even says so in the tooltip.
WOW! Next you are going to tell me that this can be deducted from the API documentation.

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The AI is changing the autofire settings when you set your flagship to AI control because thats how it controls its non-manual weapons, exactly how the player does. There is nothing "random" going on at all.
I have responded to this multiple times and unless you or someone else respond to my arguments, I will keep calling you out for having zero intent to truly understand what I am saying.

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If you don't want the AI to take control of the weapon groups... don't set your flagship to AI control.
As I have said multiple times, I have never set my controlled ship to AI control. Obviously AI control should only be activated if I explicitely say so, not implicitely because my ship was selected when issuing a command.

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Its annoying when it happens sure, but its not a 'wrong' behavior or a bug, its just a consequence of a misclick. The same way that hitting eburn by mistake is an annoying thing to happen, but not a bug, just user error.
No, it is clearly poor design causing side effects proven by the fact that you and even Alex don't realize the causation of something so fundamental/important not immediately.

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Re: linked weapons getting desynchronized because a target is only in one arc: Linked weapons have two different behaviors depending on if they are in "manual" control or autofire control. In "manual" control they all fire when clicked. In autofire control they fire at targets of opportunity independently. Its always been that way and its not a bug, or the AI doing something weird: the same thing is true on the player ship. Thats just how linked works. There's no overriding or anything going on.
Why do you repeatedly not bother to read what I have said?
The linked mode is ignored even when a lone fighter is within the overlapping firing arc of linked weapons!
I have stated multiple arguments why this is a poor design, so why do you respond to me with the repeated made up claim that I insist that this a bug, only by finishing off with brash command  again that I should just accept it "because that's the way it has been since beginning"!?

I am disappointed, Thaggo.

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Neither of these things are true - the first depends on manual vs autofire control and its very much intentional because otherwise how would groups with disparate arcs work
Again, that non-overlapping firing arcs should be put into separate firing groups has nothing to do with the intent of different firing modes for different kind of weapons. How do you even get the idea to bring this up?

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, and the second has never been true.
That some trigger doesn't do as it name suggests, is quite the epiphany of bad design, don't you agree?
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2021, 03:29:51 PM »

Yes, you have. Because you refuse to accept that it's not a feature for the A.
I refuse to accept that the AI is pointlessly overriding the firing modes?  ;D

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Everyone could of told you it was because you somehow gave ship command to the AI. I know for myself personally, you were just too toxic for me to care to help.
Yeah, you certainly just didn't bother to share your wisdom, even with a pondering Alex, because my prosaic issue report clearly contained just unbearable toxicity. Haha!

Heck, all those noobs paying for the game should just figure out that clicking a command to go to place B will disable the autofiring of some weapon group. OF COURSE! After all, allegedly tooltip #5901 says that commands can cause AI control, and this OBVIOUSLY explains that I should expect that some autofire mode is overridden! What a fantastically sporty spirit to discuss issues and suggestions here folks!
« Last Edit: September 17, 2021, 03:38:19 PM by sqrt(-1) »
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Yunru

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Re: Autofire and Fire Mode loadout is still being randomly ignored.
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2021, 03:39:11 PM »

Yes, you have. Because you refuse to accept that it's not a feature for the A.
I refuse to accept that the AI is pointlessly overriding the firing modes?  ;D
Because you refuse to accept that you're wrong about it doing so "pointlessly".

Quote
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Everyone could of told you it was because you somehow gave ship command to the AI. I know for myself personally, you were just too toxic for me to care to help.
Yeah, you certainly just didn't bother to share your wisdom, even with a pondering Alex, because my prosaic issue report clearly contained just unbearable toxicity. Haha!

Heck, all those noobs paying for the game should just figure out that clicking a command to take go to place B will disable the autofiring of some weapon group. OF COURSE! After all, allegedly tooltip #5901 says that commands can cause AI control, and this OBVIOUSLY explains that I should expect that some autofire mode is overridden! What a fantastically sporty spirit to discuss issues and suggestions here folks!
Yeah, it's almost like they should put a big pop-up notification somewhere on the screen that the AI is now in control- Oh wait!

As for talking sporty spirit, try and go and reread your posts throughout this entire thread with a neutral disposition. Hells, you start the thread with disingenuous intent, poorly posing your unjust complaints as suggestions.

EDIT: I'm clearly getting too wound up about this. I'm going to take a step back and just report like I should have.
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