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Author Topic: Why do my ships never vent?  (Read 2762 times)

Stormy Fairweather

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Re: Why do my ships never vent?
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2021, 04:03:43 PM »

Oh, I forgot a couple of things  @Stormy_Fairweather !

1)Stacking hullmods like Hardened Shields, Solar Shielding and Resistant Flux conduits just to name three instead of investing Ordinance Points into Capacitors will mean the ship will have less maximum flux capacity, which is really going to help the AI choosing to vent!

Now, threse 3 Hullmods are worth 60 ordinance Points in total on a Capital ship and only one of them is expensive enough to warrant imtegration via spending a story point, but they really, REALLY help in massively slowing hard flux build up and making venting a lot faster overall. I would consider investing into all three of them on either cruisers and capitals that have a lot of Ordinance Points for their class, like the Aurora or the Onslaught or the Paragon/Odissey!

2)Good medium to long range point defence will give a bigger window for the AI to vent. Some incoming Pilums sitting but outside Machinegun/Vulcan range can very well jeopardize the AI's attempts to vent. It's not all that necessary on most destroyers and cruisers, but anything generally too slow to properly disengage and vent should have good enough PD to carve itself a "safe haven" in which to vent!

thanks for the tips. kinda feel that ships should just vent when they hit like 97% regardless of how many enemies are about (least if they have shields). wonder if this could me made into a mod...
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intrinsic_parity

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Re: Why do my ships never vent?
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2021, 04:20:44 PM »

thanks for the tips. kinda feel that ships should just vent when they hit like 97% regardless of how many enemies are about (least if they have shields). wonder if this could me made into a mod...
This would be a very bad strategy. When you vent, your PD goes offline and the enemy can dump all their missiles into you. You're much better off dropping shields and trying to back off, that way you can still selectively block stuff with shields and your PD stays active. Also firing at the enemy reduces how much they can shoot back, so you're usually better off dropping shields and continuing to shoot. Venting right in front of the enemy is really situational, and only good on ships with very heavy armor against ships that lack high damage weapons.
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Arcagnello

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Re: Why do my ships never vent?
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2021, 04:31:10 PM »

Oh, I forgot a couple of things  @Stormy_Fairweather !

1)Stacking hullmods like Hardened Shields, Solar Shielding and Resistant Flux conduits just to name three instead of investing Ordinance Points into Capacitors will mean the ship will have less maximum flux capacity, which is really going to help the AI choosing to vent!

Now, threse 3 Hullmods are worth 60 ordinance Points in total on a Capital ship and only one of them is expensive enough to warrant imtegration via spending a story point, but they really, REALLY help in massively slowing hard flux build up and making venting a lot faster overall. I would consider investing into all three of them on either cruisers and capitals that have a lot of Ordinance Points for their class, like the Aurora or the Onslaught or the Paragon/Odissey!

2)Good medium to long range point defence will give a bigger window for the AI to vent. Some incoming Pilums sitting but outside Machinegun/Vulcan range can very well jeopardize the AI's attempts to vent. It's not all that necessary on most destroyers and cruisers, but anything generally too slow to properly disengage and vent should have good enough PD to carve itself a "safe haven" in which to vent!

thanks for the tips. kinda feel that ships should just vent when they hit like 97% regardless of how many enemies are about (least if they have shields). wonder if this could me made into a mod...

Mods modifying AI ship behaviour are quite rare, actually. I used to love.playing with a mod called Automatic Orders that would not only for example
-make your ships automatically retreat while out of missiles
-make your ships retreat upon going under a certain CR
-make your ships retreat upon going under a certain HP treshold
And so on, it functioned by introducing a rather large selection of 0 Ordinance Points hullmods. There were even ones that overrode the ship Personality if it did not have an Officer!

And here's the mod's thread link: https://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=15128.0
The mod supposedly works in the current patch if you just update the version file, but I have not tried it myself so I can't vouch for anything working or not working.

Back on topic tough, exploiting a venting enemy is one of the few things the AI does really, really well. Introducing some sort of AI behaviour override forcing it to vent before taking down shields due to hard flux buildup would lead into quite the prevalent Reaper/Hammer/Harpoon Meta.

Having the AI dance on a razor's edge with the shield flickering when almost overloaded on high flux is one of the ways the AI is superior to 99% of players at executing.
 I could see it somewhat disappear with better situational awareness checking for nearby missiles or finisher-type weapons allowing aggressive AIs to accept taking significant but not devastating damage while venting, but that's not happening in the near future.

« Last Edit: June 01, 2021, 04:58:18 PM by Arcagnello »
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Linnis

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Re: Why do my ships never vent?
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2021, 05:10:18 PM »

Here's a few pointers for having AI controlled ships vent more often:
1)Resistant Flux Conduits not only improves EMP Resistance but also significantly improves vent speed, which facilitates the AI in choosing to vent in shorter "safe" windows
2)The more aggressive the officer personality is the most likely the ship being piloted is to vent. If you ever wonder why Remnant Ships (Especially the big chungus) choose to vent right in front of you sometimes then you can circle it back to them having the most aggressive personality in the game.
3)The more armor and remaining hullpoints the ship that may want to vent has the more the AI will consider to vent, especially if the enemies near it don't have hard hitting enough weapons.
4)The further away the ship is from any enemy or incoming ordnance and the most likely the chance an AI driving a ship high on flux will vent will be. This is one of the reasons I really like to have a combination of good mobility, point defence and medium/long range kinetic firepower on my capitals. They all favour backwards kiting and easy venting in the hands of the AI.

You are 100% right. Another factor I noticed is missiles, LRMs can be tracking a ship from offscreen blocked by a whole fleet but the target ship still will be reluctant to vent because of it.
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Kohlenstoff

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Re: Why do my ships never vent?
« Reply #19 on: July 04, 2021, 02:06:59 PM »

Quote
This would be a very bad strategy. When you vent, your PD goes offline and the enemy can dump all their missiles into you. You're much better off dropping shields and trying to back off, that way you can still selectively block stuff with shields and your PD stays active. Also firing at the enemy reduces how much they can shoot back, so you're usually better off dropping shields and continuing to shoot. Venting right in front of the enemy is really situational, and only good on ships with very heavy armor against ships that lack high damage weapons.

Not Ventin means less Firepower. Less Firepower means more Ships accumulating around. Not Venting means usually worsening the situation. It is even worth the Risk of getting Missiles into the ship. An example for this is this Battle.



Without Venting while even disregarding the presence of enemies or the low Hull and Armor i would not have the Firepower to prevent getting surrounded and overfluxed constantly until death becomes inevitable. Fortress shield would give maybe some more Time but the enemies would use this time to accumulate even more.

The best Workaround to get a ship to Vent is the direct retreat Order. Here at 6:35 a critical Situation begins to devlop. I force my Radiant back with Direct retreat and change this Order a bit later to Move. When the Situation becomes safe again i remove the Move order Ralley Point to release the Radiant again.


 
« Last Edit: July 04, 2021, 02:14:54 PM by Kohlenstoff »
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