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Starsector 0.95a is out! (03/26/21); Blog post: Of Slipstreams and Sensor Ghosts (09/24/21)

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Author Topic: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.9a Light Show  (Read 42871 times)

Mira Lendin

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7a Black Holes
« Reply #75 on: September 20, 2021, 02:28:31 AM »

edit: oh fudge, found out acquisition is tied to having Nexerelin, lol
A reliable and renewable vanilla source is advised.
That's not entirely true, in fact, nothing in this mod is dependent on Nexerelin, the weapons can be found in an abandoned research station or a weapon cache, however since Nexerelin offers a station called "Prism Freeport" that gets all the weapons in this game and sells them for a high price it automatically supports my mod without me having to do anything, i just decided to "not" block my weapons from spawning there for people who wants to get them without having to spend all their time exploring the outer regions.
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Bulldog

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #76 on: September 20, 2021, 03:03:20 AM »

I think the Gauss Cannon could do with an added "USE_VS_FRIGATES" tag.

I understand implementing just the "STRIKE" tag for ammo-limited or long-cooldown weapons that should be preserved for big targets instead of wasting it on a solitary frigate or fighter, but I think your Gauss Cannon fires fast enough and with a good enough projectile velocity that it should be able to hit frigates fairly consistently.

Compared to vanilla weapons like the hellbore that often just shoot at everything and anything even if they don't have a chance in hell of hitting.
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Omega_DarkPotato

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #77 on: September 20, 2021, 09:04:38 AM »

So let's assume, for just a second or two, that I'm some sort of raving sociopath who enjoys turning deployment costs on battles up to 10,000 while also boosting the AI and player fleet limits significantly higher

and also in this hypothetical that I've got beyond the sector installed so I can face truly "end-game" fleets for combat

I want OP weapons for this wonderful adventure and for that reason I was wondering if there was a way to enable(?) some method of acquiring blueprints for these weapons - I know that other people have argued that it'd be overpowered or boring or a "win button" if you could print these guns like any other but I'm intending on just messing around - should I look for a console commands solution or is there something in config or other files that I can mess around with for this?

Thanks.
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Mira Lendin

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #78 on: September 20, 2021, 10:31:08 AM »

So let's assume, for just a second or two, that I'm some sort of raving sociopath who enjoys turning deployment costs on battles up to 10,000 while also boosting the AI and player fleet limits significantly higher

and also in this hypothetical that I've got beyond the sector installed so I can face truly "end-game" fleets for combat

I want OP weapons for this wonderful adventure and for that reason I was wondering if there was a way to enable(?) some method of acquiring blueprints for these weapons - I know that other people have argued that it'd be overpowered or boring or a "win button" if you could print these guns like any other but I'm intending on just messing around - should I look for a console commands solution or is there something in config or other files that I can mess around with for this?

Thanks.
You can always make these weapons available by giving them the "base_bp" tag in the weapons file, with it you will be able to manufacture them in your High Tech industry, just be warned that other factions will do the same thing.
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Alex_Sans

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #79 on: September 20, 2021, 12:06:28 PM »

Man, I loved blowing up pirates, remnants and the hegemony with these big weapons. Keep up the good work!

On a side note, I'm currently modding the Sunrider into Starsector, so may I have your permission to borrow your Electromagnetic Railgun coding to have a base for the Vanguard Cannon?
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Omega_DarkPotato

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #80 on: September 20, 2021, 12:33:16 PM »

just be warned that other factions will do the same thing.

excellent


thanks again!
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Mira Lendin

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #81 on: September 20, 2021, 03:06:54 PM »

Man, I loved blowing up pirates, remnants and the hegemony with these big weapons. Keep up the good work!

On a side note, I'm currently modding the Sunrider into Starsector, so may I have your permission to borrow your Electromagnetic Railgun coding to have a base for the Vanguard Cannon?
The Electromagnetic Railgun Pierce effect is not even a code, it's a projectile attribute, i just removed the projectile collision in the proj file :D
The code spawns explosions every few frames with a very small AoE at the location of the projectile to deal damage, i know that there are better ways to make a projectile "pierce" but hi, my version works :)
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Szasz

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7a Black Holes
« Reply #82 on: September 21, 2021, 04:50:18 AM »

edit: oh fudge, found out acquisition is tied to having Nexerelin, lol
A reliable and renewable vanilla source is advised.
That's not entirely true, in fact, nothing in this mod is dependent on Nexerelin, the weapons can be found in an abandoned research station or a weapon cache, however since Nexerelin offers a station called "Prism Freeport" that gets all the weapons in this game and sells them for a high price it automatically supports my mod without me having to do anything, i just decided to "not" block my weapons from spawning there for people who wants to get them without having to spend all their time exploring the outer regions.
I am aware.
You are probably missing reliable and renewable vanilla source, which -I admit- is half correct, can also be any source introduced by your mod.
I find the issue to be the same as before and previously only saw Nexerelin as a potential solution. In my latest playthrough, that took real time weeks of exploration and surveying, all I got is a single Electromagnetic Railgun and a Phalanx Particle Accelerator. Please realize that this is crazy rare and this is my problem. Omega weapons were more common in this run and I did not do any of the hypershunts or the alpha site cache!
Since that was not much to experiment or arm a fleet with so I went ahead and added the rest of the superweapons through console and found out that the reflective shield's description is incorrect but otherwise the weapons are really cool, interesting and you really nailed their sound effects.

I'm gonna sum up the issues so far that hold back mod quality and its up to you if you are okay with them.
 - acquisition relies solely on an exhaustible resource plus it is locked behind RNG thus impacts player experience
weapons from other mods probably compete with superweapons for being dropped, indirectly rendering them more rare
repeatable bar quests is a boring solution example but can be made lore friendly with rougue TT scientists or Alpha Site references

 - WM-70 Reflective Shield can be installed on a hardpoint contrary to description but will turn out to be broken
this leaves the player with a disfuncional loadout with 30 OP wasted and a constant annoying alarm sound for the time of the next battle until said ship becomes out of service (which took about 10 minutes for me) and the module disappears afterwards! Again, acquisition issues.
 - flux/shot info is incorrect in at least some cases
probably easy to reproduce by picking either Electromagnetic Railgun or Phalanx Particle Accelerator, equip it on a frigate and lay capacitors on it till it surpasses 4500, the flux cost requirement and ascertain that it is still unable to fire
 - Electromagnetic Railgun' damage dealing mechanic is a lottery.
In my perception the first two explosion is so close to the firing ship, it's probably never gonna be utilized, last one at max range gets cut off and performs the same with -10% range and even with +10% range, the rest in between is pure luck if they don't get deflected by shields.
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Mira Lendin

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7a Black Holes
« Reply #83 on: September 21, 2021, 07:29:41 AM »

Quote
A reliable and renewable vanilla source is advised.
Quote
repeatable bar quests is a boring solution example but can be made lore friendly with rougue TT scientists or Alpha Site references
I think i misunderstood you at first, but i get what you are saying now, yes i have been thinking about an original way to get these weapons aside from RNG, like adding some exploration missions where you get to find 1-2 weapons in a deterministic manner each time (for a limited repeatability), i am not sure when i will get the time to code these into the mod.

Quote
In my latest playthrough, that took real time weeks of exploration and surveying, all I got is a single Electromagnetic Railgun and a Phalanx Particle Accelerator. Please realize that this is crazy rare and this is my problem. Omega weapons were more common in this run and I did not do any of the hypershunts or the alpha site cache!
This is a very important point, and as such i want to emphasize on something i said at the start of this mod "...a sense of satisfaction when found", the mental value of something is linked with how rare it is, the more of these you find the less "hyped" you get, originally i had no issue with people finding an average of ~5 Superweapons in a full playthrough, surely you can be lucky and find more/less, it's random and that's what makes the search for them even more interesting.

Quote
- acquisition relies solely on an exhaustible resource plus it is locked behind RNG thus impacts player experience
I'd say this is better than a non-RNG approach, allowing people to get Superweapons in a deterministic manner would break the fun especially considering their high power level and the fact that the AI would never use them against you, the challenge would be over at this point.

Quote
weapons from other mods probably compete with superweapons for being dropped, indirectly rendering them more rare
This can be fixed by tweaking the rarity values, people have mixed opinions on this but i am open to feedback on what to do, if you think they are "rarer" than they should be i can give the values a little push.

Quote
WM-70 Reflective Shield can be installed on a hardpoint contrary to description but will turn out to be broken
I am quite surprised with this, i added a code that removes the weapon if it's installed on a hardpoint at the end and a quick test in the missions tab proved that it works, are you saying it doesn't work in the camping ? honestly i didn't test it there but i would never expect something to work in the missions tab and break somewhere else, i need to confirm this.

Quote
- flux/shot info is incorrect in at least some cases
probably easy to reproduce by picking either Electromagnetic Railgun or Phalanx Particle Accelerator, equip it on a frigate and lay capacitors on it till it surpasses 4500, the flux cost requirement and ascertain that it is still unable to fire
The flux cost of the Phalanx is 4500 (Per shot) and it fires 2, that's 9000 Flux per 1 firing cycle, i tested the EM Railgun and it's exactly 4500 unless you have a modification that increases the flux cost of weapons

Quote
- Electromagnetic Railgun' damage dealing mechanic is a lottery.
In my perception the first two explosion is so close to the firing ship, it's probably never gonna be utilized, last one at max range gets cut off and performs the same with -10% range and even with +10% range, the rest in between is pure luck if they don't get deflected by shields.
It's a common misunderstanding that the Railgun damage should pierce "shields" when in reality it should only pierce the ship and hit the one behind it as well, having the damage deflected by them is normal, as for the damage on max range issue, i can fix that in the next patch :)

-Thank you so much for your feedback!

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brm

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #84 on: September 21, 2021, 06:53:40 PM »

It would be nice to have the availability to lower the drop chance at Prism Freeport a lot, or remove it. As it is, the weapons show up constantly in sets of two, and money is no real option eventually leading to easy stockpiling of the weapons.

Would be a lot more satisfying if they were just incredibly rare out in the world, or earned through an extremely difficult encounter that was hand crafted.
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Szasz

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7a Black Holes
« Reply #85 on: September 23, 2021, 09:43:14 AM »

Quote
A reliable and renewable vanilla source is advised.
Quote
repeatable bar quests is a boring solution example but can be made lore friendly with rougue TT scientists or Alpha Site references
I think i misunderstood you at first, but i get what you are saying now, yes i have been thinking about an original way to get these weapons aside from RNG, like adding some exploration missions where you get to find 1-2 weapons in a deterministic manner each time (for a limited repeatability), i am not sure when i will get the time to code these into the mod.
Sounds great!

Quote
In my latest playthrough, that took real time weeks of exploration and surveying, all I got is a single Electromagnetic Railgun and a Phalanx Particle Accelerator. Please realize that this is crazy rare and this is my problem. Omega weapons were more common in this run and I did not do any of the hypershunts or the alpha site cache!
This is a very important point, and as such i want to emphasize on something i said at the start of this mod "...a sense of satisfaction when found", the mental value of something is linked with how rare it is, the more of these you find the less "hyped" you get, originally i had no issue with people finding an average of ~5 Superweapons in a full playthrough, surely you can be lucky and find more/less, it's random and that's what makes the search for them even more interesting.
Okay, so I find them too rare and I don't like that. They are not all that good, just impactful and most of the time unpractical.

Quote
- acquisition relies solely on an exhaustible resource plus it is locked behind RNG thus impacts player experience
I'd say this is better than a non-RNG approach, allowing people to get Superweapons in a deterministic manner would break the fun especially considering their high power level and the fact that the AI would never use them against you, the challenge would be over at this point.

Quote
weapons from other mods probably compete with superweapons for being dropped, indirectly rendering them more rare
This can be fixed by tweaking the rarity values, people have mixed opinions on this but i am open to feedback on what to do, if you think they are "rarer" than they should be i can give the values a little push.
Yes, that's my feedback, I think they are too rare. Increasing commonness will obviously provide a different experience for a player who runs this mod only.

Quote
WM-70 Reflective Shield can be installed on a hardpoint contrary to description but will turn out to be broken
I am quite surprised with this, i added a code that removes the weapon if it's installed on a hardpoint at the end and a quick test in the missions tab proved that it works, are you saying it doesn't work in the camping ? honestly i didn't test it there but i would never expect something to work in the missions tab and break somewhere else, i need to confirm this.
That's exactly what I'm saying. Can be equipped, can be used in an actual combat but the weapon will not function and it completely disappears when combat ends. That means no more Reflective Shield until you find another. (And oh boy, the alarm sound is so annoying.)

Quote
- flux/shot info is incorrect in at least some cases
probably easy to reproduce by picking either Electromagnetic Railgun or Phalanx Particle Accelerator, equip it on a frigate and lay capacitors on it till it surpasses 4500, the flux cost requirement and ascertain that it is still unable to fire
The flux cost of the Phalanx is 4500 (Per shot) and it fires 2, that's 9000 Flux per 1 firing cycle, i tested the EM Railgun and it's exactly 4500 unless you have a modification that increases the flux cost of weapons
I am not aware of any modification that can increase flux/shot cost of a weapon. What's more odd is that I have elite Energy Weapon Mastery perk selected which should lower the cost. I also can't see how could Flux Regulation affect this if it works as intended. I have 4600 capacity on a frigate and can't fire those weapons on zero flux.

Quote
- Electromagnetic Railgun' damage dealing mechanic is a lottery.
In my perception the first two explosion is so close to the firing ship, it's probably never gonna be utilized, last one at max range gets cut off and performs the same with -10% range and even with +10% range, the rest in between is pure luck if they don't get deflected by shields.
It's a common misunderstanding that the Railgun damage should pierce "shields" when in reality it should only pierce the ship and hit the one behind it as well, having the damage deflected by them is normal, as for the damage on max range issue, i can fix that in the next patch :)
Yea, I get that and the description isn't wrong per se, it's just Starsector's weird shield mechanic.

-Thank you so much for your feedback!
Thanks for your concern. So far a few modders didn't respect much more sophisticated criticism, so this was a pleasant surprise, I love your attitude!
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Nick XR

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #86 on: September 23, 2021, 10:14:09 AM »

It would be nice to have the availability to lower the drop chance at Prism Freeport a lot, or remove it. As it is, the weapons show up constantly in sets of two, and money is no real option eventually leading to easy stockpiling of the weapons.

Would be a lot more satisfying if they were just incredibly rare out in the world, or earned through an extremely difficult encounter that was hand crafted.

Agreed money isn't really a gating factor outside the early game on anything below 5M-10M credits.  And in the early part of the game where credits would keep you from buying it, it's still more sensible to buy better ships than to splurge on just a single weapon. So the only part of the game where these weapons are the only meaningful improvement remaining is the end game and they should be priced as such.

Mira Lendin

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #87 on: September 23, 2021, 11:43:25 AM »

I was told that a bootleg Vayra's sector is out, i might add some side missions for a (chance) of getting some of these weapons, then blacklist them from Prism altogether, maybe increase their drop rate in the process.
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brm

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #88 on: September 23, 2021, 12:44:16 PM »

I was told that a bootleg Vayra's sector is out, i might add some side missions for a (chance) of getting some of these weapons, then blacklist them from Prism altogether, maybe increase their drop rate in the process.

Definitely a good idea. Might be worth building some fleets that would be an absolute, omega level fight difficulty+ for some weapons, headache in order to beat.

I will say that the Chronos from the Ship/Weapon Pack is a pretty good cruiser, until it has an officer with system expertise and a supercharged fusion beam... at which point it becomes very, very frightening. I like the idea of fighting some fleet that had one of those with a bunch of backup :p
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Alex_Sans

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Re: [0.95a] Superweapons Arsenal v1.7b Black Holes
« Reply #89 on: September 23, 2021, 06:41:10 PM »

1 - Well, it works, thanks for letting me have it  :)
Spoiler
[close]

2 - Is Photon Lens developed by dota 2 alchemist? I had just realized it got Unstable Concoction SE haha
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