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Author Topic: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.2]  (Read 14028 times)

SenSayed

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Re: [0.95a-RC15] Trophy s-mods [0.4.2]
« Reply #45 on: July 26, 2021, 04:59:43 AM »

Also second idea is to make able make s-mods with credits. For example, lets say that there is base cost of ship, ordnance points it costs and multiplier to cost of s-mod. So it be like restoring hull for hefty amounts of credits but s-modding instead. I think if it ever come to existing version then it'll be able to collect some playtesting. Idea here is that s-mod made with story points is completely free and that's analogy of bar event with delivery contract (you can earn more if you spend story point and get additional xp). so lets say that paragon costs around 1mil. then 1mil devided by multiplier and magically it becomes base cost of s-mod (lets say that it will be 200k). and then ordanance points multiplied by nubmer which determined by size of hull. lets say that for capitals it would be 5k for each ordnance points of hull s-modding. So s-modding hardened shield on paragon would be 200k + 35*5k= 375k per s-modding. Also good idea to make special modifications get discounts on base cost, so denominator will be higher
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Yunru

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Re: [0.95a-RC15] Trophy s-mods [0.4.2]
« Reply #46 on: July 26, 2021, 07:56:24 AM »

Okaaay...
but why?

What you're suggesting (at least, the second idea) is massively outside of the scope of this mod, and the previous suggestion just reads like something that's already been covered.

SenSayed

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Re: [0.95a-RC15] Trophy s-mods [0.4.2]
« Reply #47 on: July 26, 2021, 10:06:19 AM »

Yes, but also no. My point of view is to be quality-dependent rather "two d-mods and one s-mod" or "DP dependable quality of fleet". I already tweaked config file and pretty happy with results. It is suggestion about revamping mechanism of s-mods. Revamped s-mods comes from story points and it would be cool to see it revamped almost entirely s-mods mechanics as whole new system. And for me, story points is thing that add something optional. But with this mod i'd locked into s-modding everything, so i could keep equality between fleets. As s-mods come from story points it logically (personal to me) that mercs and other militaries would buy them rather than do magic
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michail

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Re: [0.95a-RC15] Trophy s-mods [0.4.2]
« Reply #48 on: July 26, 2021, 10:51:52 AM »

Hello! Very great mod. I have a good idea to mod. Lets say that market N has 145% quality and opposite market, the M, has 50% quality. Then s-mod calclulator will determine how often s-mod will occur based on quality. So, for 145% it would be (145-100)/2= 22% of additional s-mod. And for market M, whic has less than 100, it would be (100-50)/2=25% less s-mods based on quality. Then "quality doctrine" would play equal role to "officer doctrine". It makes sense as Tach fleets maxed out quality have to be "better but smaller in quantity" than luddite fleets, which is "many d-modded shuttles", is literally d-modded trashcans

The mod does take ship quality into account. It's not dramatic: a 100DP 5-d-mods-per-ship fleet would only get on average 3 s-mods fewer than a pristine one (6-ish vs 9).

Markets with shipmaking industry benefits all planets equally, including planet itself. Other things that could manipulate quality is instability or/and destroyed heavy industry and orbital works. As in-game lore  "low-tier" material equiped into export and small patrols (if player started colony without heavy industry, there will debuff to quality -25% and called crossfactions imports). As i think, s-mod should be the quality measure other than "simply s-mod all you can". My point of view is that officered ships has to be more s-modded than others so you can accumulate large s-mods on important ships quickly (hegemony's officered ships would be great case because of "officer quality doctrine"). And Tach fleet that lack officer skills and nubmer of ships has to overcome officered hegemony onslaught to make "superquality" ships (as it seems like quality over quantity).
Also, lets say that over all "pool" of s-mods per imaginary detachment is 15. there is detachments with 15 s-mods: hegemony and tach, luddite (which about we will talk later). So hegemony has level 7 with quantity of 5 officers and they sit in onslaughts and legions. So 5 ships will get around 2 s-mods while unofficered ships will not get their s-mod or get a little (idea here is to make most combat-capable ships most efficient). Then goes Tach with 3 officers and 4 level averege. Then, logically, dooms and paragons would get around 3 and others ships in fleet would distribute around 1-2 s-mod per ship (excluding civilian ships)(idea here is to make all ships best of the best)(edited: yes, there will be little more than 15 s-mods as there would be much larger quality with pristine nanoforge). And there is luddite which is inconsistent as their d-mods in averege is two. So s-mods would actually be not 15 but 12, because 2 of 5 possible d-mods in fleet already (or 40% less quality than 100% and then 20% less s-mods)(idea here is to NOT compensate d-mods with equally s-mods so nanoforges will play a giant role. for instance pristine nanoforges will have proper implementations as quality over 100% will matter). Also you will be able to change ratio of s-mods/quality in config files and vanilla settings would be like now.

I fear there is some failure in communication here, quite likely caused by a vague wording in the OP. It already works like this, even if not necessarily with the same numbers. Lower quality fleets have a smaller s-mod pool, officered ships receive a bigger share of it.

Also second idea is to make able make s-mods with credits. For example, lets say that there is base cost of ship, ordnance points it costs and multiplier to cost of s-mod. So it be like restoring hull for hefty amounts of credits but s-modding instead. I think if it ever come to existing version then it'll be able to collect some playtesting. Idea here is that s-mod made with story points is completely free and that's analogy of bar event with delivery contract (you can earn more if you spend story point and get additional xp). so lets say that paragon costs around 1mil. then 1mil devided by multiplier and magically it becomes base cost of s-mod (lets say that it will be 200k). and then ordanance points multiplied by nubmer which determined by size of hull. lets say that for capitals it would be 5k for each ordnance points of hull s-modding. So s-modding hardened shield on paragon would be 200k + 35*5k= 375k per s-modding. Also good idea to make special modifications get discounts on base cost, so denominator will be higher

Hard "no" on just buying s-mods. Money means little mid-game and nothing late-game. S-modding is a big source of power, so big that vanilla has to put it into a very rigid box of s-mods costing story-points, having very low limit and straight up forbidding s-modding some. As it is now, the mod has a lot more leeway with it, because the player no longer has any choice in selecting what gets s-modded beyond "take it or leave it". The mod happened because I wanted to do two main things: make losing s-modded ships suck less and make combat more appealing. While letting the player to buy s-mods would solve the first problem brilliantly, it would fail completely at the second.

I'm not averse to adding a "mad scientist offers you to modify one of your ships" bar encounter, though. Could be fun, especially if said scientist didn't have quite the same idea what makes a good combat ship as a space captain, hehe...

Yes, but also no. My point of view is to be quality-dependent rather "two d-mods and one s-mod" or "DP dependable quality of fleet". I already tweaked config file and pretty happy with results. It is suggestion about revamping mechanism of s-mods. Revamped s-mods comes from story points and it would be cool to see it revamped almost entirely s-mods mechanics as whole new system. And for me, story points is thing that add something optional. But with this mod i'd locked into s-modding everything, so i could keep equality between fleets. As s-mods come from story points it logically (personal to me) that mercs and other militaries would buy them rather than do magic

I am confused. The mod disables s-modding by spending story-points unless you get "Special Modifications". You can't be locked into s-modding everything if you can't s-mod anything.
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michail

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Re: [0.95a-RC15] Trophy s-mods [0.5.0]
« Reply #49 on: September 26, 2021, 06:37:00 AM »

0.5.0 is out. Had to rush this out somewhat - there's still things I want to do, but Automated Commands has rolled out a release, and the old logic preventing AC hullmods from s-modding was brittle and would not handle the new hullmods.

The release mostly changes internals and how configuration files work, not much in terms of new features.

Hullmod tags and categories (which are exactly the same thing, but are defined externally by the mod) can now influence hullmod weights when selecting hullmods to s-mod. There are two sides to this. The first is global settings in the root of "randomized_picks.json" ("tag_affinities" and "category_affinities"), which apply to all hullmods that have a corresponding tag/category. The second is per-hullmod settings under keys "categories" and "tags" in the "affinities" map, which examine the tags and categories of other hullmods on the ship and modify the weight if those match.

The mod can now merge several JSON files into its main config using about the same rules Starsector goes by when merging mod JSONs. Files providing compatibility with other mods now reside in "data/config/trophysmods/compat". Please note that the list of files to merge is hard-coded, dropping an extra file there will not work.
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michail

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.6.0]
« Reply #50 on: January 14, 2022, 03:18:32 PM »

0.6.0 is out. This is the final release for the foreseeable future (I will be fixing any crashes, though). I kind of run out of steam somewhere in the early autumn, but hate to just let the stuff I'd already finished by that point to go to waste.

There's compatibility with 0.95.1a-RC6, documentation of configuration files, a somewhat fine-grained ability to configure how much s-mod pool a hullmod is worth, and a nicer relationship between pool share and expected number of s-mods (see the plot below).

Spoiler
This plot assumes 5 s-mods max, 0.21 s-mod pool per DP, and that the ship is the entire fleet, so its pool share is exactly DP * 0.21. An interesting thing about this is that none of the probabilities are ever zero (well, except at 0 DP). You can crank the max to 10 or 20 and it won't become a godmod playthrough automatically, only with a 0.1% probability. The old function was less smooth and with a hard cutoff.

[close]
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AppleMarineXX

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.6.0]
« Reply #51 on: January 16, 2022, 05:18:03 PM »

Thanks for updating this, I was waiting for it to be save compatible before started a new run. I love the concept behind it, it really makes every ship I scavenge on my bounty runs a little more special!

michail

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.0]
« Reply #52 on: April 14, 2022, 10:47:21 AM »

0.7.0 is out.

The hullmods added in 0.95.1a now have properly configured weights. Fixed partially destroyed fleets rerolling their s-mods after the battle.
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ModdedLaharl

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.0]
« Reply #53 on: June 03, 2022, 03:33:48 PM »

Got a crash with  Apex Design Collective.

java.lang.NullPointerException
   at com.fs.starfarer.settings.B.setCenter(Unknown Source)
   at data.hullmods.ApexSpectrumFuel.applyEffectsAfterShipCreation(ApexSpectrumFuel.java:73)
   at com.fs.starfarer.loading.specs._.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.title.Object.M.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.title.Object.M.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.coreui.Oo0o.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.OoO0.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.Q.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.v.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.Q.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.v.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.impl.StandardTooltipV2.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.Q.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.v.renderImpl(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.Q.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.CampaignState.render(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.BaseGameState.traverse(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.state.AppDriver.begin(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.combat.CombatMain.main(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.<init>(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.<init>(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher.main(Unknown Source)

Also happens with Apex' cargo variation. This keeps happening despite me setting the weight of the hullmod to -1000 in the config, regardless what kind of ID I used to identify the hullmod.
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michail

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.0]
« Reply #54 on: June 03, 2022, 05:05:15 PM »

Hm. Really not sure why those two hullmods cause the crash when s-modded (specifically by my mod, I've checked and normal s-modding works fine). For now, disabling them in config (ids are "apex_spectrum_cargo" and "apex_spectrum_fuel") should help, provided none were already s-modded - the mod checks weights only once per ship and sticks with the chosen hullmods. These leftovers are probably causing the crash you get after config edits. Can't suggest anything short of editing the save file to remove or un-s-mod them, unfortunately.

I'll debug this later this weekend, or at least will try to.
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michail

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.1]
« Reply #55 on: June 12, 2022, 09:17:04 AM »

0.7.1 is out.

It fixes the crash (unless 0.7.0 has already screwed your save), but I couldn't find a decent way to do it and simply banned about half of Apex Design's hullmods from being s-modded. As far as I can tell, not all of them would cause a crash, but who wants to see "HULLMOD CONFLICT" in hullmod lists?

On the flipside, the other half of the ADC hullmods got a somewhat reasonable weight config.
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BreenBB

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.1]
« Reply #56 on: June 20, 2022, 03:47:00 AM »

Hello, interesting how your mod chooses hullmods to build in? Its causes incompatibility with one my own minimod which people tested, its have one hullmod, which should not be built in at all and be player-only, its have no_built_in tag, and your mod seems to cause crashes when its adds my hullmod to NPC fleets.
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Dwarden

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.1]
« Reply #57 on: June 20, 2022, 08:09:28 AM »

as i was the one reporting that crash, here is how i solved (manually)

to blacklist `cswp_remnants_derelict_bps` in the trophysmod based on

Quote
> **Note**: the weight must be positive for a hullmod to be s-modded, you can use this to blacklist certain hullmods if you wish.
with file `trophysmods\data\config\trophysmods\compat\cswp_remnants_derelict_bps.json`
containing
Code
{
  "tag-affinities" : {
    "cswp_assume_direct_control" : {
      "base" : -1000
    }
  }
}

posting this just in case someone else runs into same problems but of course i would prefer some more universal compatibility for hullmods and mods utilizing them
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michail

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.1]
« Reply #58 on: June 20, 2022, 08:42:29 AM »

Hello, interesting how your mod chooses hullmods to build in? Its causes incompatibility with one my own minimod which people tested, its have one hullmod, which should not be built in at all and be player-only, its have no_built_in tag, and your mod seems to cause crashes when its adds my hullmod to NPC fleets.

The candidates are all hullmods known to the faction + "common-pool" from the config file, which have a positive weight. The problem is, it doesn't honor "no_build_in", which is definitely a bug/oversight on my part.

as i was the one reporting that crash, here is how i solved (manually)

to blacklist `cswp_remnants_derelict_bps` in the trophysmod based on

Quote
> **Note**: the weight must be positive for a hullmod to be s-modded, you can use this to blacklist certain hullmods if you wish.
with file `trophysmods\data\config\trophysmods\compat\cswp_remnants_derelict_bps.json`
containing
Code
{
  "tag-affinities" : {
    "cswp_assume_direct_control" : {
      "base" : -1000
    }
  }
}

posting this just in case someone else runs into same problems but of course i would prefer some more universal compatibility for hullmods and mods utilizing them

Are you sure this helped?. "compat" is not really scanned for all files in it (I'm reasonably sure Starsector disallows this, but I can be wrong), the list of files to merge is hardcoded and doesn't include this one. I need to make it clearer in the OP.

If you don't mind, could you check if this version fixes the problem? It honors "no_build_in" (with the exception of SO, because it's just too cool). If it works out I'll roll out a bugfix release. I've tested it with SO (before giving it an exception), but it doesn't hurt to check the original problem as well.
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Dwarden

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Re: [0.95.1a-RC6] Trophy s-mods [0.7.1]
« Reply #59 on: June 20, 2022, 09:04:15 AM »

i'm confused ... i used exactly steps you had in your readme.txt  :o
yet to get the crash again ... so ... puzzled

but ye i get it, it's in the compiled jar ...  so it must be either recompiled or added to existing json
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 09:08:22 AM by Dwarden »
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