What would be the difference between an interruptible burn drive and plasma burn?
Not to be facetious, but interruptible burn drive is interruptible, where plasma burn isn't
I think what you're saying, maybe, is that plasma burn is short enough duration that it allows for a safer advance? But the extra ... 300 or so? however many units it commits you to going matter quite a bit here. And you can keep shields on. And it's faster. And it has charges. Etc. They're just... quite different.
Would a discharged terminator be effected by strike commander or missile specialization?
It'd pick up target leading - for shooting its weapons - from Strike Commander. But the missile HP bonuses wouldn't apply in either case since it's just using the drone.
Well there goes my idea for a ship pack lol, I had the same idea of swapping out shields on a low tech ship for dampening field and maybe having it regen a little bit of armor so you could be more aggressive on low tech
Really excited about the changes, the new tempest nuke system seems really fun, mixing it with an atlas mkII could make for some crazy firepower
The new low-tech ships look great, and the change to burn drive is, in my opinion, the best of all the suggestions it has gotten.
Thank you!
But did the tempest really need a nerf? I don't think it was overperforming that hard. Thanks to its small shield it was really hard to use in mid-late fights. Sure, it smashes early pirates and pathers, but what doesn't? Most people were already choosing to use the scarab over the tempest, since it has a proper shield, and because small energy slots in general are better than in earlier versions. edit: and why is the Omen left untouched?
I think so. Honestly, I don't think it's even particularly close, as far as being stronger than it really ought to be. The Scarab is a separate point - it could well be too strong, as well. I *think*, if I remember right, that when it lost two weapon slots (the useless ones) it did not get a corresponding ordnance point reduction by 10. That may well be a significant part of it being over-tuned now.
The Omen seems mostly fine, though it could maybe use a slight DP increase. It's a good (great, really) frigate, but with its lacking main armaments, it's still mostly a support one.
On another note, are there any plans to change or rebalance the skill system any further, or is it in a finished state now?
Yeah, very much so; there are some significant changes coming.
As always i really like the approach that's being taken to solve these issues.
The new frigate looks fun and opens some really interesting design space, and of course i'm really excited to see how the burn drive changes work out (Especially in AI hands).
In general though i'm just excited for "moar ships" in vanilla. God knows we've got a ton of great mods to expand the roster, but i'm happy to see some of the niche's being filled in more and more without it. Really helps keep the flavor right in the base game, and hopefully moves away from "high tech best tech" mentality that it can leave you with.
Thank you, glad you're into the new stuff! And, yeah, I really hope so too, as far as low tech seeing a bit more use.
What happens if I try to put Makeshift Shield Generator on the Vanguard? Does it just not allow the hullmod to be added?
You can't put it on, same as with phase ships. (Which, now that I check, actually says that the ship already has shields, let me fix that up...)
"Ship coming in with Full Burn" means "big, predictable target wide open to Reapers/Doom Mines". So yes, that is, in fact, a consolation 
.
Actually wait, that's cancellable now. Might have to be more worried in the future 
.
Yeah, I was going to say, it can be cancelled! And the AI will do it in a case like this.
Bonus: Termination Sequence
Does the AI know how to use this new system? I can already see my officers spamming missile drones against a SO Hound that they're never going to hit and never needed to hit with that kind of ordinance, or spamming the 1K flux option in front of multiple Sabots or something.
The AI is aware of many factors - the fighter replacement rate, how vulnerable the target is, whether there's a current missile threat, etc. Still testing it out a bit, but so far it seems fine.
Beyond that I'm curious to see how the modified Tempest handles, and whether it'll still manage to justify it's 8DP cost. People said it "overperformed" a fair bit, but I don't recall as many people saying it "overperformed for an 8DP frigate"...
I don't think it's even all that close as far as whether it's over-performing or not! The damage it can deal with HEF is, to be frank, kind of bonkers.
Will the existing non-toggle Burn Drive AI be available?
Yeah! In fact to use the new AI you'd have to specify BURN_DRIVE_TOGGLE in the .system file. The original BURN_DRIVE AI is still used by Plasma Burn and remains intact.
Stealing another name from DR (first Revenant, then Vanguard) is just rude.
Apologies
The "cool ship name" space is, sadly, somewhat crowded. Best I can do is not *intentionally* grab a mod ship's name. (Which isn't the same as not doing it *knowingly*, though in this case I didn't actually know. If I ever add, like, a Karkinos, though, there'd be some cause for consternation. Even if it's just Greek for "crab".)
Eradicator, which has Accellerated Ammo Feeder
I can taste the Safety Overrides, Heavy Machinegun and Harpoon/Reaper/Annihalator spam already. It's going to be glorious.
... there may be an Overdriven pirate version that does something very very similar.
Do you have Luddic Path versions of either of these ships planned by the way? The faction could really benefit from some more good ships 
Hmm, not specifically. Though it might be a good fit indeed, especially for the Eradicator.
About the Tempest
It's very pleasing to see the amount of effort being devoted to reining high tech back a tad. Looking forward to the tempest and the other High tech frigate changes!
(Just to try to rein in the expectations a bit, this isn't how I'd *usually* go about nerfing something! The scythe of balance is indeed mercurial, but usually much more straightforward.)
Mmm. Just saying that the Eradicator could make a good choice to add a 14th Battlegroup variation. It's pretty close to being in line with the Kantai Kessen decisive battle doctrine that the 14th practiced. Eagle and Falcon XIV variants don't really feel like they fit in the 14th Battlegroup's overall.
Hmm - it's actually not even a Hegemony ship at this point. We'll see, though, we'll see. For some reason the Eradicator just doesn't feel quite right for the Hegemony, for me. Maybe I'll change my mind at some point
All these changes/additions are really exciting! The Eradicator especially looks lovely. Guessing the dissipation will be around 300-350? That'll be a lot of fun with 3 AAF-boosted medium ballistics.
It's at 400! I think I tend to overtune new things a bit sometimes (which, I mean, can be good to help them see more use); we'll see if it needs some reining in.
High Tech dragged down because the whole "Low Tech" philosophy is just faulty by design and therefore unable to compete, though.
Hmm, hard disagree on this. There are *so many* balance knobs to turn that I don't think "unable to compete" holds up to scrutiny.
That said I'm not sure what to make of the Tempest change. It definitely feels like a nerf
It's definitely a nerf, yes. But it's situationally useful, and in ways that the HEF couldn't do, so it's more of a... sideways nerf.
Alex, what are these Terminator missile things classified as, in terms of skills and hullmods? "Fighters turning into missiles that deal energy damage" is...not clearly accounted for in the skill tree 
. Does Strike Commander's +20% damage to Destroyer+ targets apply to them? That would be lovely, especially as I wouldn't have any reason to pick that skill otherwise...
They're affected by missile damage and speed/range/guidance modifiers. And also by ship system range modifiers. They're *not* affected by missile hitpoints modifiers.
This AI issue affects most low-tech ships and is one of the factors weakening them severely right now outside of player hands. Low-tech ships overusing their shields like high-tech ships (while ignoring that they have good armour) until they overload or can't use weapons.
The Vanguard looks interesting as a "big fleet" low-tech frigate but hopefully other low-techs ships won't be ignored regarding the above-mentioned problem.
I understand what you're saying, but it's kind of two separate things. In the case of the shield-Vanguard, taking damage from larger ships on shields and backing off is generally the right choice; otherwise it would just get destroyed quickly!
There's *also* the fact that it's impossible for the AI to armor-tank as effectively as the player can. I mean, it does it to some extent, and because of this there's occasional feedback to the effect of it taking unnecessary damage. It's just a tough problem to solve. Doesn't mean there won't be some incremental improvements about it here and there, but it's in a fairly workable place already.
Eradicator looks nice too, like a low-tech Fury. I like that they both have turrets. It always felt like hardpoint guns would be a midline thing (efficient, focused firepower, with the agility needed to make use of it) while low-tech would have turrets to compensate for low agility and to engage multiple opponents. With that in mind, the main low-tech frigate and cruiser (Lasher, Dominator) both being hardpoint gun ships felt strange.
Ah - I think you're picking up on something that isn't there, design-intent wise. So, I mean - I understand why it might feel strange given the "midline = hardpoints" assumption, but that's not at all a pillar of their design.
PS: The blog post mentions big engines on the Eradicator but the engines on the sprite and the engine glow FX look kinda small.
The Eradicator's engine flames look about the same as those of a Dominator *at full burn*, so I'm not sure I see that.
Looks pretty nice.
Eradicator look great and Vanguard is interesting even if plain looking. Idea of having Damper field instead of shields is pretty neat.
Mixed on tempest changes but they were really strong before so hope its for the better.
Thank you! And, I hope so too.
Anything about skill changes?
Hope for some buffs here and there and for some nerfs(especially to Derelict Contingent - hope it go away completely and phase ships).
Nothing I'm ready to talk about quite yet
(Well, aside from Derelict Contingent, that's going away in its current form.)
Hey, new blogpost! A little bit of premature theorycrafting wouldn't hurt to accompany this. The burn drive cancel was removed years ago but is now back, and without the need to vent now! That's a pretty huge buff to all burn drive ships. Moving that Onslaught precisely where it needs to be without accidentally ramming its target is a huge deal. Will it be enough to revive the Onslaught vs Paragon threads of old?
Oh yes, the Paragon. *pats nerf bat* I think replacing its ship system with a flare launcher - not active, mind, just the regular kind - would be an interesting sidegrade as well.
Vanguard seems like a top low-tech pick for frigates, for early and possibly mid game. Late game however? Eh... Maybe as combat objective capping cannon fodder. It seems to be similarly armed to the Lasher, although with AAF, so not as bursty. Unlike the Lasher however, stopping a charging Vanguard is going to be hard as hell. No shield to overload, and very resilient to EMP thanks to damper field. I just hope the pirates or pathers won't field many of those loaded with harpoons/sabots combos.
For late-game, my hope is that it can occupy a similar niche to the Centurion/Monitor. More aggressive and more likely to be lost, but also easily recoverable. And, at the same time, also better at capping points. I'm not sure how many would be worth putting officers into, but with Damper Field, I suspect a bunch of these - with d-mods, whatever - could make a very effective first wave and stick around to absorb a lot of fire. But yeah, that's just theorycrafting, we'll have to see! And I'm excited to.
And the Tempest... Well. I'm not sure about that one. On one hand it did lost HEF. On the other hand, it gained a tachyon lance torpedo. Alright, not quite tachyon lance, but still beefy as hell. I feel this won't change much for most early/mid game combat scenarios. But can you imagine a pack of those for a late game fleet? Handling one or two kamikaze drones is manageable, but dealing with a ceaseless swarm from an entire Tempest fleet seems... Impossible. I guess it'll all depends on the system's cooldown, the drone's range, or its maneuverability if it's affected. But from what i'm seeing, it seems like a moderate early game nerf/side grade and a terrifying late game buff for the Tempest, or at least, for a pack of Tempests.
What is the range of the Tempest's drone-missiles? You didn't say in the blogpost, and it should probably say so in the system description.
The missile range is currently 1500, so, less than a Harpoon. The system indicator tells you when it's out of range so you can easily see the range on it in combat. The system doesn't have a meaningful cooldown - rather, it's limited by the availability of drones! Which, at a baseline, 20 seconds to replace one, and considerably more once the replacement rate starts ticking down - which it will as soon as even one is fired. A pack of Tempests might be able to overwhelm a couple of ships with drones, but in an endurance fight, their effectiveness should drop off real quick.
So I was basically almost spot on with my guesses, an elite low tech frigate plus a smaller than heavy cruiser with AAF system, I was just wrong on the cruiser mounts. Really looks like a low tech Fury and I like it. But come on where are the most important details, what are the DPs chief? I assume it's 7-8 DP for the baby bowling ball and 20 for the Eradicator.
Spot on for the Eradicator! The (P) version is 15; possibly under-costed there.
The Vanguard, I really wanted to make it 8, but I'm not sure it holds up as good value at that point. So right now it's 6, but I'm not 100% set on whether it'll stay there.
EDIT: Thank god I'm going to fight something other than Ventures in pirate fleets, this might actually be the biggest thing for me in the whole blog post.
That's ... actually fair
If you are still looking at those, I’d like to point a minor underperforming issue with Hyperion. A skill-less non-SO AI Hyperion will hardly ever use its ship system for reasons I don’t fully understand. It seems to be a mix of: 0-flux bonus condition, shield staying raised in threatening situations, AI flux management behaviours (re-engage enemy before passive venting gets flux to 0, does not use active venting). Having omni shield conversion seems to improve things a bit because AI is a bit more confident and then lowers its shield more often, and, uhhh, shield shunt is even “better” (no I’m not suggesting to remove shield from Hyperion!).
Oh you're not? <disappointedly moves hand from delete key>
I'll keep this in mind, but, right, it does require the zero-flux-boost to use, so that all sounds about right. I'm not sure I can see making shield-lowering more aggressive just for this case. The re-engage before flux is low enough thing, though... maybe I'll be able to have a look at that at some point. I've noticed it myself (for all ships, more or less); I think it's that they're seeing the flux become favorable to them and want to move in before that changes, so - again, tricky situation. It's often the visibly wrong move to not let it get to zero, though.
Another point worth noting: I’ve increased the range of the Light Autocannons and the Light Assault Gun – small ballistic weapons that the Vanguard can mount.
How much extra range? The main point of Railgun and Light Needler is more range, and if the 4 to 5 DP weapons will have (nearly) as much range as the elite weapons, then Railgun and Needler may cost too much for what they do.
The LAC & LAG range buffs are curious. IMO they risk crowding out the premium small ballistics in terms of role, as well as potential balancing connotations associated with having inexpensive, small, and relatively long-range guns. If they're considered underperforming it may be best to approach other avenues of enhancements, such as flux efficiency or damage.
They have 700 range, same as the Railgun and the Light Needler. I don't think these are in too much danger of being too expensive; they have other features that make them great. And, more importantly, the Light Dual AC has abysmal accuracy, so whatever its paper stats are, they have to be taken with a grain of salt. Not to say they'd never compete with them, just, hopefully, there'd be cases where the extra cost is and isn't worth it. (The LAG, being HE, doesn't directly compete with either premium option...)
I'm eager to try the range-buffed ACs and LAG. The current low base range makes them difficult to use for AI frigates and destroyers, and on larger ships they don't benefit enough from % increases from DTC/ITU to justify mounting alongside other weapons.
*thumbs up* I've been playing around with them a bit - on the Eradicator in particular - and it's just really fun to have lots of dakka from smaller guns. I hope this holds up balance-wise in terms of being a reasonable loadout choice more often.
Never before I thought I would be EXCITED to see something I love being nerfed. The tempest solution is promising! I don't know if it will make the ship less powerful or not, but it does FEEL good to use this system. This change literally made the game more interesting to me, and I think changes like this are rarely made in videogames, they rather "fine tune" a boring statistic than making a interesting change.
(I mean, if we're being honest, I'd rather fine-tune a more boring statistic, too! Just, in this case, nothing seemed particularly promising, and then the idea kind of took on a life of its own.)
That the Eradicator (P) is getting a DP discount compared to the base model is quite interesting and also somewhat unusual, given that the other pirate direct downgrades (Wolf (P)'s loss of OP & side turrets & degraded skimmer, Afflictor (P)'s loss of OP and side hardpoints, etc) do not benefit from that. Presumably this isn't implemented via .skin as those lack the ability to change DP costs. Is the Eradicator (P) kind of an outlier in that regard or is this part of a new, upcoming trend for Pirate downgrade variants?
It's now possible to do via skins, actually! And, great point re: the Wolf (P) and Afflictor (P); made a note. Thank you for mentioning it!
A shieldless superfrigate is conceptually interesting, to say the least. I've never had real issues dispatching shieldless ships thanks to various available EMP and anti-armor options available, bug I guess I'll have to see how it works out ingame.
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see; definitely not claiming to have this all on lockdown. I will say that the Vanguard also has a pretty decent OP budget, and the base loadouts are geared towards countering EMP damage. Notably, the Damper Field effect also affects EMP damage. So when, say, facing an Omen in a 1-1 - I mean, it'll lose eventually, it's dealing with something that's almost a hard counter on paper! And weapons do go offline some. But it's able to put fire on it, and the engines generally speaking stay up for the vast majority of the fight, if not the whole thing.
I don't agree that current Tempest overperforms for its light cruiser grade Deployment Cost, but I'll just leave it as that for now.
(You mean light destroyer, yes?)
Overall, most excited for the introduction of the Eradicator and Eradicator (P)!
*thumbs up*
