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Starsector 0.95.1a is out! (12/10/21); Blog post: The Pilgrim's Path (07/19/22)

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Author Topic: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.9.5  (Read 119929 times)

Helldiver

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Re: [0.95.1a] [Hullmod] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #150 on: February 04, 2022, 03:40:35 AM »

Fighter auto landing has been implemented!
Fighter on regroup and low enough health now lands like a bomber and relaunch at full health.

Frigging amazing.
Another thing in vanilla that makes no sense fixed by a mod. You're a lifesaver. Even more amazing that fighters will judge to land based on enemies being nearby or not and damage.
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Mr_8000

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #151 on: February 04, 2022, 04:48:26 PM »

I feel like the recent swarm core changes don't make sense. What's my incentive for using OP to add 2 decks (and nerf them all) when the ship's DP also increases? Putting another carrier into battle would add the same decks, un-nerfed, for a similar DP cost (and no additional OP cost).
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #152 on: February 04, 2022, 05:13:29 PM »

I feel like the recent swarm core changes don't make sense. What's my incentive for using OP to add 2 decks (and nerf them all) when the ship's DP also increases? Putting another carrier into battle would add the same decks, un-nerfed, for a similar DP cost (and no additional OP cost).

The upcoming patch will remove the replacement rate penalty but retain the replacement rate degradation penalty so it’s less noticeable.
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Mr_8000

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #153 on: February 04, 2022, 05:24:47 PM »

This may come off as rude, but that addresses none of my points. The same thing I said last post will still hold true even with the coming change.
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #154 on: February 04, 2022, 05:55:43 PM »

Because you can't field carrier at price of 5 DP per deck except for condor which dies instantly and doesn't even have a carrier related ship system.
More deck per carrier also means more burst firepower since AI don't know how to cooperate.
The delta of damage dealt is more than the ratio penalty applied.
I'd also imagine most people just S-mod the core and forget about the cost?
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Mr_8000

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #155 on: February 04, 2022, 06:11:09 PM »

Balancing around AI flaws and an assumed S-mod seems questionable if you ask me, but if you've opted to go that route then so be it.
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #156 on: February 04, 2022, 06:38:34 PM »

Then you tell me how to balance it?
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #157 on: February 04, 2022, 06:45:13 PM »

People complain about swarm OP and bash the mod on the official discord so I nerf it in the most insignificant way, or at least so I thought.
Noone is giving any *** feedback about how or what or why and how this is OP so I can do nothing but guess
I guess I'll *** someone anyhow, better not touch existing users' cheese yeah?
Judging from mod adaptability I guess I've failed so I think it'd be fine to be reckless on changes
At least I'm not charging a 100% markup cost for bombers on the swarm wings like converted hangar?
Or maybe I should reduce the OP cost so I don't assume S-mod and justify the nerf?

And you just "so be it", sure, so be it.
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Mr_8000

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #158 on: February 04, 2022, 06:57:12 PM »

I didn't mean any offense my guy, it's just my way of saying "alright, I have nothing else to say". At the end of the day all I wanted to hear was your reasoning and leave my thoughts, and you've gone and overreacted.
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Dhunt05

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #159 on: February 04, 2022, 08:06:01 PM »

im going to be honest you nerfing the *** out swarm but buffing and making ace this strong is beyond questionable. like a good fighter with Ace installed will solo capitals easily. swarm is fun to use but if it keeps getting nerfed then im just going to stop using this.
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CrashToDesktop

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.0a "RTB"
« Reply #160 on: February 04, 2022, 09:13:22 PM »

Fighter auto landing has been implemented!
Fighter on regroup and low enough health now lands like a bomber and relaunch at full health.
This QOL item is practically worth a separate mod by itself!
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.2a
« Reply #161 on: February 05, 2022, 12:33:54 PM »

Removed DP penalty for Swarm, is now maintenance cost instead
Also removed the replacement rate drop speed penalty.

im going to be honest you nerfing the *** out swarm but buffing and making ace this strong is beyond questionable. like a good fighter with Ace installed will solo capitals easily. swarm is fun to use but if it keeps getting nerfed then im just going to stop using this.
You should probably do that because it is only nerfed once.
Contrarily, Ace has been nerfed multiple times.
Again, a not very helpful feedback since I don't know what fighter is broken with Ace unless you tell me.
It is already at a 100% OP cost markup providing approximately double of the firepower I'm not sure what you want.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2022, 12:37:53 PM by Sutopia »
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Dhunt05

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.2a
« Reply #162 on: February 05, 2022, 04:00:18 PM »

I will say yet again “any decent fighter” “including most modded fighters” are stupid strong with ace. I was pretty straightforward. Sorry I’m not going to list hundreds of fighters for you too test takes too long.

I’m at work rn but if you need examples I can try and pull a few once I’m home
« Last Edit: February 05, 2022, 04:27:31 PM by Dhunt05 »
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Sutopia

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.2a
« Reply #163 on: February 05, 2022, 05:57:35 PM »

I will say yet again “any decent fighter” “including most modded fighters” are stupid strong with ace. I was pretty straightforward. Sorry I’m not going to list hundreds of fighters for you too test takes too long.

I’m at work rn but if you need examples I can try and pull a few once I’m home
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The bonus formula was messed up since idk when.
As a result, some of the bonus are increased by an additional 100% unintendedly.
Fix patch on the way
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Dhunt05

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Re: [0.95.1a] Modern Carriers 1.8.2a
« Reply #164 on: February 05, 2022, 06:22:53 PM »

I will say yet again “any decent fighter” “including most modded fighters” are stupid strong with ace. I was pretty straightforward. Sorry I’m not going to list hundreds of fighters for you too test takes too long.

I’m at work rn but if you need examples I can try and pull a few once I’m home
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The bonus formula was messed up since idk when.
As a result, some of the bonus are increased by an additional 100% unintendedly.
Fix patch on the way

ah well that makes sense. i dont really mind a single fighter getting a buff but it seemed to be way too strong when i tested it on a few ships. i wasnt really using OP fighters either i was using some remnant ones and some from sylphon. nice too see that something wasnt correct! once you update ill test again for you if you would like? im running pretty much every single faction and ship pack so lmk
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