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Author Topic: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs  (Read 4495 times)

Arcagnello

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The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« on: April 24, 2021, 03:54:50 PM »

I felt a great appeasement in the Path, as if millions of artificial voices cried out in terror and were suddently silenced...I feel something righteous has happened.
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Man, what a waste, what does being peaceful with the Luddic path even d-
Sector wide supplies data right after raiding a couple of persean league colonies and Ragnar Complex, this is a few days after the fact since I went to Sindria to both refuel and supply Umbra up
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Clearing the entirety of Umbra's supply shortage in one go
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Clearing the entirety of Chalcedon's supply shortage also in one go
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Supplies are usually worse to raid for than either recreational drugs you can farm on mining worlds and heavy armaments you can fish for on colonies with a military base, but you can find them much more easily in a lot more hostile colonies (spreading the raiding, therefore preventing Deterioration) and they're also a resource you actually need meaning I can more or less travel the core sector indefinetly for goodies and never bother stopping for supplies or fuel, considering the Infernus is basically a roided up Tanker and I can usually raid half a dozen planets, sell stuff and get back to my one planet in the fringes of the sector and then come back in one go with a stop to Sindria for refueling.

The fleet for anyone interested. Man it feels good to go at 14 burn speed without a single care in the world. Noone really wants to stop me anyway. I have not found two Hurricanes to give to that Legion yet, maybe I ought to farm some Hegemony fleets...
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And yes I've spent a story points on the Colossi to fit more logistic mods. All my fleet has Solar shielding to just not care about Hyperspace storms.

As for skills, I've got 10 In Leadership and the remaining 5 are in Technology. I don't plan to manually pilot a ship anytime soon. As for mods:
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The ones in red I have not activated and/or are not updated for 0.95 yet.

It's an entirely low tech themed campaign for now. I picked up the fat pigeon and the crab along for the ride, they ARE low tech afterall, altough I'll probably drop them in favour of more asteroid ships (when I find more) unless I really need them in the future. I just wanted to share how disgustingly profitable raiding is with both Pirates and the Path (I don't think either one cares all that much about black market trading), virtually making AI cores just pretty reputation fodder for the Luddic Path to have fun torturing.

I do not yet know if Luddic Path even bothers creating cells in your planets if they got no cores once they're friendly, I guess I'll find out soon enough  ;)

New happenings! (28/04/2021)

A nice family photo with the Kazeron Star Fortress as a special guest!
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Also, selling supplies to pirates on the open market is not the best idea...
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I really expected the rep with pirates to at least go up as much as I got the other factions hurt but no. One more reason to always sell using the black market to both Path and Pirates, especially when it even pays you more for each piece you sell even without taking the "tarriffs" (it's a pirate planet, are you telling me they have the same 30% tax as the Hegemony?!):
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Holy Ludd, Kazeron is the golden goose of raiding. Look at that absolutely disgusting heavy weapons value...
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And I can even raid it a second time 3 days later for supplies, since the planet's size can handle -6 stability and not deteriorate
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Selling all the goodies to the Thulian Raider base just across the star system, plus some Recreational Drugs I..eh...requisitioned from the Hegemony amongst other things I sold on the way to Kazeron
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Welp, that's a Star fortress in my one colony alright  8)

Side Note: I'll probably keep this thread seldomly updated until I finish the campaign. I'm still around mid-game and have to find the stuff I need for...uh...quite the harder fights. Man playing pseudo low-tech is hard after buzzsawing my way thru the game with High Tech  :P

Forward onto Lategame (01/05/2021)

I'd love to say I sat down and started thinking about making my fleet better and start cutting on obviously early and mid game picks to make it endgame ready, bt that's not what happened. This is what happened.
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Turns out the other half was, in fact, as easy  ::)

I had the Fat Pigeon in storage at my main planet at the time, but everything else pretty much got wiped. It is Iron mode afterall.

Speaking of colonies, I've managed to get 3 colonies up in the same system, which also contains a Cryosleeper to skyrocket their growth. This is the main planet!
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The new fleet setup! I wanted to fully use my 10 leadership, 5 technology tech tree, so I went for a battlecarrier focus supported by Wolfpack tactics and Officer augmented superfrigades. I've got 5 Capitals and 6 Frigades. All of them have a level 6 officer (I am more or less searching for the perfect ones as I do the story missions) and I'm driving one of the frigades. I will usually deploy all 6 frigades (60 FP) and spend the rest of the 120FleetPoints (I am playing with the default 300 battle size) with various combinations from the 5 capitals, usually one Pebble escorted by the two Legions. The Other Alternative is deploying two Pebbles escorted by one Legion Each and use the remaining 20DP to cycle through the longer fights.
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I don't know how I feel about the Legions and the one Tryrant. I'm probably going to switch them for 3 Dragon battlecruisers (Pirate versions of the Odissey from Underworld, they trade Plasma Burn for fast Missile Racks  8))
Tyrant Setup. Not bothering with Smods since I'm pretty much replacing it as soon as I get myself the Dragon blueprints
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Fat Pigeon and Stuffed Dove Setup:
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Renegade and Salamander To The Knee setup
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To quote myself from another thread: The Big Asteroid Chungus is a Pebble Battlecarrier from the Asteroid Ship Pack (which you can find here https://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=17871.0 ) . It's what happens when Pirates hit the offspring of a Paragon and a Legion until it's malformed enough to call it one of their own. It's a battlecarrier with Fortress shield, 35.000 hullpoints (that's before hullmods), 13 Salamanders with ECCM, 3 Khopesh Rocket Bombers and an admittedly trivial level of firepower. It's there to eat damage and just be annoying as hell.
It actually can exceed 60.000 hullpoints (with reinforced bulkheads, blast doors and insulated engine assembly) but I ended up going for Hardened Shields, Reinforced Bulkheads and Heavy armor as Integrated hullmods in the end.

Now, it's a bit overpowered (Despite having very little firepower for a capital) but it can actually win a fight against the Paragon just with an officer (it did not have any integrated hullmods at the time of this simulation. Mostly because the salamander spam combined with the Khopesh vomit lands, leaving the paragon drifting lifelessly for most of the fight:
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I'm sorry I took so many screenshots but I was galvanized by a bootleg Paragon shield slapped into an asteroid with 3 fighter bays beating the original. It's absolutely mental.


Venom X-setup when it eventually gets 3 integrated hullmods:
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The Venom-Xs can actually kill the two simulation Onslaughts without much issue and no casualties. I've tried with 5 here but just three are enough, surprisingly.
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Taking the new fleet out for a spin and I've also found out Elventide (I can't clearly remember if it's the name of the planet) is really good to raid for volatiles. Look at that value
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Did anybody else know you could actually destroy dominion relics on planets? Maybe on the next, Luddic Path focus campaign...

Revenge! (sort of, the Venom-Xs are quite frail without 3 S-mods)
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And into the Incinerator you go!
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Can you hear their cries, it's like song to me!

The main tactic I use to defeat star fortresses and raid big planets. It actually works even against the mine-spamtastic ones too since they'll often focus on the Venom-Xs I've purposefully deployed to just bait mine spam:
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The showcase on the tactical map is only a batlestation, since I forgot to take more screenshots of the Kazeron siege:
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Gotta love 360 shield frigades playing a bullet hell game with mines
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The grind is almost over, but the furnace never goes cold (03/05/2021)

A part of me thought it would be a good idea to put the two following screenshots in the usual spoiler windows to not get in the way of reading my awful writing, comedic sense and writing but this is the main focus of the campaign:


I love the smell of charred AI waifus in the morning.


I've actually had both pirate activity AND Pather cells despite both of them being friendly to me, but I only had to go out and squash their respective raider bases once. And here I though Warlord Kanta and the Luddic Path ringleaders would not dare anger my faction after the seas of supplies and ship/weapon blueprints I gave them.
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What is interesting is that both reputation values for destroying said bases did not change, the only negative effect that occured was a pirate fleet that got destroyed as it attempted a defence of the station that spawned it. Does anyone know if it's intended?

My fleet is now almost fully powered up after a lot of Galatia missions and [Redacted] fights in High Danger Systems. I am really, really happy to how much of an absolute unit the pebble is. While 90% of capitals would just run at the sight of the dreaded Autopulse/Sabot variant
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I can just give my Pebble a kill order on it and it will tank to kingdom come while immobilizing the target with the 13 Salamanders for both its own bombers and the Legions escorting it. It's glorious, really.
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I've also made some slight modifications to my Venom-X designs. I decided to go for a simple design using just the one assault chaingun and the one Heavy machine Gun. The entirety of the remaining ordnance points is fully invested into making the ship as survivable as possible, not that's it's gonna help with at least one of the two end game fights I intend to partake in anyway...
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I think I'm just a few Galatia missions away from the first one, wish me luck  :-X




« Last Edit: May 03, 2021, 03:17:03 PM by Arcagnello »
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intrinsic_parity

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2021, 04:10:08 PM »

Lmao 40k for all those cores. TT will give you 1.2 mil I think. Also, I'm not really sure how the rep matters for what you were doing. You can sell on the black market to pirates/path without being friendly very easily, and your fleet is big enough that none of the little pirate/path fleets will stop you, even if they are hostile. I think rep just matters for colony accessibility, and maybe preventing some raids/pirate activity.
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Arcagnello

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2021, 04:20:17 PM »

Lmao 40k for all those cores. TT will give you 1.2 mil I think. Also, I'm not really sure how the rep matters for what you were doing. You can sell on the black market to pirates/path without being friendly very easily, and your fleet is big enough that none of the little pirate/path fleets will stop you, even if they are hostile. I think rep just matters for colony accessibility, and maybe preventing some raids/pirate activity.

I know right? The Tri-Weebs sure like their AI waifus I personally think Luddic Path should not even give you any credits for the cores you give them and just have a 200% reputation boost upon handing them their victims.

I'm also somewhat disappointed there is no special dialog for giving them cores like eating falafels togheder or something like Sseth told me.

The main reason for this was indeed rep farming to not get bothered by either pirates or Path on any of my budding colonies, but let's be honest just imagining the face of TriTach executives when they realize a pirate troglodyte just sold millions worth of AI cores for the Path to destroy at the grand price of 40.000 credits makes it completely worth it.
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AcaMetis

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2021, 04:25:17 PM »

Pather cells will do their thing no matter your reputation with their faction and/or the state that their colonies are in, there is no way to permanently prevent their shenanigans in vanilla save for modifying the settings file. Pirates likewise, they will impose stability and accessibility penalties on your colonies regardless, even if they don't send raids to planets they're on friendly terms with.

As far as befriending the pathers goes, in vanilla, it's quite useless. Thematic, perhaps, depending on the player's actions...but quite useless.
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Arcagnello

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2021, 04:38:04 PM »

Pather cells will do their thing no matter your reputation with their faction and/or the state that their colonies are in, there is no way to permanently prevent their shenanigans in vanilla save for modifying the settings file. Pirates likewise, they will impose stability and accessibility penalties on your colonies regardless, even if they don't send raids to planets they're on friendly terms with.

As far as befriending the pathers goes, in vanilla, it's quite useless. Thematic, perhaps, depending on the player's actions...but quite useless.

Strange, I never had pirate activity affect my planets in my second campaign while I was cooperative with the pirates. I guess I just got lucky then. This is a roleplay campaign anyway to challenge myself and see if I can bruteforce my way over the endgame, making optimal choices was never an option  ::)

Shame about the Pathers. I wish they got some love from within the actual game and not thru mods adding a plethora of ships to their high-octane roster, at least some of their mechanics were fixed. I was however (spoilers ahead) 
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pleasantly surprised that the de-facto leader of the Pathers showed up in one of my colonies and had some nice tea with me while we talked about the Ziggurat and what I intended to do with it. I hope that goes somewhere in the next official releases.
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« Last Edit: April 24, 2021, 04:40:10 PM by Arcagnello »
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intrinsic_parity

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2021, 04:47:21 PM »

I think pirate and pather behaviors are different. I'm pretty sure good pirate relations do prevent the penalties from pirate activity, but I guess pather relation doesn't matter for cells. I think it should still give you slightly more accessibility due to not being at war though.
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KDR_11k

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2021, 02:27:27 AM »

Getting the Path friendly in order to stop the cells wouldn't make any sense anyway since the cells are formed because you are committing sins in the eyes of the Path. Wouldn't make sense for them to be your friends while you're blatantly violating their doctrine in your colonies.
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Arcagnello

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2021, 04:44:19 AM »

I think pirate and pather behaviors are different. I'm pretty sure good pirate relations do prevent the penalties from pirate activity, but I guess pather relation doesn't matter for cells. I think it should still give you slightly more accessibility due to not being at war though.

Alright I did a quick check in my previous pirate-affiliated campaign and I now know for sure pirates do NOT attack you or your colonies in the slightest when you're at least neutral with them (may even need to just be inhospitable).

Even the pirates that would supposedly ambush you with their fake Distress Signals just chuckle and say "Oh, silly me for forgetting to turn the transponder on  hurr durr"  and you got to actually interact with the pirate fleet yourself for that to even happen.

The only pirate fleets that so far have bothered me despite being in good relations with the factions are the ones patrolling hyperspace looking for you in the dead drop missions.

I have yet to see if there is going to be any Pather Cells in my colony if I don't use any AIs. I'd wager I'm still going to have them the moment I get a heavy industry and fuel production up in a barren world with low gravity and no additional hazard ratings, which is rather nonsensical since I'm currently hostile with the Orange hat fetishists, the Incompetence League and the Tri-Weebs, meaning a very large portion of my exports is actually going to supply the Path.

Getting the Path friendly in order to stop the cells wouldn't make any sense anyway since the cells are formed because you are committing sins in the eyes of the Path. Wouldn't make sense for them to be your friends while you're blatantly violating their doctrine in your colonies.

Vanilla could introduce some new mechanics for the Luddic Path. I'm not talking being able to have a commission with them, just have a talk with their ringleaders and swear loyalty to the Path, meaning you will be forbidden from installing any AI cores but the cells will not bother you even if you install Nanoforges or Syncotron core.

The logic behind that would be that while the Path thecnically forbids it, these tools of Mammon and Moloch have been subjugated to serve the vision of Ludd and a modest  part of their income will be taken away since you'll partially be constructing and refueling the armies of the Path.
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Locklave

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2021, 11:07:16 AM »

Pather cells will do their thing no matter your reputation with their faction and/or the state that their colonies are in, there is no way to permanently prevent their shenanigans in vanilla save for modifying the settings file. Pirates likewise, they will impose stability and accessibility penalties on your colonies regardless, even if they don't send raids to planets they're on friendly terms with.

As far as befriending the pathers goes, in vanilla, it's quite useless. Thematic, perhaps, depending on the player's actions...but quite useless.

Pirates at friendly/welcoming will not target your system and will imply no stability negative. Did this in a recent play. Couldn't get them past 49 rep because I *** them off earlier, but they never targeted me.

Not sure about the LP rep. Farming their rep is annoying.
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Goumindong

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2021, 12:27:28 PM »

It’s easy to farm LP rep. Pick up a contact and you get missions forever.
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Arcagnello

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2021, 12:41:27 PM »

It’s easy to farm LP rep. Pick up a contact and you get missions forever.

I actually managed to find one now, I'm not even mad, those AI waifus had to be purged. Their amount inherent heresy and views on PerseanTube were too much for humanity as a whole to bear.

I don't know what it is with this game. I try doing themed campaigns and the things I need are kept from me every. Single. Ludd forsaken time. I just randomly found a thrice cursed by Moloch Hyperion Blueprint FOR THE SECOND TIME (sold one to pirates kek) this campaign, while my second vanilla campaign went on for 30 cycles and had 4 Hyperions in the fleet but I NEVER even smelled the Mammon-laden stench of that fabled set of schematics.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2021, 12:47:08 PM by Arcagnello »
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AcaMetis

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2021, 01:00:33 PM »

It’s easy to farm LP rep. Pick up a contact and you get missions forever.

I actually managed to find one now, I'm not even mad, those AI waifus had to be purged. Their amount inherent heresy and views on PerseanTube were too much for humanity as a whole to bear.

I don't know what it is with this game. I try doing themed campaigns and the things I need are kept from me every. Single. Ludd forsaken time. I just randomly found a thrice cursed by Moloch Hyperion Blueprint TWICE (sold one to pirates kek) this campaign, while my second vanilla campaign went on for 30 cycles and had 4 Hyperions in the fleet but I NEVER even smelled the Mammon-laden stench of that fabled set of schematics.
If you think that's bad luck try my current campaign. I decided to try a frigate-based fleet with a Doom flagship as the fleet's only phase ship, meaning I couldn't use either Revenants or Phantoms. The former of which 100% did not exist in my last campaign at all, even turned on god mode and blasted through every red system I skipped just to check if I missed something but nope. Nothing.

This game? Two Revenant blueprints in my first exploration trip, two Phantom blueprints in my second exploration trip, and my third one uncovered two Paragon blueprints as well as a derelict Paragon right after I found the first blueprint because, you know, obviously the system I explored after finding a random Paragon blueprint made a bet that it could one-up the first one I guess. Got an Astral blueprint through tech-mining, too, instead of having to raid Culann for it in twenty-odd alternate universes until it finally dropped something other than a thrice-cursed Prometheus blueprint like last time...

Oh, and don't forget the pristine nanoforges and biofactory embryos that didn't exist at all last campaign, but had a party in whatever space Mantle Bores decided to rent them after taking an extended vacation this time around. I swear the game's RNG is rigged to just not drop some stuff at all for some reason, really annoying that some things you just seemingly cannot get no matter what.
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xenoargh

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2021, 01:34:48 PM »

I salute your ship naming scheme!

Yes, under the hood, making the Path happy doesn't really make them your friends.  Honestly, I just want the option to completely obliterate them and the Pirates, then make nice with everybody afterwards by giving them All The Cores.
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Locklave

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2021, 03:09:22 PM »

It’s easy to farm LP rep. Pick up a contact and you get missions forever.

I was less clear then I meant to be. It's easy, correct. The contact missions are annoying. Sit in nearly orbit for 1 month waiting for that stupid patrol to stop circling the planet, it finally leaves and a new one takes it's place just as it leaves... /headexplode

1 of them, the escort mission of Starsector and I'm only willing to do scanning/survey jobs.
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Arcagnello

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Re: The Silence of the Artificially Intelligent Lambs
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2021, 03:45:08 AM »

I salute your ship naming scheme!

Yes, under the hood, making the Path happy doesn't really make them your friends.  Honestly, I just want the option to completely obliterate them and the Pirates, then make nice with everybody afterwards by giving them All The Cores.

Ah, thank you! I've got a rule about naming, if it's not the least way fun or sarcastic about the ship then I've got to try and find one!

I think there's a separation between the Pirates with their permanent colonies and the ones that set up their raiding bases, meaning they'll still appear and be a bother even if you raid all pirates settlements into the ground.

I think the same also applies to Pather Cells sadly.

Overall I really think the entire gemeplay loop of Pirates AND Pathers is really lacking. I've got Underworld that already seignificantly expands them but I really think Vanilla needs to step its game up.


It’s easy to farm LP rep. Pick up a contact and you get missions forever.

I was less clear then I meant to be. It's easy, correct. The contact missions are annoying. Sit in nearly orbit for 1 month waiting for that stupid patrol to stop circling the planet, it finally leaves and a new one takes it's place just as it leaves... /headexplode

1 of them, the escort mission of Starsector and I'm only willing to do scanning/survey jobs.

I for one don't even bother with espionage missions. The prisoner extraction ones are a whole lot better but Vanilla has this horrible habit of giving you the planet name and LY distance but not the faction it belongs to so I'm forced to close the dialog window and search thru the planet list if I don't remember what faction owns the thing. It really breaks the flow.

Side note: I've updated the OP with more stuff. Don't expect any wonderfully detailed feedback of my campaign experience, just a general collection of raiding and low-(ish)-tech fleet memes once the fights really start to hit the fan in terms of difficulty!
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