Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[pairedeciseaux]

New build is up! Full list of changes in the OP.

That's a serious bug fix / balancing release, good job! Be sure to have some days off. 

Skills changes are generally bad, for example ECM now totally useless, this 10% is not worth the point =\

Or, depending on point of view, maybe 10% is still too high. 

[Alex]

That's a serious bug fix / balancing release, good job! Be sure to have some days off. 

Thank you! Totally planning on doing that once the dust settles here; could really use it.

[AcaMetis]

Anyway, as far as in-universe reason, this *definitely* makes sense. We're already talking about a "use story points to do something" mechanic, which is essentially "make up your own reason for why something special can be done". It's easy to make up a reason why SO can't be built in. It can be as simple as "the changes required are simply too extensive".

"Make up your own reason for why something special can be done, except for this one specific thing which is the only one of it's kind which absolutely cannot be done" does not sound like it's internally consistent to me. I mean I could definitely see it pushing a ship too much and causing issues (see: Pather ships and Ill-Advised Modifications, even if they're regularly build in and not technically s-modded), but than why prevent it entirely rather than forcing Ill-Advised Modifications on a ship with SO s-modded in? I'd think the option of going full Pather would be an interesting choice to offer a player rather than just taking it off the table entirely.

On a side note, I haven't seen a single Commodity Procurement remote mission in 6 cycles (the entire playthrough). Is it a mod causing it or something else? I only have Nexerelin effecting gameplay atm.

Those random procurement missions were removed in 0.9.5, or rather they were moved to trade contacts.

[Alex]

Ah - you might want to have a look at the thread I linked; the discussion there is pretty much what you're talking about.

Edit: and, I should say, it's a reasonable question/idea. But it would definitely come with making Ill-Advised unremovable to make it an explicitly bad choice, not just "you can still build it in it just costs some credits, too" since that wouldn't solve anything. But, really, this'd be more on-topic in that thread...

[Hiruma Kai]

Skills changes are generally bad, for example ECM now totally useless, this 10% is not worth the point =\
Well, at least fixes are good.

I dunno about the ECM change being that useless.  It's a 20% final calculation swing.  Or in other words, if the enemy has it and you don't, it's -10% to you, and if you have it and the enemy doesn't it's -10% to them.  As a final multiplier, on say, ITU capital ships, that's the difference of being 144% range vs 160% (1440 range vs 1600 range on a TPCs for example) or 160% vs 144%.

Non-elite Gunnery implants range bonus is +15% range (plus some other nice perks, but it's for a single ship, not an entire fleet).  At the capital scale at least, having ECM advantage versus not having it is like twice the base range value of gunnery implants.  So having that 10% ECM edge still strikes me as worth it compared to losing to that edge.

The old ECM was either must have, or must have a way of dealing with it (speed, ECCM, etc).  It turned ITU capitals (160*0.8=128) into less range than DTU cruisers (135).  Which traditionally equals kiting to death without a way to shoot back.

[Sarissofoi]

Safety Overrides can no longer be built into ships using story points

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Was that heavy nerf to Impact Mitigation really necessary?
High tech skills are much better anyway.

[Thaago]

Regarding specific changes: I really like that coordinated maneuvers now gives 1% to cruisers and capitals. It eases up the math on what fleet compositions get the full 20% bonus by just a bit.

The EWM and Impact Mitigation changes I think are going to make Remnant fleets easier to kill - I think they will still be challenging, but both their offense and defense went down by a decent amount. Hull/Armor tanking by players and everyone else with IM took a hit too, so fights will be a bit faster and more dangerous.

Skills changes are generally bad, for example ECM now totally useless, this 10% is not worth the point =\
Well, at least fixes are good.

I dunno about the ECM change being that useless.  It's a 20% final calculation swing.  Or in other words, if the enemy has it and you don't, it's -10% to you, and if you have it and the enemy doesn't it's -10% to them.  As a final multiplier, on say, ITU capital ships, that's the difference of being 144% range vs 160% (1440 range vs 1600 range on a TPCs for example) or 160% vs 144%.

Non-elite Gunnery implants range bonus is +15% range (plus some other nice perks, but it's for a single ship, not an entire fleet).  At the capital scale at least, having ECM advantage versus not having it is like twice the base range value of gunnery implants.  So having that 10% ECM edge still strikes me as worth it compared to losing to that edge.

The old ECM was either must have, or must have a way of dealing with it (speed, ECCM, etc).  It turned ITU capitals (160*0.8=128) into less range than DTU cruisers (135).  Which traditionally equals kiting to death without a way to shoot back.

I agree with this. Its strong enough that the same strategies from last patch apply (either win, mitigate with ECCM, or mitigate by using speed and strike), they just won't be as hyper critical as they were. Mitigation with ECCM going from -10% range to -5% range is a nice buff for low tech ships and Conquests (missile + gun combo ships).

Safety Overrides can no longer be built into ships using story points

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I'm happy to report that your tonsils are normal, captain.

[WeiTuLo]

RC14, very nice! Was RC13 skipped for luck purposes? If so, 10-4 is a lot like that in Chinese.

[Psyentific]

goodbye, built-in SO. you were too good for us. farewell, sweet prince.

[Deageon]

SO not being able to be built in is genuinely disappointing, same with the nerf of the energy weapon mastery, otherwise, at least you fixed the shielded fighter bug.

[SapphireSage]

It seems a bit weird to me though that in a patch which seems to be buffing High-tech (Much more prevalence/focus in mobility and buffs to energy weapons specifically) that Impact Mitigation received a nerf and the insanely tanky Derelict Contingent was left untouched. Flat bonus for damage calculation might give more armor to lower armor high-tech, but higher values are exponentially stronger and so would affect low-tech more right?

[Impetus]

Say, what happens to ships that have safety overrides on as an s-mod from a previus patch? Are the mods automatically removed?

[tseikk1]

So, the community gave tons of different ideas and ways to nerf safety overrides, and then the most boring and blunt (just cant build it in lol, for no reason in particular, lol!!!) one got chosen?

This makes it into the hotfix, but overloaded ships gaining helmsmanship elite boost doesn't?

DP cap skills were adjusted, flux regulation (the universally stronger one) got buffed, but phase corps(the easily worse one) not, excuse me? Other than that changes in this patch are great. I still hope skills get a major rework though...

[bobucles]

Tactical bombardments are no longer atrocities

Praise Ludd!

[Alex]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Was that heavy nerf to Impact Mitigation really necessary?
High tech skills are much better anyway.

I think so; mainly because of how it was really making kinetics useless vs hull. I'm open to having another look at the details, though.

RC14, very nice! Was RC13 skipped for luck purposes? If so, 10-4 is a lot like that in Chinese.

There was actually an -RC13 that didn't make it! But if it had, I'd have felt a bit weird about it.

It seems a bit weird to me though that in a patch which seems to be buffing High-tech (Much more prevalence/focus in mobility and buffs to energy weapons specifically) that Impact Mitigation received a nerf and the insanely tanky Derelict Contingent was left untouched. Flat bonus for damage calculation might give more armor to lower armor high-tech, but higher values are exponentially stronger and so would affect low-tech more right?

The nerfs to IM are more about what happens to stripped armor, in particular how much kinetics are still shut down by it. And EWM got a substantial nerf here, as well.

Say, what happens to ships that have safety overrides on as an s-mod from a previus patch? Are the mods automatically removed?

They'll keep them.

... but overloaded ships gaining helmsmanship elite boost doesn't?

Oh, did I just not put it in the notes? The helmsmanship elite bonus no longer works when venting or overloaded.