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Starsector 0.95.1a is out! (12/10/21); Blog post: Hyperspace Topography (10/12/22)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.95a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 502375 times)

Phrosperatus

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #255 on: October 20, 2020, 11:19:10 AM »

Hi!
I'm new here and to the game.
I wish to ask, is there a way to make the "Shift" key sticky or toggleable in combat so I wouldn't have to keep holding it down?
Thank you for the responses in advance.

Very exciting news, and interesting discussions.
Glad to be a part of it.
Thank you for developing StarSector.
It is truly amazing.

English is not my native language. I apologize.
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dacian

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #256 on: October 20, 2020, 11:19:20 AM »

That is why I have not seriously attempted the mad quest of full sector colonization yet, although I did grind Ordos in red systems for about forty-something alpha cores, just to see what kind of grinding I would need to do to get the cores needed to colonize everything, and to find what can kill Radiants the least painfully.
Can you please tell us what were your finds for optimally killing Radiants? I've been using Drover-filled with Sparks spam ... Am I far from it?
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CoverdInBees

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #257 on: October 20, 2020, 11:51:07 AM »


I wish to ask, is there a way to make the "Shift" key sticky or toggleable in combat so I wouldn't have to keep holding it down?
Thank you for the responses in advance.


I suggested this a few weeks ago and in the short discussion that followed we came to the conclusion that it might be better to make an extra keybinding for it (like caps lock).
An option (checkbox in the menu) to choose wether you want to hold or toggle shift is good enough for most use cases though.

Anyway the other suggestion i made in that post is now part of the patch notes so i have good hopes we might get this one as well ;)
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #258 on: October 20, 2020, 11:59:16 AM »

I want big colonies mostly for military might (to shut down enemy expeditions while I am away) and to rebuild a bigger and better Domain.  I do not care about trade income in the long run because it will be zero after a total core kill (which I need to do if I plan to colonize everything or if I am simply sick of babysitting everyone).

Quote
Can you please tell us what were your finds for optimally killing Radiants?
I did not say I found anything better than what is already known by others.  If anything, I had a sub-optimal character with points sunk into colony skills (that became obsolete after I farmed more than a few alpha cores).  All I wanted is a way to farm cores without losing most of my fleet whenever more than one Radiant attacks - and without Drover and Spark spam since my character was not built for it.

I did not use Drover spam because I did not have Officer Management and carrier skills, and my old computer chugs with massive fighter spam.  At first, I used a mix of capitals, Dooms, and carriers.  Later, I used Paragon spam.

Quote
There are a number of factions which don't have size 7 or 8 worlds.  Tri-tachyon maxes at 6, Pirates, Independents and Pathers cap at size 5.  So a newly settled player faction caps out like some of the smaller factions already present.  If the player can grow a size 8 world over the course of decades, why shouldn't Tri-tachyon also be able to do so?  That of course adds more mechanics and late game issues to balance.
Tri-Tachyon is the only major that stops at 6.

My ambition is to match a major faction, preferably the bigger ones.  Indies and pirates do not count.
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Phrosperatus

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #259 on: October 20, 2020, 12:07:33 PM »


I wish to ask, is there a way to make the "Shift" key sticky or toggleable in combat so I wouldn't have to keep holding it down?
Thank you for the responses in advance.


I suggested this a few weeks ago and in the short discussion that followed we came to the conclusion that it might be better to make an extra keybinding for it (like caps lock).
An option (checkbox in the menu) to choose wether you want to hold or toggle shift is good enough for most use cases though.

Anyway the other suggestion i made in that post is now part of the patch notes so i have good hopes we might get this one as well ;)

Hi!
Thanks for your response. If i could choose, I would wish to keep the way it is, and have another keybinding for the toggle. So Shift would be the same as it was for shorter combats, etc, and another keybind like what you suggested, CapsLock, for longer combats.

If the developer reads this, thank you for considering our suggestion, and for developing StarSector.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #260 on: October 20, 2020, 12:41:41 PM »

Regarding the "new, very rare, and powerful enemy:"

Of course, you can't say much but will this enemy type just be roaming about in the wild or will there be specific steps that have to take place to trigger them? On the one hand, I would a "There be dragons" part of the map or some kind of event that keeps the player humble while on the other hand, I would hate for a new player to get stomped prematurely. At least the [REDACTED] have warning beacons.

Yes.

(... sorry! :))

Also, if current threats are "a couple of Lashers/Enforcers" and what is planned is "the whole Hegemony," (even withe hyperbole)...that sounds both terrifying and exciting. I have my theories but I do hope that the player isn't the only one invested in stopping the existential threat.

Yeah, just... :-X


as expected

Apologies for being so predictable :)



Will planets with disruoted spaceports still generate procurement missions? The "Donn raid-and-trait" strategy makes getting credits too easy.

Keep in mind that disrupting a spaceport causes much less of a penalty to accessibility now.



Just as it is with XP currently, which really peters out above level 70 if you have levels unlocked

(I mean, same exacty deal here, if you super want to, you can change the size limit.)



The idea is to stop people from forcing themselves into gameplay that is not fun, because they feel they have to play "optimally" or "max out everything". If just some people who really want to hang around in a save for 50 years were to see the colonies grow to size 7, that would not be a problem. But if people hang around in the game, actually bored out of their mind, just to see that number change from 6 to 7, that's bad game design.

Exactly this, yes!



Personally, I feel like capping colony size is just a solution looking for a problem. Essentially, the only problems of large Colony sizes that I can see, are the lore conflict, the lack of "realism", and the thematic issues, all things you've previously said should move out of the way for game mechanics. Those three things could be more easily 'fixed' just by reducing the population number of each colony size, or giving certain core worlds specific conditions that, for lore-reasons just state they have larger populations than what their size would otherwise state.

Let's flip that around: most of the concern regarding colony size seems to be motivated by "feel", not mechnical issues. And there are some mechanical concerns, which are fair, but not directly related to the colony size number being smaller, but rather to the current tuning of some values that might be based off that.

And, something I should've mentioned earlier, but frankly it slipped my mind - one of the reasons for smaller colonies is indeed mechanical. You can then have items that have a significant impact, and don't end up with those same items on size-9 colonies that completely overwhelm anything the core has. Basically, "items to specialize + smaller colonies" is more interesting than just "bigger colonies", and "items to specialize + bigger colonies" is not a great mix because it limits what you can do with items, design-wise.



Basically, you are never going to get 'high-hazard small mining colonies' organically. Unless you hamfist it in some way, it's just not happening. It just doesn't work with the mechanics. The only option I can think of is either a fundamental change to the mining system so that more population doesn't improve goods produced, a massive increase to mining profitability just for having the industry, or effectively some kind of 'mining colony' button that limits the colony growth, but gives massive bonuses to accessibility and production (and either prevents or doesn't benefit volatiles, farming, refineries, etc).

I mean, you're pointing out several reasonable ways to do it, right after saying it can't be done :) There are more things that could be done, too.


As for requiring items to bring income up to pre-nerf, or rather '0.95' levels, once again, it feels more like a solution looking for a problem. While currently colonies can quickly make money a non-issue, that's not because they're unbalanced but because the game has a fundamental lack of resource sinks in end game.

Agree about the endgame; as I mentioned, colonies are a tool without a task right now; while I have some fairly specific ideas about their final role, right now there isn't anything. So the focus on optimizing colonies - while understandable right now - is also not something I'm super concerned about, if that makes sense.

Regarding items; see above. Their goal isn't to bring colonies back up to previous production levels (though they do do that), but to introduce more variety to playthroughs and more considerations for where to colonize.


A fundament problem with the system is that there will always be a 'best' skill out of every choice. You can get those skills infinitely close, but you can never truly make them equal. Because of this, there will always be a 'best' build, and players will always gravitate towards it.

To give an example, let's take that navigation skill example. The one that increases overall speed is better. Why? Because it's an overall speed boost, vs making up for a penalty. I can just limit the times when I need to 'slow-move', which I will be used to anyway beforehand. In contrast, the slow-move buff only helps in situations that are sub-optimal to begin with, and no matter how fast you go when slow-moving, I assume it's never going to overtake someone going normal speed. The choice is between lessening a penalty that happens when you essentially screw up positioning in the map, or buffing everything else. It's especially egregious because neither really defines your gameplay, it's not a meaningful choice, it's a nobrainer.

If you really, absolutely, want to provoke different builds, in my opinion, the only real option is to make it so either each choice has nothing to do with each other, or fundamentally changes the way you play the game.

Again, I generally agree! Skills are indeed mostly paired in an apples/oranges way, for the reasons you describe. The exceptions are usually skills that would scale multiplicatively with each other to where you're feel forced to take both of them, and even then it's not a straight number-crunching to see what's better.

Regarding navigation/sensors, it's also an apples/oranges thing; I don't think the way you're looking at it is entirely correct. E.G. being able to go *significantly* faster while going dark isn't making up for a penalty - rather, it's making the "sneaking around" playstyle a lot better. And there are lots of things you can do sneaking around - from salaging in REDACTED systems, to smuggling, to performing stealth raids on core worlds, to doing contact missions. Even just exploring, if you can do an Active Sensor Burst (which makes you "move slowly" now), the Sensors skill may be worth more than navigation in terms of speed if you're exploring a new system, for example. And the Sensors skill also gives a bonus to sensor range/reduction of the sensor profile, making it even better for sneaking around.


What's more, it's more than likely, that the industry/general/utility skills will be, once again prioritized over the combat skills because as always, generally speaking, it's not the player's combat performance that matters most. That's... one more thing that's sort of fundamental to the game as well.

I think that's something that seems like it's numerically correct but actually generally isn't, not if your personal piloting is reasonably good. Even in the currently-out version, combat skills are I think way better than common wisdom gives them credit for. In the next release, with Elite skills, you'll have even more personal impact (compared to an officer which will have very limited access to Elite skills). Plus, every aptitude but leadership has some (thematic to the aptitude) combat skills, so you'd pick some up regardless.


Regardless, I hope my comments don't come off as... pushy or demanding. I believe that I don't necessarily disagree with what you're trying to accomplish. It's just that I think the way you're going about it won't get the results you want. While I certainly have my own desires for what I would 'like' from the game and perhaps I'm projecting my own desires onto you, I'm trying to go on what you've said in the past.

In the end, I'm an opinionated person, and as I write things like this, I tend to get defensive as I pick holes in my own comments. Also its been a few days since I've checked the patch notes or followed the conversation, so maybe some of these have been addressed, or are misunderstandings. I apologize in advance if this is the case.

Have a nice day.

No worries! I feel like you're seeing valid problems, but then maybe assuming that I haven't also seen them but instead did, like, the worst possible thing for no reason :) Which, I mean, it's entirely possible/likely that I did miss some things, so I don't mind you bringing these things up! Fortunately, it does seem like the things here *did* get considered. Whether the solutions are adequate etc, time will tell!

Hope you have a nice day, too!



What would force players to sit around for 20-30 ingame years to watch colonies grow from size 6 to size 7? It's not a requirement to unlock the super secret final boss (I'm assuming), all it does is make a few numbers bigger.

Some kind of internal compulsion? I mean, people do the boringest things for achievements etc. I'm not saying *everyone* would feel compelled to do it, but some people certainly would. And even people that wouldn't, seeing something you *can* do and then going "well, that's too boring, I'm not doing *that*" still feels bad! Like, you feel that you've been cut off from some aspect or some power level in the game because you're not willing to waste your time on something boring.


Is it possible to make the move slowly key a toggle on? Maybe by a setting?

Well, if you want to move slowly for a length of time where a toggle is more convenient then holding the key down, then chances are you actually want "Go Dark" instead. Even moving through hyperstorms slowly, for example, you could do that, since no-one's going to stop you for Transponder Crimes in hyperspace...


I think making the Light Needler 7 OP is a mistake. It still won't be useful for ships that want more sustained kinetic pressure, and on ships that can fully utilize the burst like the Sunder or Doom it'll be undercosted. The Railgun nerf is appropriate, though.

FWIW, I've just about come around to making it cost 8 OP.


I really love game devs like you. You give just enough info to make me get really excited about what's next, but you don't give any big spoilers. I really can't wait for the new raiding mechanics and story content!

Also, completly off-topic, but are there any mods that interest you content or gameplay wise?

Thank you! <3

Re: mods - I don't actually play with mods very much. By the time I'd have time to (and they're updated for the new version), there's usually some minor incompatibilities that make it a pain to use with the in-dev version. Plus I'd feel extra-bad about stealing all the ship names if I knew I was doing it ahead of time :)


Given the easy to modify nature of the game, I think as a core vanilla limit, size 6 is fine, and if someone wants their "Long war" mod that lets you play with interesting game play for decades and eventually become as large as the Hegemony, then the subset of players interested in it will grab that mod.  Presumably Alex can make that number easy to change, and given the fact NPC worlds larger exist, should work naturally.

Indeed, and it's trivially modifiable!

It makes no gameplay difference where the cap is set, since the factions and core are static/scripted so that they can be balanced with whatever the player is allowed to do. Colony size has no significance other than income in the current game, and since income can be independently tuned, it's actually just a matter of 'feeling' which is totally subjective.

(Yep!)


Hi!
I'm new here and to the game.
I wish to ask, is there a way to make the "Shift" key sticky or toggleable in combat so I wouldn't have to keep holding it down?
Thank you for the responses in advance.

Very exciting news, and interesting discussions.
Glad to be a part of it.
Thank you for developing StarSector.
It is truly amazing.

English is not my native language. I apologize.

Hi! Not quite, but if you go to gameplay settings (a tab in the "Settings" menu), there's a setting to invert the behavior, so that ships will face the mouse by default, and holding shift will temporarily stop it. Not sure if that'll be useful to you; depends on exactly what you're looking for. (As far as an extra control, well, running a bit short on buttons! Not a fan of using caps lock for things, since it has side effects...)

Happy you're into the game otherwise :)
« Last Edit: October 20, 2020, 01:18:05 PM by Alex »
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SCC

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #261 on: October 20, 2020, 01:29:34 PM »

What's more, it's more than likely, that the industry/general/utility skills will be, once again prioritized over the combat skills because as always, generally speaking, it's not the player's combat performance that matters most. That's... one more thing that's sort of fundamental to the game as well.
The reason why more people value other skills over combat skills is because there are more people who are bad at combat than who are good. And since combat skills scale with player's skill the most, put two and two together and combat skills are unpopular partially because they really are worth less to some people, and others learned to avoid them, because they used to be worth less to them.
I don't know of any particular point at which it's better to get combat skills than not to, but once you play for some time, it's worth to check and see if you're at that point yet.

I think that's something that seems like it's numerically correct but actually generally isn't, not if your personal piloting is reasonably good. Even in the currently-out version, combat skills are I think way better than common wisdom gives them credit for. In the next release, with Elite skills, you'll have even more personal impact (compared to an officer which will have very limited access to Elite skills). Plus, every aptitude but leadership has some (thematic to the aptitude) combat skills, so you'd pick some up regardless.
Will new combat skills' bonuses be overall greater, than current combat skills? You get more locked in in the next update, so I hope so.

Phrosperatus

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #262 on: October 20, 2020, 01:48:00 PM »

Hi!
I'm new here and to the game.
I wish to ask, is there a way to make the "Shift" key sticky or toggleable in combat so I wouldn't have to keep holding it down?
Thank you for the responses in advance.

Very exciting news, and interesting discussions.
Glad to be a part of it.
Thank you for developing StarSector.
It is truly amazing.

English is not my native language. I apologize.

Hi! Not quite, but if you go to gameplay settings (a tab in the "Settings" menu), there's a setting to invert the behavior, so that ships will face the mouse by default, and holding shift will temporarily stop it. Not sure if that'll be useful to you; depends on exactly what you're looking for. (As far as an extra control, well, running a bit short on buttons! Not a fan of using caps lock for things, since it has side effects...)

Happy you're into the game otherwise :)
Hi!
Thank you for your response.
A new button for toggling the function temporarily would be the option i wish to be implemented. Making it an optional toggleable function would be also really helpful.
I'm so glad you already implemented bindable modifier keys (Shift, CTRL, Alt, example Shift+D, etc). Thank you for that.
May you please consider implementing combinations. For example by default C is decelerate.
I wish to use W+S or A+D or E+D or Q+A key combinations which otherwise doesn't really make sense to be used / be pressed / holded down together for that.
I'm sorry if I bothered you with these requests and thank you for considering implementing any of these and again for developing StarSector.
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FooF

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #263 on: October 20, 2020, 02:08:00 PM »

The reason why more people value other skills over combat skills is because there are more people who are bad at combat than who are good. And since combat skills scale with player's skill the most, put two and two together and combat skills are unpopular partially because they really are worth less to some people, and others learned to avoid them, because they used to be worth less to them. I don't know of any particular point at which it's better to get combat skills than not to, but once you play for some time, it's worth to check and see if you're at that point yet.

Going to second this. I know of numerous players that get into combat and put the flagship on autopilot because they don't feel like they can do better. To the degree that combat skills can become a crutch if your actual skill level isn't great, they can also become "irrelevant" if you can't feel their effects first-hand. Combat skills are very much a "layered" thing: one skill might not ever feel like much but the cumulative effects do really start to add up. Whenever I start a new run, I can immediately tell that my ship is slower, less accurate, does less damage, takes more damage, and has a lot less room for error. I can still leverage opportunities and get good positioning but skills make my piloting drastically more effective.

Early on, I'm almost 100% on combat skills. I fight bounties for the most part so while fleets are small, your flagship has a disproportionate effect on battles and I can go from taking on 2-3x DP worth of enemy ships to 5x pretty quickly (and then beyond). I don't fault anyone for doing things differently but that's where I tend to go get the most bang-for-my-buck.

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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #264 on: October 20, 2020, 02:36:08 PM »

In the current release, the combat skills I am most interested in are not in the Combat tree, but in Leadership (Fleet Logistics, Coordinated Maneuvers, and maybe Fighter Doctrine... oh, and Officer Management) and Technology (Gunnery Implants, Power Grid Modulation, Electronic Warfare, and especially Loadout Design), and that competes with Navigation.  By the time I get all of that, I am already spent more or less half of all of the skill points I will ever get (thank dead aptitudes).

Later, I get Combat Endurance, Helmsmanship, and whatever boosts shields in Combat.  Afterwards, it is decision paralysis, especially during the games I grabbed Industry for colony skills (because I wanted a big empire like Hegemony too).  I would like the armor skills, but I cannot get everything.  If I played another game before 0.95, I would definitely grab Impact Mitigation 1 (which I did not previously).
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #265 on: October 20, 2020, 02:45:12 PM »

  • Flagging intel as "important" will no longer prevent it from being removed when it expires

So this one's a mixed bag. Something like an incoming pirate raid? Yeah, take that off the list when I've killed it, I don't need that sticking around. Something like a 'survey this research station' mission that I tagged as important so I don't have to keep separate outside-the-game notes? No, I actually don't want that to expire when the mission's no longer being offered; I would very much like the information that "There is a research station in this system" to be something that sticks around.

RE: All the Onslaught discussions.
So the interesting thing here that I noticed recently is that the Onslaught's base flux dissipation is the same as the Dominator's base flux dissipation. Which does, looking at it, neatly explain why I'm happy to use Dominators, but find Onslaughts to be under-fluxed and overall just relatively poor ships for their price tag.

And on a completely un-related note, I'd like to bring this suggestion thread back to Alex' attention; it would be very useful for modders to have some access to how ships get drawn in non-combat / non-refit contexts.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2020, 03:27:28 PM by Wyvern »
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #266 on: October 20, 2020, 03:24:14 PM »

The reason why more people value other skills over combat skills is because there are more people who are bad at combat than who are good. And since combat skills scale with player's skill the most, put two and two together and combat skills are unpopular partially because they really are worth less to some people, and others learned to avoid them, because they used to be worth less to them.
I don't know of any particular point at which it's better to get combat skills than not to, but once you play for some time, it's worth to check and see if you're at that point yet.

I think that's a really nice way of putting it.

Will new combat skills' bonuses be overall greater, than current combat skills? You get more locked in in the next update, so I hope so.

Very roughly in the same ballpark, with some outliers, and some greater specialization which would allow for greater power in specific tactical contexts. Not sure what you mean by "more locked in", could you clarify? My initial though is you'd be less locked in due to being able to re-spec, so you must mean something else. Ah - maybe the fact that you have to go up the aptitude to get the higher-tier skills? Those are indeed more powerful; the Combat aptitude included.

A new button for toggling the function temporarily would be the option i wish to be implemented. Making it an optional toggleable function would be also really helpful.

Yeah, I understand what you mean!

May you please consider implementing combinations. For example by default C is decelerate.
I wish to use W+S or A+D or E+D or Q+A key combinations which otherwise doesn't really make sense to be used / be pressed / holded down together for that.
I'm sorry if I bothered you with these requests and thank you for considering implementing any of these and again for developing StarSector.

I don't think that would work very well - it's pretty complicated, but also, most keyboards have a hardware limit on the number of nearby keys that they can registered as "pressed" at the same time. So, for example, if you're holding W+S, presses of Q, A, E, D, and some (but not all!) other nearby keys will not register. Again, this is a hardware thing; those input events just won't get generated. So requiring additional key presses like that is asking for trouble.



So this one's a mixed bag. Something like an incoming pirate raid? Yeah, take that off the list when I've killed it, I don't need that sticking around. Something like a 'survey this research station' mission that I tagged as important so I don't have to keep separate outside-the-game notes? No, I actually don't want that to expire when the mission's no longer being offered; I would very much like the information that "There is a research station in this system" to be something that sticks around.

Ah, that's a fair point. Hopefully when/if I get to adding custom map tokens, that'd be alleviated...

RE: All the Onslaught discussions.
So the interesting thing here that I noticed recently is that the Onslaught's base flux dissipation is the same as the Dominator's base flux dissipation. Which does, looking at it, neatly explain why I'm happy to use Dominators, but find Onslaughts to be under-fluxed and overall just relatively poor ships for their price tag.

Hmm? The Dominator is 450, and the Onslaught is 600. Is that not what you're seeing in 0.9.1a? In other words, did I buff that aspect of it and forget about it?

And on a completely un-related note, I'd like to bring this suggestion thread back to Alex' attention; it would be very useful for modders to have some access to how ships get drawn in non-combat / non-refit contexts.

I'll have another look when I get a chance! What I said back then still stands, really - it's a tricky thing to expose in a good way.
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Thaago

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #267 on: October 20, 2020, 03:27:46 PM »

Regarding combat skills: the devil is in the details. We honestly won't know how the new skill system matches up until we see it. As with the current system, autopilot players see little benefit to combat skills as an officer in the same ship is a better deal. As player skill grows, so does combat skills' impacts.

In the current version the first skills I take are nearly always combat skills even if I'm not going for a full combat build, because the amplification they give to the early game, where the player's flagship is the (in some cases vast) majority of fleet power, it quite large for a modest investment. I can see myself doing the same thing in a new system.

Details that are about the current system and therefor obsolete:
Spoiler
6 skill points (with 2 in the aptitude, 2 in target analysis, 2 in defensive systems) gives anadvantage in the "flux war" of getting the enemy's shield down before the player's own goes down: against a 'mirror' enemy, they will max their shield out when the player is only at 70%. Not to mention the level 1 requirement skills:-25% shield flux is a nice bonus to offensive flux (25 flux on a Hammerhead, equivalent when shields are up to Power Grid Modulation 3 for a level 1 skill), and +50% damage to enemy weapons/engines is nice. For 2 more points: Impact mitigation 1 doubles or more the effective hull hitpoints of a ship, and advanced countermeasures combined with it reduces almost every kinetic weapon to minimum damage.

There are a few other good level 1/2 skills to pick up later, like evasive action 1 and impact mitigation 2 on cruisers/capitals, perhaps combat endurance 1 if the fleet is slow killing for endgame fights, but many of the other best skills are in tier 3 and "gated" behind less essential (but still useful) tier 1 and 2 skills, so there is a gap above 6-10 invested combat points where the marginal return on investment is low, before it shoots up again for the best skills.

For ballistic ships, Gunnery Implants 1 is a game changer (range is also great at tier 3, but recoil reduction on some weapons is massive). Of all the technology skills, I rank this one only behind Electronic Warfare 1 in terms of value for ships that use weapons with spread, and consider those 2 + 1 in the aptitude the required Tech skill investment in otherwise 'no tech' runs.

[close]
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #268 on: October 20, 2020, 03:37:42 PM »

Hmm? The Dominator is 450, and the Onslaught is 600. Is that not what you're seeing in 0.9.1a? In other words, did I buff that aspect of it and forget about it?
...Huh. Yup, looks like I goofed somehow, those are definitely the correct values. Not sure where I got that notion from, then.

I still find the Dominator to more or less work, and the Onslaught more or less not work. Maybe I'd been looking at dissipation available per weapon slot or something? Though that'd generate less 'equal' results and more 'the Dominator has more flux available per weapon'...
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

AcaMetis

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #269 on: October 20, 2020, 03:46:12 PM »

Do combat skills really make that much of a difference ???? They never seemed worth it to me, at least on paper, over the skill that get me a faster, cheaper, better, more resourceful, etc., etc., fleet and 10 officers to cover all my combat skill needs. One of the things I was actually hoping for in the next patch was logistics officers, people that can get the non-combat skills and leave me free to focus on combat without sacrificing my fleet's abilities, logistics profile and/or - somewhat importantly - combat performance. Fleet Logistics 3, Fighter Doctrine, Loadout Design, all useful skills that no officer in the game can cover for me...

Of course with all the changes coming I've no idea of that idea is still relevant - or whether it was even relevant in the first place, apparently - so we'll just have to see.
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