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Starsector 0.95a is out! (03/26/21)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.95a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 214743 times)

Morrokain

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #420 on: October 25, 2020, 03:30:07 PM »

Right, yeah; this is a good thing to think about, vis a vis "does this change encourage weird gameplay patterns". I'd be lying if I said I'd considered every detail (this was, to be honest, kind of an impulsive addition based on a suggestion from, iirc, Gothars), but!

I think overall having more/better officers will always be good - they do reduce the difficulty of the fight, but I think not to the point where it's better not to have them. It'd be pretty much impossible to do anything real meaningful without them. And, while officer level/presence matters here, it matters less than e.g. for deployment points distribution, so it shouldn't discourage putting officers in small ships. Player level - rather than specifically combat skills - factors in here, but, again, it's not an overwhelming factor. Weapons/dmods etc don't factor in; it's based off the base deployment points of a hull and officer levels. Again, though, I don't think it's something where trying to optimize out a dmod or two would make much difference.

(Officers that aren't assigned to a ship still count, since otherwise you'd be encouraged to unassign officers you're not planning to use in the fight... made that change just now, actually, since wasn't thinking about that aspect of it before.)

Overall, the hope is this is something that's worth playing around on the macro level - in terms overall fleet size/composition/engagement choices - but not on a micro level, trying to wring an extra couple of percent out of it.

I agree that TheLochNessCheeseBurger has a really good analysis.

To the point on officers, I'd say it won't matter if more officers are technically unattractive to get more XP as long as there are threats that essentially require them to beat. To this end, it will largely depend upon how strong combat skills are. If they make piloting skills impactful enough that the officer bonuses aren't needed for high level challenges, yeah I could see this becoming an issue for design.

Imo, there is always going to be a "most efficient" strategy to things and that is likely unavoidable. As long as there are situations where that doesn't hold true, I think that's fine.

A good thing about avoiding officers early, if this proves to be the case, is that it indirectly encourages players to learn to pilot better without stat boosts right out of the gate. It also means that additional fleet complexity is indirectly discouraged early on - which allows players more time to choose a playstyle.

If you have 3 officers with carrier skills, for instance, you are encouraged to play with carriers more than warships. In that sense, getting specialized officers too early somewhat limits an early player's desire to explore different ships and builds.
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shoi

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #421 on: October 25, 2020, 03:37:04 PM »


I like all changes except for inability to bribe Hegemony's inspectors without spending story points.

this change makes a lot more sense from a narrative perspective , imo.

Any chance that there'll be a way to administrate more colonies without having to resort to AI cores at some relatively quick point? I get that colonizing isn't the intended end goal and all, but it never struck me as sensible that some AI colonies can be administrated by a blank portrait saying "no one of particular note" (or some such) whereas your colonies not only must be administrated by someone, but that (given enough skill points invested) four of them can simultaneously be administrated as well as an Alpha Core - and only an Alpha Core -  can administrate one planet, by someone exploring the galaxy on the other end of the sector.

Not that having to, you know, basically retire and sit at your colonies to administrate them would be a very fun mechanic, but it's still bizarre every time I think about it.

it is kind of funny that a artificial super intelligence can be outskilled in governing by a normal human
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 03:40:14 PM by shoi »
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SafariJohn

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #422 on: October 25, 2020, 04:06:20 PM »

it is kind of funny that a artificial super intelligence can be outskilled in governing by a normal human

Reality is unrealistic.
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Mordodrukow

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #423 on: October 25, 2020, 04:07:14 PM »

Quote
If I want to use cores, it is most likely to expand my empire, that is use them as admins.  I do not want to guess where big H will hit next (at least not without an Intel bug) among dozens of alpha-run worlds.  If I need to guess where big H will hit next (and chances of success are low and result of failure is bad stuff happening), I will stop that nonsense by wiping them off the map.
For me essential usage of cores is Alpha-boosted spaceports. Other stuff is optional. Also... if max colony size will be 6, maybe i dont need Alphas in spaceports too. I mean: size 6 is pretty achievable without any effort (even if the progression will be scaled so size 6 will demand same time as size 8 demands now... if more - than ok, we still need some growth buffs).

About secret inspections: what if we dont know what colony will be checked, but if we have contacts in Heg we can ask them about that?
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ChardonnayDreams

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #424 on: October 25, 2020, 05:28:29 PM »

Any thoughts on maybe toning down pirate raids to coincide with their buff to their minimum base modules and nerf to bounties when it comes to starting a colony in the early game?

I find after a pirate raid, they continously raid even if theyve suceeded several times in a row, it would be nice to either pay them protection or have a longer cooldown between raids. P I struggle to stabilize expending so much resources and time in defending my colony. Especially considering I find I get tied down to it very quickly.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 05:32:07 PM by ChardonnayDreams »
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CoverdInBees

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #425 on: October 25, 2020, 05:40:56 PM »

If they make piloting skills impactful enough that the officer bonuses aren't needed for high level challenges, yeah I could see this becoming an issue for design.

Officer skills are the same as piloting skills though, at least when not considering elite skills (of which officers can also get one with mentoring), meaning that they're roughly the same force multiplier on your officers as on yourself.

Anyway Alex said he was aiming to make the FP increase small enough to make officers worth it even in smaller ships (from the perspective of min-maxing this XP formula), it almost certainly follow from that that they'll definetly be worth it when you assign them to bigger ships.
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bowman

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #426 on: October 25, 2020, 06:08:51 PM »

If they don't already, Hegemony should send AI check expeditions even when the player isn't using AI cores as both a heads-up to new players that "hey if you use these those inspections are going to find them" and also because then they can be rarer per-day but the time over which they'd show up would be doubled or maybe tripled depending on when the player settles. As a result, you'd have to deal with less expeditions that actually affect you but they wouldn't be so rare as to be forgotten.

In fact, I'd say they should function similarly to ejecting illegal goods right before a patrol inspects you:
Removing cores leaves evidence depending on core type for x months (3, or variable 2+2 per core rank?) that Hegemony still picks up on. From my PoV, flying back to remove the cores before an inspection is both unfun and a bit of an exploit (since it seems to me the intent is that you either bribe or fight them if you're going to use cores, and in the next version bribe will function much better since it will be story point cost and thus not just a $ in versus $ out calculation).

Alternatively, in parallel with the evidence changes, expeditions could be a cyclical thing (so it doesn't pop up when you're doing other things and you can thus plan around it long-term) that always go out every, say, 4 years or so and then evidence would last much longer- or maybe be permanent. "While the efficiency gains AI cores are capable of are impossible for a human to do, there are obvious traces left within any system actively or previously imbued with one. A core must reach its tendrils into every nook and cranny of a network to reap their effects and the patterns created in production lines as a result of their influence are widely known, and easily identifiable, but poorly understood.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 06:29:28 PM by bowman »
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ProfessionalHuman

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #427 on: October 25, 2020, 06:25:04 PM »

About secret inspections: what if we dont know what colony will be checked, but if we have contacts in Heg we can ask them about that?

Imagine exploring distant part of the sector and getting a message about inspection and needing to travel 40ly+ just to ask your contact about where the inspection is going. That would be super annoying.

Also, it feels kind of strange to me that we can get messages through a comms relay anywhere in the sector, but cant send any message back. It would be great if it was possible to get access to colony/station main menu (menu that opens after you dock to it) and contacts remotely. Some mods even put some vital functions in these menus.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 06:28:12 PM by ProfessionalHuman »
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SafariJohn

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #428 on: October 25, 2020, 06:25:39 PM »

AI Inspections even if you don't have cores is a great idea IMO

There's already a rep penalty AFAIK if you had cores but yanked them before the Hegs showed up.
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shoi

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #429 on: October 25, 2020, 06:42:05 PM »

it is kind of funny that a artificial super intelligence can be outskilled in governing by a normal human

Reality is unrealistic.

what
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 06:44:25 PM by shoi »
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Linnis

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #430 on: October 25, 2020, 07:10:42 PM »

it is kind of funny that a artificial super intelligence can be outskilled in governing by a normal human

Reality is unrealistic.

what

depends on the AI. They are "smarter" than humans because they can learn in simulations ultra fast. But you tell an combat trained AI that you plucked from a spaceship and tell it to govern millions of people it might not be so smart then.
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Silveressa

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #431 on: October 25, 2020, 07:41:35 PM »

Is there any place for us to download the 0.95a in progress version to check it out first hand?
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shoi

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #432 on: October 25, 2020, 07:44:53 PM »


depends on the AI. They are "smarter" than humans because they can learn in simulations ultra fast. But you tell an combat trained AI that you plucked from a spaceship and tell it to govern millions of people it might not be so smart then.

if that what he meant, it still doesnt make sense

Quote
An alpha-level AI core is capable of excelling at any task. Assigning one to run a colony-wide industry brings benefits well beyond the capacity of human leadership, and there are even rumors of alpha cores surreptitiously assigned to govern entire worlds.

not that I mind or anything on how it actually operates in game
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 07:47:36 PM by shoi »
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SonnaBanana

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #433 on: October 25, 2020, 08:19:14 PM »

Maybe the Alpha AI refuses to use all it's capabilities for you or it cannot do so because it's not given powerful enough hardware?
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.95a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #434 on: October 25, 2020, 08:53:40 PM »

Any chance that there'll be a way to administrate more colonies without having to resort to AI cores at some relatively quick point? I get that colonizing isn't the intended end goal and all ...

I can't really see doing that, no. As you say, that's not an intended goal, so I don't see a reason to develop in that direction only to need to cut it back down at some point. I mean, had to do that with colony size (pretty much knowing initially that size 10 would never stay as the limit), and look how much discussion that caused. Ha!

... but it never struck me as sensible that some AI colonies can be administrated by a blank portrait saying "no one of particular note" (or some such) whereas your colonies not only must be administrated by someone

The "blank portrait" is more or less equivalent to the "no skills admin" you can hire, so at most that's a UI issue :)

... but that (given enough skill points invested) four of them can simultaneously be administrated as well as an Alpha Core - and only an Alpha Core -  can administrate one planet, by someone exploring the galaxy on the other end of the sector.

Consider that with an Alpha Core, there's a question of trust. There's the core, giving instructions for the optimal and perfect running of a colony, probably. And there's the human overseers, trying to figure out which of the core's instruction *may*, in roundabout and entirely unexpected ways, lead to Bad Things.


A good thing about avoiding officers early, if this proves to be the case ...

Just want to note that I'd be very surprised if this proved to be the case. Combat skills are great and all but you need some numbers on your side, too.


Any thoughts on maybe toning down pirate raids to coincide with their buff to their minimum base modules and nerf to bounties when it comes to starting a colony in the early game?

I find after a pirate raid, they continously raid even if theyve suceeded several times in a row, it would be nice to either pay them protection or have a longer cooldown between raids. P I struggle to stabilize expending so much resources and time in defending my colony. Especially considering I find I get tied down to it very quickly.

The continuous raids are a bug, actually - fixed for the next release! I think it's in the patch notes somewhere.


If they don't already, Hegemony should send AI check expeditions even when the player isn't using AI cores as both a heads-up to new players that "hey if you use these those inspections are going to find them"

What, and ruin the surprise? I get what you're saying, but since bribing is still an option, I don't think the player really needs to be explicitly warned ahead of time.


In fact, I'd say they should function similarly to ejecting illegal goods right before a patrol inspects you:
Removing cores leaves evidence depending on core type for x months (3, or variable 2+2 per core rank?) that Hegemony still picks up on. From my PoV, flying back to remove the cores before an inspection is both unfun and a bit of an exploit (since it seems to me the intent is that you either bribe or fight them if you're going to use cores, and in the next version bribe will function much better since it will be story point cost and thus not just a $ in versus $ out calculation).

Yeah, removing cores prior to the inspection already doesn't work! IIRC you'll still lose them if they're in colony storage, and if not, there are a lot more reputation penalties since they suspect you did this.


Is there any place for us to download the 0.95a in progress version to check it out first hand?

Nope, sorry! It's not in an enjoyably playable state, anyway; you'd be surprised at how late in the dev cycle everything actually comes together to the degree that it makes any sense to have someone outside the dev team play it.
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