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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.6.2 - information services  (Read 33110 times)

Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2020, 12:26:16 PM »

Has a few flaws but I still like this mod. Wish I had it for my first playthrough (same with courier services).

Some of the biggest annoyances:
 - One can refresh a query and head for a hit that shows no data on the availability. Stock might be refreshed upon the player reaches the providing market rendering the journey futile.
 - While every listing is accurate it usually is under a stupid submarket. Not sure about the reliability of commission or standing locked purchases but I do remember something I ended up not being able to buy and 100% sure about Cabal hiccups (this submarket is locked behind a fee for every visit).
 - Freezes the game. Like a lot. Performance impact is noticable with about 3-4 queries and don't you dare set 18+. I have no idea why selecting the query menu causes a lag, because it's dead certain the queries are not updated on the display because every time I need to do that manually with the button and most hits disappear.
 - Cannot query for any ship in the game. I know it's there, I used it before. I still want to make a query for it and keep an eye on that ship. Some special variants from mods are searchable though, even with no result popping up (probably no chance either to find one but still searchable).
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2020, 01:49:10 PM »

Glad you find this mod useful.I assume you are talking about your experience with 1.2.0 (1.3.0 was out today), thus will address your feedback based on 1.2.0 behaviour.Please correct me if I am wrong.
- One can refresh a query and head for a hit that shows no data on the availability. Stock might be refreshed upon the player reaches the providing market rendering the journey futile.
Unfortunately that's how the submarkets work, they update (recreate) their stocks at the beginning of the month (marked as out of date, nothing is yet replaced).
If the submarket is out of date, it will only update on player interaction (prior to you opening the market), thus what seemed to be "present", suddenly becomes "out of stock".

New version 1.3.0 will instantly show you the item is no longer available (intel becomes greyed out, you get text on the right saying it is no longer there).
Whenever you open HyperNET Board, all intel presented will be rechecked for availability.
As a rule of thumb, I reopen HyperNET (in 1.3.0) at the beginning of the month to see what's the current situation, and click "Refresh all".

- While every listing is accurate it usually is under a stupid submarket. Not sure about the reliability of commission or standing locked purchases but I do remember something I ended up not being able to buy and 100% sure about Cabal hiccups (this submarket is locked behind a fee for every visit).
There was a bug few versions ago which caused inclusion of submarkets to which the player had no access.
That was fixed a version later but I introduced another bug, which removed a lot of valid submarkets as a result.
This is now fixed in the new version (1.3.0) where ALL submarkets are shows, but there is a check whether item/ship can be purchased.
If not, appropriate text will be shown - if you find this to be inaccurate, please report (screenshot of intel + submarket in question).

- Freezes the game. Like a lot. Performance impact is noticable with about 3-4 queries and don't you dare set 18+. I have no idea why selecting the query menu causes a lag, because it's dead certain the queries are not updated on the display because every time I need to do that manually with the button and most hits disappear.
I will have to investigate this - what are your specs? What causes freezes (opening intel, during campaign/when travelling, clicking "New Query" or some other button)?How many faction mods do you use?
What is your heap size (I assume you did follow the guide to increase heap size since you play modded)?
I could see this causing stutters / freezes if your heap size is too small.

Edit:I did find out a refresh (of all queries) whenever the board was displayed (effectively making Refresh All / Refresh button redundant).
I have removed that call, so performance out of the box will be better in 1.3.1 which is now released.
I intentionally made this mod script-free (it does not `addScript`, so it is not evaluated every frame), but there is some magic happening when opening the board.
I will look into reducing the load and optimising performance if possible.

- Cannot query for any ship in the game. I know it's there, I used it before. I still want to make a query for it and keep an eye on that ship. Some special variants from mods are searchable though, even with no result popping up (probably no chance either to find one but still searchable).
That's intentional to avoid spoilers. The way cargo and ship picker works, it looks at all submarkets and builds a list of available hulls.
So until item X (or ship X) is present in at least one submarket it will not be included.
I will look into changing this, perhaps show everything that is not hidden in Codex?

Edit 2: Released 1.3.1 with small optimisation improvement.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2020, 01:01:33 PM by Jaghaimo »
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Alex

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2020, 01:52:43 PM »

(Added this to the mod index! ... please let me know if you didn't want that, for any reason.)
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IonDragonX

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2020, 08:33:45 PM »

- Stock might be refreshed upon the player reaches the providing market rendering the journey futile.
Unfortunately that's how the submarkets work, they update (recreate) their stocks at the beginning of the month (marked as out of date, nothing is yet replaced).
How about a reminder field that says "Days until the market resets = X" in a conspicuous place next to the search field?

- Cannot query for any ship in the game. I know it's there, I used it before. I still want to make a query for it and keep an eye on that ship.
I will look into changing this, perhaps show everything that is not hidden in Codex?
I think its logical to show only results that match the Codex, yes.

Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #19 on: November 04, 2020, 09:54:47 AM »

@Alex - thank you, I was going to ask for that and totally forgot. Could you also add Stellar Logistics to the list please?

@IonDragonX - I have added a pseudo-intel to warn the player about reset (second to last economy tick, so for most players 1/10th of a month, 3-4 days before end of month), and to remind the player that a new month has rolled, and thus the intel may be stale. Finally, HyperNET Board marks intel as stale if the last refresh has happened in the previous months.

New month alerts:
Spoiler


[close]

Stale indicators:
Spoiler

[close]
« Last Edit: November 04, 2020, 02:10:46 PM by Jaghaimo »
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Alex

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #20 on: November 04, 2020, 10:59:10 AM »

@Alex - thank you, I was going to ask for that and totally forgot. Could you also add Stellar Logistics to the list please?

Done!
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #21 on: November 05, 2020, 06:53:53 PM »

Glad you find this mod useful.I assume you are talking about your experience with 1.2.0 (1.3.0 was out today), thus will address your feedback based on 1.2.0 behaviour.Please correct me if I am wrong.
Thanks for the fast and accurate response.
Indeed I played with 1.2.0, just checked the changelog for the newest release before posting and tried to filter out already solved issues.

- One can refresh a query and head for a hit that shows no data on the availability. Stock might be refreshed upon the player reaches the providing market rendering the journey futile.
Unfortunately that's how the submarkets work, they update (recreate) their stocks at the beginning of the month (marked as out of date, nothing is yet replaced).
If the submarket is out of date, it will only update on player interaction (prior to you opening the market), thus what seemed to be "present", suddenly becomes "out of stock".

New version 1.3.0 will instantly show you the item is no longer available (intel becomes greyed out, you get text on the right saying it is no longer there).
Whenever you open HyperNET Board, all intel presented will be rechecked for availability.
As a rule of thumb, I reopen HyperNET (in 1.3.0) at the beginning of the month to see what's the current situation, and click "Refresh all".
I had no idea that market stock refreshment is tied to the beginning of every month and it is good to know.
Does it not get greyed out if the same stock is being seeded again into current month's submarket roster? Based on your explanation (getting tagged and only refreshed when the player visits the market) I guess that it gets grayed out anyway.

- While every listing is accurate it usually is under a stupid submarket. Not sure about the reliability of commission or standing locked purchases but I do remember something I ended up not being able to buy and 100% sure about Cabal hiccups (this submarket is locked behind a fee for every visit).
There was a bug few versions ago which caused inclusion of submarkets to which the player had no access.
That was fixed a version later but I introduced another bug, which removed a lot of valid submarkets as a result.
This is now fixed in the new version (1.3.0) where ALL submarkets are shows, but there is a check whether item/ship can be purchased.
If not, appropriate text will be shown - if you find this to be inaccurate, please report (screenshot of intel + submarket in question).
Will do. Might be fine, since I've already seen some generic text about me not being able to buy said stuff, nothing specific though.
Detailed info on it would be appreciated. Do I need more standing? Credits? Leprechaun luck? Something else?

- Freezes the game. Like a lot. Performance impact is noticable with about 3-4 queries and don't you dare set 18+. I have no idea why selecting the query menu causes a lag, because it's dead certain the queries are not updated on the display because every time I need to do that manually with the button and most hits disappear.
I will have to investigate this - what are your specs? What causes freezes (opening intel, during campaign/when travelling, clicking "New Query" or some other button)?How many faction mods do you use?
What is your heap size (I assume you did follow the guide to increase heap size since you play modded)?
I could see this causing stutters / freezes if your heap size is too small.
At that moment I think I had Blackrock Drive Yards, Interstellar Imperium, Mayasuran Navy, Pearson Exotronics, Roider Union and Tiandong Industries. With Nexerelin they increased complexity by an awful lot so I dropped that and swapped out a few factions and the only noticable performance impact right now is game startup time.
Specs are Ryzen 5 2600, Geforce GTX 1660 Ti, 32GB dual channel RAM, 1TB SSD on SATA connector, auto-updating Windows 10 that annoys me to no end
Heap size IIRC is set to 2GB min and 6 GB max. Maybe 8, who knows. Funny story: made a few modded runs previously with no performance impact at all before I found out that it should be increased and not handled automatically. Also wasn't easy to bump into that old post that contained this info.
If I'm not mistaken opening the intel screen in general was in tandem with the game being unresponsive for a few seconds. Not sure about the inventory or using jump points, vanilla game tends to mess with that on its own after a few hours of playing anyway. Can't resist to bash on java, because it's a mess.

Edit:I did find out a refresh (of all queries) whenever the board was displayed (effectively making Refresh All / Refresh button redundant).
I have removed that call, so performance out of the box will be better in 1.3.1 which is now released.
I intentionally made this mod script-free (it does not `addScript`, so it is not evaluated every frame), but there is some magic happening when opening the board.
I will look into reducing the load and optimising performance if possible.
Very nice! Appealing policies not respected by most modders (and even programmers).

- Cannot query for any ship in the game. I know it's there, I used it before. I still want to make a query for it and keep an eye on that ship. Some special variants from mods are searchable though, even with no result popping up (probably no chance either to find one but still searchable).
That's intentional to avoid spoilers. The way cargo and ship picker works, it looks at all submarkets and builds a list of available hulls.
So until item X (or ship X) is present in at least one submarket it will not be included.
I will look into changing this, perhaps show everything that is not hidden in Codex?

Knew it! I had a hunch about this as the roster of searchable ships is ever changing. Codex based availability indeed makes sense and it's a clever idea.

Edit 2: Released 1.3.1 with small optimisation improvement.
Amazing! I love how everything you make in this mod fits right in the game as it was a core function.
The in-game notification about new month is brilliant.
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2020, 02:27:19 AM »

Just to avoid confusions, 2 definitions:
QUERY is the heart of this mod, it is what you are building (via dialog interation), holds state (enabled, stale, etc) and SUBJECT being looked up,
BOARD is the main HyperNET board that controls QUERIES,
INTEL is the result of a QUERY search, and
SUBJECT is what the query is searching for (Light Mortar, Wolf-class frigate, or steady officer)

I had no idea that market stock refreshment is tied to the beginning of every month and it is good to know.
Does it not get greyed out if the same stock is being seeded again into current month's submarket roster? Based on your explanation (getting tagged and only refreshed when the player visits the market) I guess that it gets grayed out anyway.
Will do. Might be fine, since I've already seen some generic text about me not being able to buy said stuff, nothing specific though.
Detailed info on it would be appreciated. Do I need more standing? Credits? Leprechaun luck? Something else?

Yes, in 1.3+ the INTEL greys out if you either can't acquire it, or the SUBJECT is no longer present.
In 1.4.0 the QUERY will grey out as well (if it's either disabled or results are stale).
It is impossible to tell what you are missing, the access to the submarket is gated behind a logic in a method.
For Military Submarkets you need commission and reputation, for custom markets it all depends on that method (e.g. Tiandong you need a one off fee but for Exalted you need to pay a fee each time).
In 1.5.0 I will improve INTEL description, so you will know more about the SUBJECT (how many, in which submarkets) which should ease the problem a little.

At that moment I think I had Blackrock Drive Yards, Interstellar Imperium, Mayasuran Navy, Pearson Exotronics, Roider Union and Tiandong Industries. With Nexerelin they increased complexity by an awful lot so I dropped that and swapped out a few factions and the only noticable performance impact right now is game startup time.
Specs are Ryzen 5 2600, Geforce GTX 1660 Ti, 32GB dual channel RAM, 1TB SSD on SATA connector, auto-updating Windows 10 that annoys me to no end
Heap size IIRC is set to 2GB min and 6 GB max. Maybe 8, who knows. Funny story: made a few modded runs previously with no performance impact at all before I found out that it should be increased and not handled automatically. Also wasn't easy to bump into that old post that contained this info.
If I'm not mistaken opening the intel screen in general was in tandem with the game being unresponsive for a few seconds. Not sure about the inventory or using jump points, vanilla game tends to mess with that on its own after a few hours of playing anyway. Can't resist to bash on java, because it's a mess.

If so, then this is now solved (as of 1.3.1) - this mod does nothing unless you press a button.
Actually it does display two intels before and on months end, but the performance hit due to that is neglible.

Knew it! I had a hunch about this as the roster of searchable ships is ever changing. Codex based availability indeed makes sense and it's a clever idea.
Amazing! I love how everything you make in this mod fits right in the game as it was a core function.
The in-game notification about new month is brilliant.

Glad you like it. Codex based availability will come next version.
Have a look at freshly released 1.4.0 - I revisited the BOARD and simplified it considerably.
Also added better stalenes indication (as well as grayed out disabled to reduce cognition noise).
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2020, 12:29:20 PM »

Just to avoid confusions, 2 definitions:
QUERY is the heart of this mod, it is what you are building (via dialog interation), holds state (enabled, stale, etc) and SUBJECT being looked up,
BOARD is the main HyperNET board that controls QUERIES,
INTEL is the result of a QUERY search, and
SUBJECT is what the query is searching for (Light Mortar, Wolf-class frigate, or steady officer)

I had no idea that market stock refreshment is tied to the beginning of every month and it is good to know.
Does it not get greyed out if the same stock is being seeded again into current month's submarket roster? Based on your explanation (getting tagged and only refreshed when the player visits the market) I guess that it gets grayed out anyway.
Will do. Might be fine, since I've already seen some generic text about me not being able to buy said stuff, nothing specific though.
Detailed info on it would be appreciated. Do I need more standing? Credits? Leprechaun luck? Something else?

Yes, in 1.3+ the INTEL greys out if you either can't acquire it, or the SUBJECT is no longer present.
In 1.4.0 the QUERY will grey out as well (if it's either disabled or results are stale).
It is impossible to tell what you are missing, the access to the submarket is gated behind a logic in a method.
For Military Submarkets you need commission and reputation, for custom markets it all depends on that method (e.g. Tiandong you need a one off fee but for Exalted you need to pay a fee each time).
In 1.5.0 I will improve INTEL description, so you will know more about the SUBJECT (how many, in which submarkets) which should ease the problem a little.

At that moment I think I had Blackrock Drive Yards, Interstellar Imperium, Mayasuran Navy, Pearson Exotronics, Roider Union and Tiandong Industries. With Nexerelin they increased complexity by an awful lot so I dropped that and swapped out a few factions and the only noticable performance impact right now is game startup time.
Specs are Ryzen 5 2600, Geforce GTX 1660 Ti, 32GB dual channel RAM, 1TB SSD on SATA connector, auto-updating Windows 10 that annoys me to no end
Heap size IIRC is set to 2GB min and 6 GB max. Maybe 8, who knows. Funny story: made a few modded runs previously with no performance impact at all before I found out that it should be increased and not handled automatically. Also wasn't easy to bump into that old post that contained this info.
If I'm not mistaken opening the intel screen in general was in tandem with the game being unresponsive for a few seconds. Not sure about the inventory or using jump points, vanilla game tends to mess with that on its own after a few hours of playing anyway. Can't resist to bash on java, because it's a mess.

If so, then this is now solved (as of 1.3.1) - this mod does nothing unless you press a button.
Actually it does display two intels before and on months end, but the performance hit due to that is neglible.

Knew it! I had a hunch about this as the roster of searchable ships is ever changing. Codex based availability indeed makes sense and it's a clever idea.
Amazing! I love how everything you make in this mod fits right in the game as it was a core function.
The in-game notification about new month is brilliant.

Glad you like it. Codex based availability will come next version.
Have a look at freshly released 1.4.0 - I revisited the BOARD and simplified it considerably.
Also added better stalenes indication (as well as grayed out disabled to reduce cognition noise).

Just as you said I've seen no performance impact in 1.3.1, the board indeed just opens and does not refresh queries.
Going to look at the new version soon.
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IonDragonX

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #24 on: November 09, 2020, 04:10:58 PM »

Been having a blast with this mod for weeks! Thank you!

Also, can you add a search for shortages & surpluses of trade goods?
« Last Edit: November 09, 2020, 06:46:46 PM by IonDragonX »
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #25 on: November 10, 2020, 01:04:12 AM »

@Szasz: Good to hear, how does the 1.4.0 (new UI specifically) feel?

@IonDragonX: You're welcome! As for shortages & surpluses - yes, that's a great idea. I have run some visualisations already, and most likely will add another intel tab (Economic View) with a new board (left column a list of markets with shortages and surpluses, right column a filter buttons like in Stellar Logistics). Expect this for 1.6.0 (Codex based intel selection will be pushed down, sorry).

Edit: I have thought more about this, and it will be a new mini-mod (like this or Stellar Logistics) - "Commodity Exchange - economy services for Starsector". Here are some ambitious ideas for the new mod:

Basic: Mod will let you view surplus / shortage of commodities.
Basic: Mod will let you check low/high for given commodities
Optional (certain): Mod will let you purchase and sell commodities remotely (e.g. buys to storage and sells from storage).
Optional (unlikely): Allow short positions - sell commodities you don't have (so you are at -X), having to repurchase them back at a given time (to be at 0 again).


In the meantime, here's the sneak-peek of 1.5.0 main feature (new intel descriptions):
« Last Edit: November 10, 2020, 02:02:26 PM by Jaghaimo »
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IonDragonX

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #26 on: November 10, 2020, 09:11:54 PM »

Edit: I have thought more about this, and it will be a new mini-mod (like this or Stellar Logistics) - "Commodity Exchange - economy services for Starsector". Here are some ambitious ideas for the new mod:
Yes!  ;D  Sooo excited!! The names should probably sound more cohesive, tho. HyperNet Search / HyperNet Logistics / HyperNet ComEx

Quote from: Jaghaimo
Basic: Mod will let you view surplus / shortage of commodities.
Basic: Mod will let you check low/high for given commodities
This is it exactly! Don't forget to filter out markets that the player has no access to through the Comm Relays.

Quote from: Jaghaimo
Optional (certain): Mod will let you purchase and sell commodities remotely (e.g. buys to storage and sells from storage).
I trust that there would be a strict requirement? Perhaps a high rep with the Quartermaster? It seems almost OP if its too easy. Would you be able to purchase the storage remotely as well?

Quote from: Jaghaimo
Optional (unlikely): Allow short positions - sell commodities you don't have (so you are at -X), having to repurchase them back at a given time (to be at 0 again).
To me, that kind of power to the player is too much. I'm glad those are optional. I'd rather see the merchants declare short selling as illegal.

Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2020, 12:45:41 AM »

@IonDragonX: I've created a thread for the new mod: https://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=19383.0

Edit: Version 1.5.0 is out - new small intel description and tiny board improvement.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2020, 12:53:38 PM by Jaghaimo »
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.4.0 - information services
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2020, 10:01:57 AM »

@Szasz: Good to hear, how does the 1.4.0 (new UI specifically) feel?

Not sure what changed but at least I can tell that it does not get in the way, because I can't remember being impeded by HyperNET UI.
Performance is also great.

Got very excited on 1.5 preview, those details seem incredibly useful.

edit: was thinking about your other mod that got its request cargo button changed smaller and more out of reach
« Last Edit: November 16, 2020, 10:43:09 AM by Szasz »
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Jaghaimo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hyperspace Network 1.5.0 - information services
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2020, 01:33:27 PM »

was thinking about your other mod that got its request cargo button changed smaller and more out of reach

Which one: small intel (pertaining storage / market) or large intel (board)? I don't think any button changed recently - board one is always at the bottom right, small intel always under the list of items/ships.

Also, when you wrote your reply 1.5 was already released - grab it if you missed it :)
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