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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: [0.95.1a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.17rc1 (2023/01/08)  (Read 285730 times)

Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #60 on: May 11, 2021, 03:54:50 AM »

Bonnethead (LP) needs a buff? Seriously, I can't find a reason to use LP version over a normal one with SO even when restored. (no assault chainguns, 25 vs 23 DP, 25 less OP with SO, very limited missile supply, same ship system... or maybe I'm just missing something very obvious hidden in plain sight)
I don't find LP ships that enjoyable to fight in general, and I don't think they should be competitive with non LP variants. Also Pathers barely use any midline combat ships (I think the Brawler is the only one?) so I'm actually closer to remove that ship rather than buff it.

The balance seems a little off vs. vanilla... the mining pike in particular is just absolute murder against anything unlucky enough to have its shields down. The excellent range, ROF, damage, and projectile speed means anything Destroyer-sized or smaller (not to mention low-end Cruisers) dies within seconds, the damage output quickly overcoming the fragmentation penalty vs. armor. It's also available early and fairly common. Definitely something to either get a good nerf or could potentially get bumped to Large size and have an interesting niche as a capital-ship weapon designed to quickly dispatch enemy escorts.
I don't know, I never felt the Mining pike was that off in term of balance. Yes it can accurately hit small targets, but the charge won't stick if they have a high enough acceleration, and shields block the explosion too. Overall, I always seen it as a very good early game weapon to poke holes into pirate ships, but its efficiency quickly falls off compared to other 10 OP weapons when you start facing stronger ships with better armor and shields.

If other concur with your opinion though, I could see bumping the OP cost up a little, and the flux efficiency down.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2021, 04:00:08 AM by Tartiflette »
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Helldiver

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #61 on: May 19, 2021, 09:27:35 PM »

I have been observing an issue with the Niagara-class though I am not sure if this mod is directly responsible. For some reason, large Luddic Church fleets (such as invasion fleets in Nex) have almost nothing but Niagaras as capital ships. Other capitals are made extinct by this (for example LC capitals added by the Luddic Enhancement mod). With TADA disabled other captials are back to being found in LC fleets.

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Arcagnello

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #62 on: May 30, 2021, 06:20:53 AM »

To @Tartifette

I don't think Luddic Path needs to have purposefully gimped versions of ships. The fact Path has a really limited set of weapons to fit into ships which usually come with a plethora of D-mods and most notably Ill Advised Modifications are more than enough to make them perform worse than most if not all factions in the base game.

I fully agree on Path not having access to almost no Midline ships tough, I think the only two these Ludd For Brains Fanatics use in Vanilla are the Brawler and (maybe) the Overridden Hammerhead?
Removing the reskin of the ship would be a waste in my opinion, I would instead overhaul it to be radically different than the original instead; a brief and poorly thought out example:

DP increase stays, the ship gets the same OP as the original, the weapon mount modifications stay the same and the ship gets a different, more low tech oriented ship system like Damper Field.

I will admit I have not tried refitting the LP variant of the Bonnethead yet, but it really looks too gimped for its own good when taking furl's feedback to heart. I'll try it as soon as I can either produce it or recover it from a Luddic Path armada unfortunate enough to meet me on a bad day  ;)

Edit: Now, I know I said Path should not have access to more Midline ships, but the Owl really screams "Override me and give me Assault Chainguns and Heavy Machineguns" every time I see it buzzing around in the battlefield.

Keeping with the "DowngradeHaul" you could apply even further to the LP Bonnethead, this theoretical Owl (LP) would be 3 DP more expensive than the normal one, possibly slightly worse base flux stats and shield ratio, Integrated Safety Overrides (and maybe Ill Advised Modifications, despite the Dmod more or less butchering ship performance) and some changes to the ship fighter bays and ship system:
I would increase the number of fighter bays from 2 to 3 but I would also give it the same integrated hullmod nerfing them as the Colossus Mk3 (what was sit called, malformed fighter Autoforge or something?) and I would also change the current ship ability to Burn Drive, especially now that Alex confirmed it's going to go back to being cancellable again in his most recent blog post.

It could alternatively get Integrated Unstable Injector instead of Safety Overrides (and maybe no ill Advised Modifications) to give both Path and Player a more varied set of choices to refit it. This would take a page from the Luddic Path variant of the Tyrant Battlecruiser from Vayra's ship pack, altough that one still gets Ill Advised Modifications.

Thoughts? I love the mod by the way, I got two Heralds in my current fleet and they're amazing  :)

Edit 2: Is the 12 Ordinance Points "Broadsword Mk.II" from this mod by the way? I've got a feeling that only making a Broadsword 4OP more expensive despite getting two Swarmer SRMs per fighter is a bit too little. Having it cost something like 13 or even 14 OP would be a lot more in line with the massive power spike of the fighter craft that now has both an anti fighter weapon and a source of HE damage to melt enemy ship armor with.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 02:23:37 PM by Arcagnello »
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DownTheDrain

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #63 on: May 30, 2021, 08:36:33 AM »

Broadsword Mk.II

That's from the Missing Ships mod, unless there are multiple Mk.II...
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Arcagnello

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #64 on: May 30, 2021, 09:28:36 AM »

Broadsword Mk.II

That's from the Missing Ships mod, unless there are multiple Mk.II...

There probably are as many Broadswords Mk 2s as there are Onslaught Reskins in the modiverse, but I've just checked and this particular fighter LPC indeed IS from the Missing Ships mod! Thanks  :)
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Drone_Fragger

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #65 on: May 31, 2021, 02:20:08 PM »

Cassicus is fun but uh, I wonder if it has too many smart flare points? It shoots like 15 flares at once every time it uses them. Even the apogee only launches 7, I think.
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #66 on: June 01, 2021, 11:41:19 PM »

On the other hand it's slow and vulnerable compared to other High Tech ships, so a strong system felt needed.
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Helldiver

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #67 on: June 03, 2021, 07:48:31 PM »

On the other hand it's slow and vulnerable compared to other High Tech ships, so a strong system felt needed.

Agree. It having all these active flares gives it a special feel and makes its defensive nature very clear.
It also helps make it one of the very few destroyers in the game that can succesfully act as a dedicated PD escort. Destroyers are usually unable to perform in that role as the low range boost from DD-grade ITU and lack of turreted large non-missile mounts results in inadequate range on most PD options, and PD range is what you need when covering allies.
The Cassicus on the other hand can take advantage of its large energy turret mount to mount a Paladin boosted by Advanced Optics' flat range increase. Combined with the rains of active flares, I've found it to be the only high-tech ship below cruiser size that bests the Omen as an AI escort to larger ships.
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Nuggnugg

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #68 on: June 07, 2021, 05:41:16 AM »

Can this be added to an ongoing save/game?
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #69 on: June 07, 2021, 11:06:37 AM »

For the most part yes: after a while the ships should show up in fleets that uses them. You won't find any abandoned wreck while exploring though, but that shouldn't be a huge deal.
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Timid

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #70 on: July 03, 2021, 06:56:23 PM »

TADA_gunwall_XIV seems to be not in the XIV_bp...

Superharem

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #71 on: July 05, 2021, 08:43:38 PM »

Just wanna say that your mods are awesome and I use all 5 of them.
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #72 on: July 05, 2021, 11:30:48 PM »

TADA_gunwall_XIV seems to be not in the XIV_bp...
Neither is the Legion XIVth, same deal for both these ships.

Just wanna say that your mods are awesome and I use all 5 of them.
Thanks!
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Nukacolared

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #73 on: October 25, 2021, 10:05:13 AM »

Hello. I have a question or two.

I was wondering if this mod and your other mod "Seeker" were compatible? I saw that on an older post it said something about them being a little wonky if used together. I was unsure what that all meant and to how significant of an incompatibility it is. I was also curious if that is still the case or if they work completely fine together now. And if they were incompatible, would their be anything I would have to do to make them work together as normally as possible?

One more question.

I am new to Starsector modding. I was curious if mods like "Seeker" would be compatible with other mods that add ships such as "Tahlan Shipworks"? I was just curious if there was some rule of thumb for which mods might not work together. For instance I know that mods that alter the same files will not work together (in a lot of mods, Fallout, Sins of a Solar Empire, Stellaris, etc.), so I was curious if there is something like that to follow as a basic measure. From what I can tell, these two mods mainly add ships and ones like "Seeker" add in quest chains, so I didn't know if there would be any major reason why the various ship mods might not work?

Sorry for the long text. Thank you for reading all of it if you have.
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Ruddygreat

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Re: [0.95a] Torchships And Deadly Armaments V0.16rc2 (2021/04/11)
« Reply #74 on: October 25, 2021, 12:23:14 PM »

Hello. I have a question or two.

I was wondering if this mod and your other mod "Seeker" were compatible? I saw that on an older post it said something about them being a little wonky if used together. I was unsure what that all meant and to how significant of an incompatibility it is. I was also curious if that is still the case or if they work completely fine together now. And if they were incompatible, would their be anything I would have to do to make them work together as normally as possible?

One more question.

I am new to Starsector modding. I was curious if mods like "Seeker" would be compatible with other mods that add ships such as "Tahlan Shipworks"? I was just curious if there was some rule of thumb for which mods might not work together. For instance I know that mods that alter the same files will not work together (in a lot of mods, Fallout, Sins of a Solar Empire, Stellaris, etc.), so I was curious if there is something like that to follow as a basic measure. From what I can tell, these two mods mainly add ships and ones like "Seeker" add in quest chains, so I didn't know if there would be any major reason why the various ship mods might not work?

Sorry for the long text. Thank you for reading all of it if you have.

unless otherwise specified on the mod page, it's safe to assume that all mods work with eachother
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