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Author Topic: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.1)  (Read 434235 times)

A_Random_Dude

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1515 on: November 30, 2021, 04:33:50 AM »

Hi!

So, I recently started modding my game and came accross this mod and another one, DIY Planets. You said that both mods were compatible if I turned off the terraforming options of your mod. Problem is, I find both mods to be very interesting, each adding things that the other doesn't have (for example, yours can remove some conditons given by Unknown Skies while DIY lets me create brown dwarves and planets). So, my question would be: is it possible to make both of mods compatible by removing redundant terraforming options in the data folders? Would be a shame to have to choose between the two.

Also, since you recently added an industry that removes radiations from a planet, I wanted to know if your mod was still compatible with Shadowyard (heard they had that option too, but a bug prevents us from building their industry).
« Last Edit: November 30, 2021, 06:53:57 AM by A_Random_Dude »
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1516 on: November 30, 2021, 08:19:58 AM »

Hi!

So, I recently started modding my game and came accross this mod and another one, DIY Planets. You said that both mods were compatible if I turned off the terraforming options of your mod. Problem is, I find both mods to be very interesting, each adding things that the other doesn't have (for example, yours can remove some conditons given by Unknown Skies while DIY lets me create brown dwarves and planets). So, my question would be: is it possible to make both of mods compatible by removing redundant terraforming options in the data folders? Would be a shame to have to choose between the two.

Also, since you recently added an industry that removes radiations from a planet, I wanted to know if your mod was still compatible with Shadowyard (heard they had that option too, but a bug prevents us from building their industry).

You could edit the rules.csv file to easily disable the terraforming menu when you interact with your colonies, but it would require substantial editing of the source code to add or remove individual terraforming projects.

I'm not familiar with the Shadowyard radiation removal feature. I'll look into this and add a note to compatibility section when I release my next patch. Thanks for letting me know about this!
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Ruddygreat

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1517 on: November 30, 2021, 01:42:22 PM »

I'm not familiar with the Shadowyard radiation removal feature. I'll look into this and add a note to compatibility section when I release my next patch. Thanks for letting me know about this!

iirc shadowyard's radiation removal thing is an old relic from before buildings could be completely hidden from the player, they're supposed to be limited to one of their planets (and have an insane cost + upkeep to prevent players from using them)
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1518 on: November 30, 2021, 05:37:32 PM »

I'm not familiar with the Shadowyard radiation removal feature. I'll look into this and add a note to compatibility section when I release my next patch. Thanks for letting me know about this!

iirc shadowyard's radiation removal thing is an old relic from before buildings could be completely hidden from the player, they're supposed to be limited to one of their planets (and have an insane cost + upkeep to prevent players from using them)

Ok, I suppose there's no conflict then, since the player shouldn't be using the Shadowyards building anyway. Thanks!
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A_Random_Dude

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1519 on: December 01, 2021, 01:02:58 AM »

Quote
You could edit the rules.csv file to easily disable the terraforming menu when you interact with your colonies, but it would require substantial editing of the source code to add or remove individual terraforming projects.

I see. This got me wondering though: when you talk about "the source code", does it include having to edit the jar file too, or can I just edit the files in the data folder and expect everything to be fine? I'm a total newbie, so I don't think I'd be able to do anything aside from removing a few lines of text, to be honest.

Quote
iirc shadowyard's radiation removal thing is an old relic from before buildings could be completely hidden from the player, they're supposed to be limited to one of their planets (and have an insane cost + upkeep to prevent players from using them)

Ah, my bad then! Makes much more sense said like that. Thanks!
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1520 on: December 01, 2021, 06:53:16 AM »

Quote
You could edit the rules.csv file to easily disable the terraforming menu when you interact with your colonies, but it would require substantial editing of the source code to add or remove individual terraforming projects.

I see. This got me wondering though: when you talk about "the source code", does it include having to edit the jar file too, or can I just edit the files in the data folder and expect everything to be fine? I'm a total newbie, so I don't think I'd be able to do anything aside from removing a few lines of text, to be honest.


I think editing the rules.csv file would be sufficient to remove projects. You would need to edit the jar file to add projects or modify the requirements.

Be warned that rules.csv is not easy to work with!
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A_Random_Dude

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1521 on: December 01, 2021, 07:29:14 AM »

Ok thanks, I'll see what I can do with it then!

Ah, and good luck with your next patch!
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Uhlang

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1522 on: December 03, 2021, 04:08:49 PM »

Ignore my comment about the inactive gate construction. I automatically assumed it worked like your previous venture in gates and expected it to be an ability, and I only now noticed the text saying that it's something you do at stable locations. My bad.

That aside, I noticed that Stellar Reflectors no longer demand Domain-Era Artifacts. Is this intentional? Because it makes an already dubiously useful industry(Domain Archeology) even less useful by 1. Stopping it from being an alternative to importing DEA from Agreus (at least when dabbling in terraforming, I mean, you'll still want it for Chameleons and Kletkas) and 2. Removing what little profit it brought by selling DEA to Eochu Bres and Eventide.
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1523 on: December 03, 2021, 05:05:03 PM »

That aside, I noticed that Stellar Reflectors no longer demand Domain-Era Artifacts. Is this intentional? Because it makes an already dubiously useful industry(Domain Archeology) even less useful by 1. Stopping it from being an alternative to importing DEA from Agreus (at least when dabbling in terraforming, I mean, you'll still want it for Chameleons and Kletkas) and 2. Removing what little profit it brought by selling DEA to Eochu Bres and Eventide.

Yes, I removed the DEA requirement on stellar reflectors as part of my efforts to reduce complexity. The player still needs to build Domain Archaeology since Agreus can only supply four DEA, and the Genelab and CHAMELEON will demand six at maximum colony size.

You're right about the issue where no NPC markets demand DEA anymore. I'm going to look into ways to remedy this - perhaps colony-specific buildings (like the cryosanctum on Nomios) that demand them is a good solution. If I can't think of any ideas for colony-specific buildings, I'll probably just reinstate the DEA demand for stellar reflectors. Thanks for your feedback!
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Uhlang

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1524 on: December 05, 2021, 06:04:08 PM »

I just built a Genelab on a polluted world that I temporarily took over because of a conquest mission and now my Domain Archeology is bringing in a bit of profit.

It's not an efficient way to increase DEA profits, but it reminded me of something similar: Fusion Lamp market manipulation.
You can increase your volatiles profit by selling Fusion Lamps to cold and/or dark worlds. They instantly install it and increase global demand, and this made me wonder if something like that could be done with DEA.

What if your reflectors were turned into items that worked like Fusion Lamps, but demanded DEA instead? Assuming there was a reliable way to get them — such as crafting them in the terraforming menu using DEA and other things — you could sell them to hot/cold/farming colonies to make Domain Archeology profitable while also opening up the structure slot in your own terraformed colonies(I know that's not much of an issue with Hartley's Grand Colonies, but still.)
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1525 on: December 06, 2021, 08:04:35 AM »

I just built a Genelab on a polluted world that I temporarily took over because of a conquest mission and now my Domain Archeology is bringing in a bit of profit.

It's not an efficient way to increase DEA profits, but it reminded me of something similar: Fusion Lamp market manipulation.
You can increase your volatiles profit by selling Fusion Lamps to cold and/or dark worlds. They instantly install it and increase global demand, and this made me wonder if something like that could be done with DEA.

What if your reflectors were turned into items that worked like Fusion Lamps, but demanded DEA instead? Assuming there was a reliable way to get them — such as crafting them in the terraforming menu using DEA and other things — you could sell them to hot/cold/farming colonies to make Domain Archeology profitable while also opening up the structure slot in your own terraformed colonies(I know that's not much of an issue with Hartley's Grand Colonies, but still.)

That's an interesting idea! The problem is I can't overwrite the default farming and/or population buildings to accept a custom special item. Even if I could, players might not realize selling a special item to an NPC colony will cause them to install it (I certainly didn't until you told me about it).

I like the concept of crafting special items using DEA. That could allow the player to obtain exactly what they want without having to leave the core to salvage. I don't want to duplicate the functionality of the historian, so I'll have to look into whether they can give the player locations of special items, or if it's just blueprints.
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A_Random_Dude

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1526 on: December 06, 2021, 08:41:43 AM »

Quote
I like the concept of crafting special items using DEA. That could allow the player to obtain exactly what they want without having to leave the core to salvage. I don't want to duplicate the functionality of the historian, so I'll have to look into whether they can give the player locations of special items, or if it's just blueprints.

They apparently can. Heard of someone getting a synchrotron location from them, there are also cases where they give you the location of special items from Industrial Evolution.
If that makes it a problem, I was thinking about something: instead of giving the DEA the ability to outright create a special item, wouldn't it be better to add some sort of special abandonned station location to the historian quests rewards, which would require a DEA to successfully operate reactivate and produce special items in exchange for ressources? That could solve the problem in my opinion.

Edit: changed "items that can produce/be transformed into a specific special item (probably unfeasable)" to "abandonned station that can produce special items (probably way better)".
« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 09:03:32 AM by A_Random_Dude »
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boggled

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1528 on: December 06, 2021, 09:03:39 AM »

The Historian's already to RNG for my tastes as-is, no thanks!

True enough. Seems like the ability to craft whatever the player wants would be popular.

They apparently can. Heard of someone getting a synchrotron location from them, there are also cases where they give you the location of special items from Industrial Evolution.

Synchrotron cores and nanoforges are pretty easy to get because the player can steal them by raiding core worlds colonies. I'm talking about the new special items (ex. fusion lamp, mantle bore, etc.) which I believe can only be found through RNG salvaging.

If that makes it a problem, I was thinking about something: instead of giving the DEA the ability to outright create a special item, wouldn't it be better to add an other item (something similar to a nanoforge, but for special items and single/limited use) to the historian quests rewards, which would require a DEA to successfully operate? That could solve the problem in my opinion.

You mean an industry kind of like the Kletka Simulator, but for special items? That might work, although I don't think it would make sense to put it on NPC colonies to create demand for DEA. From a lore standpoint, why would NPC colonies have a factory to build special items but not have any installed in their buildings?
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Uhlang

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Re: [0.95a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v8.0.0)
« Reply #1529 on: December 06, 2021, 09:09:08 AM »

The problem is I can't overwrite the default farming and/or population buildings to accept a custom special item.

The Relay Hypertransmitters added by Industrial Evolution can be installed in vanilla Military Bases/High Commands, so unless Hartley did something outrageous there, it's doable.
Unless you mean that you'd just prefer to avoid tinkering with vanilla industries, in which case: I can respect that.

I don't want to duplicate the functionality of the historian, so I'll have to look into whether they can give the player locations of special items, or if it's just blueprints.

My historians offered me the locations of special items a good bunch of times(and not just ones you can get by raiding core worlds). Some problems with that, though:
-You first need to give them all the donations they ask for
-If your playstyle leans towards exploration(like mine), by the time you give them the donations and meet them again, there's a good chance that you'll already have the special item they'll offer directions to
-It costs a whole 4 story points, which again isn't worth it if you tend to explore everything
So yeah, provided it's sufficiently demanding, I'd say that a DEA-based special item crafting system would have its place.
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