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Author Topic: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids  (Read 6864 times)

roofiodude

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Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« on: September 17, 2019, 09:39:58 AM »

Hi I`m new to the game and have a little problem here:
My small star kingdom is doing fairly well, except my first to colonized systems are under a constant pirate siege that never ends. I destroyed the bases, but there are still ships coming in from the same systems plus raids. It is a neverending stream of ships. My systems look like a Warzone, seriously.
And since I do not find anyone in the bars to tell me the location of the pirate stations, they remain invisible within those two star systems.
Meh.
Any help appreciated.
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Kos135

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2019, 11:07:28 AM »

I'm relatively new to the game as well (picked it up after Sseth's review) and I can confirm that pirates are a huge issue. They're like bedbugs, it's nearly impossible to keep your systems free of them. I think their fleets get way too powerful (I've seen pirate fleets with 8 Atlas Mk. 2's, their capital ship) and way too numerous, and as you've said the time between destroying their bases and new bases spawning is too short. It also doesn't help that the main factions don't launch expeditions against pirate bases themselves, they only put up bounties for them and wait for the player to do it.

The solutions are obvious, make it so the main factions launch expeditions against pirate/LP bases just like they do with player colonies. Nerf the pirate fleets so you don't encounter 8 fleets with 8 capital ships all clustered together. Extend the time between a pirate base being destroyed and a new base popping up.

In the mean time, the answer is patrols and ground defenses. Erect heavy batteries on all your planets and at the very least build a patrol HQ on each planet (the upgrades to the patrol HQ cost an industry slot so it's up to you if you want the basic structure or a high command, I would recommend at least one high command per star system). Don't forget to build orbital stations either, those are crucial to colony defense. If you don't have this stuff set up yet then you'll need to play babysitter for a while.
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Eji1700

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2019, 12:03:47 PM »

I'm relatively new to the game as well (picked it up after Sseth's review) and I can confirm that pirates are a huge issue. They're like bedbugs, it's nearly impossible to keep your systems free of them. I think their fleets get way too powerful (I've seen pirate fleets with 8 Atlas Mk. 2's, their capital ship) and way too numerous, and as you've said the time between destroying their bases and new bases spawning is too short. It also doesn't help that the main factions don't launch expeditions against pirate bases themselves, they only put up bounties for them and wait for the player to do it.

The solutions are obvious, make it so the main factions launch expeditions against pirate/LP bases just like they do with player colonies. Nerf the pirate fleets so you don't encounter 8 fleets with 8 capital ships all clustered together. Extend the time between a pirate base being destroyed and a new base popping up.

In the mean time, the answer is patrols and ground defenses. Erect heavy batteries on all your planets and at the very least build a patrol HQ on each planet (the upgrades to the patrol HQ cost an industry slot so it's up to you if you want the basic structure or a high command, I would recommend at least one high command per star system). Don't forget to build orbital stations either, those are crucial to colony defense. If you don't have this stuff set up yet then you'll need to play babysitter for a while.

So 8 atlas is really not that strong.  For pirate ships you can usually count one of their ships as one tier down.  I routinely wipe out such fleets with a smaller (but better) fleet with only 2 capitals + some cruisers and destroyers (including gemini).  If you don't have a stronger fleet your best bet is to try to be in system when the raid starts (it does estimate when) and then engage just after they hit your starbase.  A level 1 + a decent fleet can hold off a lot (espeically since you can engage, land, repair, re engage as the fleets funnel in), and a level 2 + with fleet support can hold off most anything a pirate will throw at you.  I recommend setting two defend waypoints to the left and right of the station (so that it can't get encircled an any section that makes it halfway gets a chance to vent)

That said I think everyone agrees that pirate whack a mole isn't exactly fun, especially since you make a lot more early on playing whack a mole for other factions than your own.

Some of this should get better when you can finally send out fleets to kill pirates yourself (planned feature in some way I believe) but i'm also hoping that there's more scaling in general. 

We see pirate bases all over the core systems that haven't been wiped out, so there's a "presecne" but it's not crippling.  However our bases MUST spend time on pirate duty because they're constantly raiding otherwise.

I'm hoping a much more gradual ramp up (maybe based on pirate relations) becomes a thing so you could even have a pirate outpost in system (maybe makes free port better) but not hate the hit you take too much, vs the all or nothing of "perfect colony" to "pirate crater".  And this is before the factions start paying visits with absurd forces.
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Kos135

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2019, 12:19:21 PM »

Pirate ships are weak individually, the issue is the quantity. 8 Atlas Mk. 2's isn't a big deal for an end-game fleet, my Paragon 4x tachyon snipers can wipe them out no problem. But when you have several pirate fleets with several Atlas Mk. 2's each? That's a problem. And that's exactly what happens when you aren't constantly hunting down pirate bases.

In my current game 2 core worlds have already decivilized due to piracy. The core worlds don't settle planets or attack pirate/LP bases, it's only a matter of time before they go down. And if they go down, who will you trade with?
« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 12:27:30 PM by Kos135 »
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Eji1700

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2019, 01:55:55 PM »

Pirate ships are weak individually, the issue is the quantity. 8 Atlas Mk. 2's isn't a big deal for an end-game fleet, my Paragon 4x tachyon snipers can wipe them out no problem. But when you have several pirate fleets with several Atlas Mk. 2's each? That's a problem. And that's exactly what happens when you aren't constantly hunting down pirate bases.

In my current game 2 core worlds have already decivilized due to piracy. The core worlds don't settle planets or attack pirate/LP bases, it's only a matter of time before they go down. And if they go down, who will you trade with?
What in game date are you on/mods are you running and which worlds? I've literally never seen a core world go out due to pirate activity in pure vanilla.

Further paragons are MASSIVE overkill for dealing with pirate fleets, and properly supported should be eating tons of them.  It is a problem that there's no easy way to stem the constant flow, but I'm surprised you're having this much trouble if you're already in a paragon.
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sotanaht

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2019, 02:16:37 PM »

In addition to generally slowing down pirate growth and rebuilding, giving you a longer period of peace in between whacking their moles, I think there should ultimately be a way to grow out of dealing with pirates entirely.  Either a way to wipe out pirates completely (which seems a little unrealistic and game-killing) or more likely, a way to fully automate the process of hunting them down, once your faction gets big enough to afford to do so.  Pirates are generally an early-mid game threat.  At late game they are an annoyance that should go away to make room for more interesting opponents.

In simplest form, the game could simply decide that pirates do not raid colonies with Star Fortresses, and no "pirate activity" penalty for systems with a colony with High Command.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 02:18:56 PM by sotanaht »
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Sapfearon

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2019, 06:23:10 PM »

He is right, pirates are broken right now. First, they are scripted to attack your colony in first 2 month. Probably before you finish your battlestation and patrol hq, thanks to new, longer build times. Second - pirate base spawn rate is INSANE. So, i decided to smack pirates, destroyed their base and what's the first thing i saw when i returned to my colony? PIRATE ACTIVITY. Again, bar, spacer, destoyed pirate base. Next month...Guess what? PIRATE ACTIVITY.
It's not that pirates are strong, they are mostly -1 stab but the spawn rate is insane. Same problem with Luddic path. They must be toned down to something more reasonable like 1 base per year or even 2 year. I'm okay with stronger raids tho. Thank Ludd this patch luddic path is just a -1stab if your colony is doing good.
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Alex

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2019, 06:27:59 PM »

(Just want to say, this is definitely on my radar for the next release.)
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Nerzhull_AI

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Re: Neverending Pirate Activity plus raids
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2019, 07:14:44 PM »

It's not that pirates are strong
Trade some conquest blueprints on black market, it will be so much fun.
Jokes aside, that's pretty much true. I rather have a more significant threat from a pirates/LP then constant need of throwing myself at their endlessly and quickly respawning bases. I'm not sure if it's truly connected, but trading blueprints to the black market resulted in most instances of "pirate activity" becoming -2stab -30%access or even -3 -40%. Had a bit of fun, tbh. But no such things with LP.
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