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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 351724 times)

Schwartz

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #705 on: May 29, 2019, 09:45:27 AM »

Feel free to give your opinion on fleet doctrine settings over here also.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #706 on: May 29, 2019, 10:26:45 AM »

With current priority settings and UI, I use ships for the fleets I want, but for weapons and fighters, I set priorities based on what I want my battlestation to use.  The reason is my fleets will autoresolve everything away or die trying, and I probably will not assist my fleets, except allow me to pursue-and-autoresolve the riff-raff away.  Battlestation, on the other hand, either I need to rely on it to fight the deathball my fleet cannot handle or I want to watch it utterly annihilate the enemy as quickly and painlessly as possible like a god-mode sue, and optimal loadout selected by priorities is more important here than for my fleets.
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Shoat

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #707 on: May 29, 2019, 11:23:29 AM »

Hmm - it would help to see some examples of what you're seeing, since you should be able to use the priority system to something like 99% control what you get. (The only case being the odd ship where there aren't enough fleet points left for anything on your priority list.)

For weapons/fighters, this is a bit trickier.

1) You'd need to do more than cover small/medium/large in each size. For example, if the game is looking to pick a torpedo, a long range weapon, a PD weapon, etc, it'll prefer one of that type over another type that you have prioritized that only matches the slot - so you'd need to pick a wider range of weapons.

2) You'd also you'd need to pick some lower-tier weapons (which is more difficult since IIRC the weapon "tier" is not displayed anywhere. Basically, if you only prioritize Plasma Cannons, the game's not going to put Plasma Cannons in every single large energy slot; higher-quality weapons are not always "available" for a given ship fit, so you need to have some lower-tier options selected as well or it'll fall back to "everything" when the better stuff isn't available.

Stations are an exception here, iirc, with everything being available regardless of tier - so in effect they adhere to priorities more easily/strictly. But overall, for weapons, you probably need to have a wider range of things prioritized than you might think.


For ships, it's harder to say, but again it's probably not having some types of things checked - such as, say, a carrier, a phase ship, a tanker, a freighter, a crew transport ship. To my knowledge, this should work and let you select what ships you want to see, with the exception of the aforementioned "not enough points left so it picks something cheaper", which should happen fairly infrequently.

Yes, you are right. I seem to have forgotten that there is also a fleet budget the faction uses and that having blueprints unlocked isn't everything.
The blueprint-theme I'm currently prioritizing is some modded "woo look at this spooky experimental high tech stuff" ships&equipment, which might reasonably be quite expensive on the budget.
And I did actually notice that the stations had a way higher accuracy to the selections I made than most of the fleets, so that further backs up the budget maybe being the issue.

I was fairly sure that the fleet creator has more categories than just the obvious ones (separating longrange support missiles, short range strike missiles and torpedoes for example) but those are sadly not always obvious for every single piece of equipment (especially modded ones whose tooltips can include a custom 'category', or which may be very odd edge-case things due to cool custom scripts).

Sidenote (prioritizing freighters): How does this treat ships marked as "combat freighter" such as for example the hound? Will those only take up slots that would normally be taken by civilian freighters or is there any danger that the fleets start replacing real warship-frigates with hounds?


In general I'd never say that the system isn't good and useable as-is (it obviously misbehaves a lot less in a pure vanilla game).
However, it would be nice to eventually have a simple blacklist checkmark for specific things at some point in the far-off future.

Oh, and my deus vult luddic path campaign has taught me two things:
a) I want someone to make a LP variant of the Cathedral Hubship
b) It would be very neat to have hullmods included in the fleet design interface alongside ships/weapons/fighters, to make sure everyone's got safety overrides active on every single ship at all times.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #708 on: May 29, 2019, 11:27:27 AM »

b) It would be very neat to have hullmods included in the fleet design interface alongside ships/weapons/fighters, to make sure everyone's got safety overrides active on every single ship at all times.
Augmented Engines and/or Militarized Subsystems to prevent Atlas and Prometheus from slowing down my fleets!
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #709 on: May 29, 2019, 12:19:00 PM »

Sidenote (prioritizing freighters): How does this treat ships marked as "combat freighter" such as for example the hound? Will those only take up slots that would normally be taken by civilian freighters or is there any danger that the fleets start replacing real warship-frigates with hounds?

Those get treated as combat ships, so unless you want to see them used as such, you don't want to prioritize them.

In general I'd never say that the system isn't good and useable as-is (it obviously misbehaves a lot less in a pure vanilla game).
However, it would be nice to eventually have a simple blacklist checkmark for specific things at some point in the far-off future.

The problem is it'd be easy to have the opposite issue - configuring things into a state where weapon/fighter slots are left empty (and certain ship groups lack any valid picks) due to a lack of usable options. Either way, one ends up needing to have more of an under-the-hood understanding to configure it properly to get the desired results. I think it makes sense to *want* to blacklist things, but I don't think it'd *actually* do the job.

Which, fair enough, if the game makes the player want to do something but that something wouldn't make a difference or w/e, is still an indicator of a possible issue. Ideally, the game would not make you want to do that in the first place.

b) It would be very neat to have hullmods included in the fleet design interface alongside ships/weapons/fighters, to make sure everyone's got safety overrides active on every single ship at all times.

I just don't want to get down to that level of detail with this - they're not your fleet's ships, they don't matter *that* much, and having deeper customization there would almost be misleading the player about the importance of what they're doing. It's a slippery slope where you end up manually configuring the loadouts of your faction fleet ships without a good reason; I'd just as soon stay as near the top of that as possible :) Basically, aside from the station, this is in good part cosmetic.

Augmented Engines and/or Militarized Subsystems to prevent Atlas and Prometheus from slowing down my fleets!

Along the same lines, yeah, not very keen on having this be something that you can minimax. It's just not important enough for that. The fleets being there *is* important, but the specifics on that level, not so much. The doctrine controls are about as detailed as I want to go there.


With current priority settings and UI, I use ships for the fleets I want, but for weapons and fighters, I set priorities based on what I want my battlestation to use.  The reason is my fleets will autoresolve everything away or die trying, and I probably will not assist my fleets, except allow me to pursue-and-autoresolve the riff-raff away.  Battlestation, on the other hand, either I need to rely on it to fight the deathball my fleet cannot handle or I want to watch it utterly annihilate the enemy as quickly and painlessly as possible like a god-mode sue, and optimal loadout selected by priorities is more important here than for my fleets.

Yep, makes perfect sense!
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Baqar79

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #710 on: May 29, 2019, 11:18:08 PM »

Just noticed that the Tarsus freighter is slightly cheaper than the Buffalo.  In earlier versions, the Buffalo had a +1 burn speed bonus, but since this is no longer the case, the Tarsus is pretty much superior to the buffalo with exception to it's speed (which it more than makes up for with burn drives).

The Tarsus is much more heavily armoured, has more OP and PD mounts....It doesn't seem that there is any good reason to choose the Buffalo over the Tarsus.

I think either the base price needs to increase, or perhaps nudge the maintenance up (3.5 or 4 at most), to show that it is a better version of the Buffalo.  Alternatively, maybe buff the buffalo a bit (if you keep the burn speeds the same, why not buff it's cargo capacity to 400, so you have a choice between robust, but lower capacity or fragile but higher capacity).  The same I guess could be achieved by slightly nerfing the Tarsus (reduce it's capacity to 250).
« Last Edit: May 29, 2019, 11:31:11 PM by Baqar79 »
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Legion0047

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #711 on: May 30, 2019, 03:19:28 AM »

So if people are already talking about infrastructure i'll add my own thoughts.

Open market should be free if you build the colony and Commerce as an industry should upgrade the market and give other benefits to be worth the industry slot.

Would it be possible to add a third level of the Ground defense building that would help in station battles.
As in lvl 3 is literially you building giant mass drivers and missile silos that have the required range to support the station with occasional shots and missile salvos drifting in from off map.

If you're literally grazing the sector like i do you quickly end up with dozens of corrupted and still far too many pristine nanoforges and a literal 100+ AI cores.

Also generaly to 9.1:
Colonies now take longer and are no longer instant wins but once you get one to grow once you've still more or less reached late game.
Atlas 2 spam sucks ass.
Love that you can now build proper forgeworlds without requiring a dozen Alpha cores to make it profitable(Yes i did that).
The industry slots now mean that you need multiple colonies to be at least partially specilised which is good.

Also, how big is an AI core in character/game?
« Last Edit: May 30, 2019, 06:00:16 AM by Legion0047 »
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ciago92

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #712 on: May 30, 2019, 09:22:00 AM »

I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere...is it intended that you can't upgrade Fleet HQ while at max industries? I was able to upgrade my Heavy Industry though. Didn't see anything explaining what was going on
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #713 on: May 30, 2019, 09:35:53 AM »

I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere...is it intended that you can't upgrade Fleet HQ while at max industries? I was able to upgrade my Heavy Industry though. Didn't see anything explaining what was going on
Patrol HQ is a structure, while its upgrades are industries.  If you at max Industries with Patrol HQ, you cannot upgrade unless you remove an Industry, or wait until colony grows and increases industry limit.
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #714 on: May 30, 2019, 09:51:12 AM »

Also, how big is an AI core in character/game?
I don't know about beta or gamma cores, but if you assign an alpha as administrator, let it sit for a while, and then try to unassign it, you get an event with a picture that implies that the sphere of an alpha core is pretty hefty on a personal scale - bigger than a human.  Still tiny on the scale of spaceship cargo, though.
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #715 on: May 30, 2019, 10:25:08 AM »

I don't know about beta or gamma cores, but if you assign an alpha as administrator, let it sit for a while, and then try to unassign it, you get an event with a picture that implies that the sphere of an alpha core is pretty hefty on a personal scale - bigger than a human.  Still tiny on the scale of spaceship cargo, though.
That picture can be viewed at the bottom of the December 21, 2017 blog titled Colony Management.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #716 on: May 30, 2019, 11:00:32 AM »

Two interesting notes on my current game:

Yet another 300k+ bounty with several capitals spawned... at the system next door to my primary colonies, where all of my spare big clunkers are stored.  I brought a dozen or so capitals plus many cruisers for overkill, since logistics was not a problem, and steamrolled them to show them who's boss.  Could only deploy five or six ships at 500 map size, but they did not stand a chance.

Found a double neutron star system.  I played several games, and it was the first time I saw something like it.  Seed is MN-7, at the southwest part of the sector.
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Legion0047

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #717 on: May 30, 2019, 02:42:45 PM »

Also, how big is an AI core in character/game?
I don't know about beta or gamma cores, but if you assign an alpha as administrator, let it sit for a while, and then try to unassign it, you get an event with a picture that implies that the sphere of an alpha core is pretty hefty on a personal scale - bigger than a human.  Still tiny on the scale of spaceship cargo, though.
Great.
So i personally always go for fleet/colony buffs instead of fighting skills and because you'll always personally controll your biggest ship thats kind of a waste whem you have properly skilled officers.
So what about the ability to "consume" Alpha AIs to either earn a skillpoint over limit or to just give some general combat skills?
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Shoat

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #718 on: May 31, 2019, 04:41:52 PM »

So what about the ability to "consume" Alpha AIs to either earn a skillpoint over limit or to just give some general combat skills?

Wouldn't it be way simpler to implement a way to "consume" it to turn it into an officer who can pilot a ship? There are already AI-core officers who you can put in control of your colony's defense stations, so it's not that far off.
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Legion0047

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #719 on: June 01, 2019, 01:44:17 AM »

So what about the ability to "consume" Alpha AIs to either earn a skillpoint over limit or to just give some general combat skills?

Wouldn't it be way simpler to implement a way to "consume" it to turn it into an officer who can pilot a ship? There are already AI-core officers who you can put in control of your colony's defense stations, so it's not that far off.
Yeah but may point is the ability to gain some combat skills for free because you're in the biggest ship but don't have any because you spend all your points in fleetwide/colony buffs.
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