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Author Topic: [0.95a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Hottest of Fixes Ed., 0.3.4f)  (Read 247399 times)

HopeFall

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #225 on: February 22, 2020, 09:01:15 PM »

Hello, don't you think what "Junk" have a bit overpowered logistic stats? It's only downside is burn speed of 5 which is easely can be countered by augmented drive field what gives you 7 in total.
...
Solutions? Nerf his oversized general stats, at least fuel and crew capacity from 2000 to 1000 each, also augmented drive field must be built-in hull mod, so this ship is actually gonna travel with intendent 5 burn level. Don't forget what with expanded cargo hold this thing became even more OP, yes, such large cargo holds makes sence for mining barge, but it shouldn't be universal ship without any flaws which can even serve as a flagship if fitted right.

This is absolutely insane, do not listen to him. I will never use a ship that can't achieve a burn speed of 9 with Augmented Drive. (For a Total of 10 with the skill).

A burn level of 5 is ridiculously bad. There's literally no vanilla ship that is that low, from glancing. I don't care if it's the single strongest ship in the entire game (with the exception of pulling it out of dock for invasion fleets, for the brief moment it's necessary). Big ships are NOT slower than small ships. The opposite should be entirely true, most of the time. We're not flying inside the atmosphere. More over, these suggestions on lowering it's cargo, despite admitting to it being a mining ship, is just another ridiculous suggestion. I, for one, am TIRED of using Colossus(i) for the entire game. They have 900 cargo space, and are the best fuel efficiency for cargo ships, even with most mods into consideration. Making a ship like the Junker have a measly 100 more cargo space is a slap to the face.

While some consideration should be spared to ensure things are balanced with vanilla ships, it's OK to have something be better, at higher prices. As I said, I'm basically using Colossi and Phaetons because there's basically nothing better - never have I wanted a cargo ship or fuel ship to fight. That's absurd. I want it to do its job well, like with every other ship in the game.

He posted a 'kek' video that showcases how terrible the AI is in fighting. Against ships that don't have EMP to shut down that unprotected, shieldless disaster. Great. I've personally never had a problem fighting it, since I've never used it (because of the burn speed).

And seriously a massive "lol" needs to go out to having augmented drive integrated into the Junker AND having it still be at 5. Congrats on the player never using it, and that fleet never catching any other ship in the entire game.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2020, 09:38:09 PM by HopeFall »
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PainProjection

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #226 on: February 22, 2020, 11:45:58 PM »


1) While some consideration should be spared to ensure things are balanced with vanilla ships, it's OK to have something be better, at higher prices. As I said, I'm basically using Colossi and Phaetons because there's basically nothing better - never have I wanted a cargo ship or fuel ship to fight. That's absurd. I want it to do its job well, like with every other ship in the game.

2) He posted a 'kek' video that showcases how terrible the AI is in fighting. Against ships that don't have EMP to shut down that unprotected, shieldless disaster. Great. I've personally never had a problem fighting it, since I've never used it (because of the burn speed).

3) And seriously a massive "lol" needs to go out to having augmented drive integrated into the Junker AND having it still be at 5. Congrats on the player never using it, and that fleet never catching any other ship in the entire game.

1) Ok, let's have some math.

1 Junk = 4000 cargo, 2000 crew, 2000 fuel. This 1 Junk costs  36 supplies/m and 12 fuel/y

4.5 colossus freighters = 4050cargo, 900 crew, 540 fuel. This hypothetical 4.5 colossuses cost 27 supplies/m and 12 fuel/y
same fuel usage = 12. Have some spare supplies = 9.

But wait! We also need 2.43 (lol) phaetons to fill this fuel gap which is another 7.29 supplies/m and 4.86 fuel/y
which bring us to total: 4098.6cargo, 948.6 crew, 2000 fuel. This is already cost 34.29 supplies/m and 16/86 fuel/y

But we are not done yet! We also need some spare crew space, so at least 2 and something nebulas, or even 1 starliner. Even more supplies per month, even more fuel.

You need a fleet of auxilary vessels or you can just buy 1 ship. If you didn't know... there is a limit of how much ships you can hold in your fleet. And don't forget what this is not a civilian one. It is also one of the strongest mining barges (if i remember correctly 300+ mining strenght just from single Junk), great flagship, tanker, freighter, crew transport. And we came to the point when it gets rediculous, cause with d-mods it became even better and most importantly CHEAPER. Yes, you can have d-mods on your auxilary fleet aswell. But it is pain in the ass of roll not logistic related (like high maintenance) D-Mods for even single Junk. So feel free to roll it on your entire support fleet instead.  It is selfsufficient "home on wheels". This is what wrong with this ship. It serves most of the roles and serves them simultaneously. Just can be tweaked in certain side.
_______________________________________________________________________________ _________________________

2) Each Paragon had at least 2 tachyons, one of them using quad tachyon loadout.

Both "Horror" bosses armed with tachyons.

Entire hegemony/remnant fleets armed with hypervelocity drivers/ion beams here and there.

Each "legion" had their hangars filled with thunders which armed with ion cannons each. On first test 1vs4 Legions it was 32 thunder interceptors swarm... all of them not been distracted by anything. Even 6 ion cannons is enough to keep weapons of any other ship permanently disabled.

All this without "Auto Repair Unit". "Resistant Flux Shunts" hull mod + "Rapid Repair" ship system makes Junk undisarmable.

Deal with it.
_______________________________________________________________________________ _________________________

3) This is cycle number 213 in my save file and all this time i travel with burn speed of 12. Nice "Player never using it". What? You thought i have some spare 40 ordnance points on my shieldless combat build? If only... i would spend them on efficiency overhaul or expanded rocket pods. I recorded hours of footage just to put it together in this short, little, meme vid.

Yep, bounty hunting is tough/impossible, as it should be for freaking mining barge don't you think?

What meant to be a thing what half done according to blueprints and half done according to imagination became one of the most desired ship in any fleet of any faction. It's even called "Junk". Something is wrong here. We need downsides, you know.
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AxleMC131

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #227 on: February 22, 2020, 11:56:11 PM »

I'm sensing tension. :o Remember to keep it cool, this is a discussion about the balance of mod content, not a bar-room brawl. Don't take opinions and suggestions as personal attacks, it achieves nothing.
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HopeFall

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #228 on: February 23, 2020, 12:31:51 AM »

The meme vid seems more like a personal attack against HMI "balance". But I can see how it could've been done just for fun. Still...

1) Ok, let's have some math.

1 Junk = 4000 cargo, 2000 crew, 2000 fuel. This 1 Junk costs  36 supplies/m and 12 fuel/y

4.5 colossus freighters = 4050cargo, 900 crew, 540 fuel. This hypothetical 4.5 colossuses cost 27 supplies/m and 12 fuel/y
same fuel usage = 12. Have some spare supplies = 9.

But wait! We also need 2.43 (lol) phaetons to fill this fuel gap which is another 7.29 supplies/m and 4.86 fuel/y
which bring us to total: 4098.6cargo, 948.6 crew, 2000 fuel. This is already cost 34.29 supplies/m and 16/86 fuel/y

Good on you for the math, that helps a good deal to determine how they're fair, or balanced.

Let's see. So essentially, yes, I was correct. It's not efficient to run the Junk compared to those ships. Seven in total? Yes, I'm aware there's a limit on fleet numbers (never had to run a max fleet count, but hey, some people like really tiny, really shiddy ships).

So let's consider, what's the downside? Oh. Right. Non-max 20 speed. Yeah. No thanks. Also, there's your balance.

But to be fair, let's bring in the big boys into the discussion, since you pointed out needing more ships for a similar effect.

1 Junk - 4000 cargo, 2000 crew, 2000 fuel. This 1 Junk costs  36 supplies/m and 12 fuel/y
or
2 Atlas - 4000 cargo, 200 crew, 800 fuel. At 20 supplies/m and 20 fuel/y
1 Prometheus - 200 cargo, 100 crew, 2500.  At 10 supplies/m and 10 fuel/y

An excess of 1300 fuel. and 200 supplies. 6 less supplies, a good 18 fuel over. Which the insane extra volume of fuel should make up for. More efficient? Sure. 6 burn over 5, which is doubled for hyperdriving about. In this case, a Civilian grade hull is actually a benefit. Not only do you get the Augmented drive, but you can also run Militarized Subsystems for that extra much desired burn. Less Supplies, significantly, over time. The only benefit, here, is the extra freed logistic mod the Junk can have, but frankly, I'd take Military Subsystems on it if I could.
But what about crew? I actually feel more crew is a negative, given the monthly cost of running them. But given the Junk is expected to go into combat, fair enough.

Instead of your suggestion of forcibly keeping it at 5 burn drive, I'd suggest tuning it slightly. Less crew, for sure. It could be slightly less efficient fuel wise (but not by much, unless the burn drive is boosted to 6). Sounds to me, honestly, that this ship is competitive. That's what we call this.

Max efficiency? Run the faster, smaller ships. Want more combat ships because of fleet max? Get the bigger ones. Want even MORE combat ships? Run the junker, but lose efficiency and speed.

As for your combat analysis. Iunno. Maybe? As I said. *Never* had a problem fighting them. And we all know how Dooms behave in the player's hands. I fully understand that you can MAKE this ship super strong. It just doesn't come across like it is. Not many people run this flagship. (likely because of the slow burn).

I don't want to take ages to go mining. And in that case, I'd use other mods' Starlifter or Pathfinder. I don't want to burn massive supplies because one ship is keeping my entire fleet from operating. But again, that seems part of its balance for having good stats across the board. I think less crew, more fuel consumption. Don't go crazy with the nerfs. Consider its placement. But nuking its speed by 2, as your suggestion, AND lowering it's combat power, and lowering its cargo and fuel. Would literally make this ship Junk.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2020, 12:55:02 AM by HopeFall »
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PainProjection

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #229 on: February 23, 2020, 01:43:21 AM »


So yes, you get my point, i get yours. Can we both agree what Junk's(and Fishkill's) stats have to be tuned down?

I shouldn't be suggesting exact numbers, but here is my complains with it:

- If they supposed to have such giant cargo holds - fine, we all know what even transplutonic ore is pretty cheap cargo sizewise. But they should have fuel capacity just enough to travel through core worlds solo or with small fleet, no more. And shouldn't act as free crew transports for surveying/colonisation missions. Currently they just to selfsufficient vessels.

- I don't like how this ships solves any problem, fulfil any of my desires. While playing with Junks in my fleet i never had a glimpse of thought what "i need to buy tanker" or additional freighter, or something. It is just universal ship what covers every demand, a basis-camp house for building your armada, which is role of supercapitals.

- For being hybrid of battle ship and support ship Junk are not really restricted as support ship. It's more lik a good freighters-tanker-transport which can also act as battle ship, unlike Atlas or Prometheus which stays undeployed in battles forever. Why should i buy Prometheus or Atlas or whatever smaller support ship, if i can buy Junk and it will serve as well as they are, but have a lot more flexebility. Also, i personally feels uncomfortable when my fleet drains more than 70 fuel per day, so for me Junk strat is much more attractive as it's more fuel cheap.

_______________________________________________________________________________ _________________________

I don't want Junk's combat stats to be nerfed, it is already pretty weak. I wrote short message in video description what it is "Pilot effect" which triples capabilities of any ship. That video wasn't a personal attack against HMI. It's more like attack against conservative minds who relies on old tactics and thinks what building entire shieldless fleets is stupid idea what never gonna work. HMI just serves the best for such idea.

It's a feature of this faction - very cheap, low tech ships.
And this two beasts are totally fine except what their Cargo, Crew and Fuel capacities has to be set a bit more gently.

You know, i am suggesting nerfs for faction what i fall in love, but currently some game aspects with certain ships are too easy. This is probably my favorite facton by far, except maybe interstellar imperium, but i don't like their style, just impressed with how the details are worked out.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2020, 01:47:33 AM by PainProjection »
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PainProjection

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #230 on: February 24, 2020, 02:12:46 AM »

Another rework idea came to my mind. As we see what some people really hate limiting Junk's burn speed, what if:

-Junk will have "Compromised Storage" by default, like ludds ships have "Ill-Advised Modifications" even if it been manufactured from your own heavy industry, it still can be restored for additional credit investment ofcource.
-Junk will have "Civilian-grade Hull" hullmod. (It would make sence cause "Compromised Storage" cannot appear on non-civilian ships and also will create interesting choices.)
-Junk's burn speed reduced from 5 to 4 (Can be restored with "Militarised Subsystems")
-Junk's maximum crew decreaced from 2000 to 1150 (This is important, cause with comp storage it will be 805)
-Junk's skeleton crew decreaced from 500 to 400 (Oh wow! He suggesting a buff?)
-Junk's fuel capacity decreaced from 2000 to 800 (level of Prometheus II which is max for vanilla's non tanker ship)

_______________________________________________________________________________ _________________________

In this case we will have 2 logistic slots, most desired would be "Augmented Drive Field" ofcource. This will significantly upgrade burn speed from unacceptable 4 to bearable 6.

Second one will be the real choice:

- "Militarised subsystems"? Which is +1 burn = 7 in total (exactly what we have in this version with "Augmented Drive Field"), supply cost to recover is reduced by 30%, skeleton crew increaced from 400 to 800(remember why maximum crew is 1150?). Increases armour by 45%. Increases flux capacity & dissipation by 10%. Increases max speed, acceleration, deceleration, max turn rate & turn acceleration by 10%.

- Or "Expanded Cargo Holds"? +1200 cargo... 5200 in total. This is a lot. Probably not that much as "Militarised Subsystems" buffs, but if you don't have plans of utilising it as combat unit, when a lot of benefits is meaningful, it's just +1 burn for doubling skeleton crew. In my previous run that was my choice alongside with "Augmented Drive Field"

- But there is also "Efficiency Overhaul", for even more cheaper expluatation. But maybe you just like me who want to go "All-in" and spend every single ordnance point in to expluatation efficiency (overhaul + cargo holds), when enjoy your burn level of 10 (with character skill ofc), still should be playable, i used to 12, so it wouldn't be that much different.

So what i want is make real choice, a flexible base what can be customised to just 1 role, freighter or battleship. Like would you ever restore "Compromised Storage" D-mod? Or just use it as source of free ordnance points? What logistic hull mods you gonna install? Spending 40 for "Augmented Drive Field" is a lot for battleship, for junk it's critical ammount, it actually on the edge between being efficient in combat or complete trash (if we exclude lvl 103 commander).
It also relies heavily on hullmods from ship and weapon pack ("Extreme Modifications", "Shield Bypass").

I don't even know where i supposed to find another 25 ordance points for "Militarised Dubsystems" in my *Hull meta* loadout.. probably gonna deinstall "Insulated Engines" and some flux vents... i don't know. It will restore my burn level and sensor stats to normal (5 burn, default sensor strenght and size), but most importantly add 225 armor points. I would have to do it. But this ship no longer will serve me as tanker or colonisation vessel, 800 fuel is more than enough to support mining operations near core world. More than enough for combat freighter, it's already "combat", it's already "freighter". Right now if only this thing would have phase field generator it will collect every single role in this game.

What about Fishkill? Something similar, but instead of making hybrid between battleship and freighter it should be hybrid between carrier and tanker.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2020, 05:28:34 PM by PainProjection »
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tindrli

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #231 on: March 21, 2020, 09:53:57 AM »

im a newbie but still i dont think that HMI ships should be nerfed. So at the moment with all due respect to all members please leave that big ship as it is.
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tindrli

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #232 on: March 23, 2020, 08:55:46 AM »

is the update working. the game is constantly reporting new update but the download link is HMI_0_2_2g and after uopdating mod game reports an update again
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Ali

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #233 on: March 23, 2020, 09:40:07 AM »

im a newbie but still i dont think that HMI ships should be nerfed. So at the moment with all due respect to all members please leave that big ship as it is.

2nd'd  :)
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Tindahbawx

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #234 on: March 24, 2020, 05:57:32 AM »

is the update working. the game is constantly reporting new update but the download link is HMI_0_2_2g and after uopdating mod game reports an update again

It's on the Discord in the mod_updates channel, but it's a beta version and apparently a major rework of the mod, so I would suggest if you were to update it, you would also probably need a new game?

Thread for the Discord invite link is here:
https://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=11488.0
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tindrli

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #235 on: March 24, 2020, 10:48:36 AM »

is the update working. the game is constantly reporting new update but the download link is HMI_0_2_2g and after uopdating mod game reports an update again

It's on the Discord in the mod_updates channel, but it's a beta version and apparently a major rework of the mod, so I would suggest if you were to update it, you would also probably need a new game?

Thread for the Discord invite link is here:
https://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=11488.0

thank you
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King Alfonzo

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #236 on: March 25, 2020, 05:17:24 PM »

It should be pointed out that the Discord version is in Beta, and changes constantly as I change and tune and fix things. Once the mod is in a state where I'm not going to be tinkering with it daily, I'll post it up here. This can be frustrating, hence why I suggest you remain with the base version in the mean time.

PainProjection

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #237 on: March 26, 2020, 05:26:04 PM »

It should be pointed out that the Discord version is in Beta, and changes constantly as I change and tune and fix things. Once the mod is in a state where I'm not going to be tinkering with it daily, I'll post it up here. This can be frustrating, hence why I suggest you remain with the base version in the mean time.

I am glad to hear what you doing tests right now.

As i mention in my last post, Junk highly rely on 2 hullmods from separate mod.

And when extreme modifications serves just as 5th layer of "junker" bonus, which downsides is completely mitigated by rapid repair, shield bypass is quite critical. The problem is what shield on Junk completely useless. More than that it actually make ship worse in AI hands, because it act as flux sink. "Do you have some spare flux? Activate shield and you gonna be overloaded in seconds!". No matter what you gonna do, AI just waste all flux trying to tank some damage and then became a dummy targed for enemies. So i highly suggest to remove shields from ship and buff base flux generation by 50%, techinacally making shield bypass effects as built-in.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2020, 05:29:34 PM by PainProjection »
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Chepe

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #238 on: March 26, 2020, 09:41:33 PM »

I only made an account to say thank you for making a low tech faction. I love ballistic style weapons in space games over the pew pew lasers that is so prevalent. Most everyone I see makes midline or high tech so I hounded these *** ships like an orc boy on a tribal planet.
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HELMUT

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Re: [0.9.1a] Hazard Mining Incorporated (Tweaks Ed., 0.2.2g)
« Reply #239 on: April 05, 2020, 02:24:40 PM »

I decided to play a HMI campaign with the beta version from the discord. I wanted to go with an Industry/Leadership focused playthrough, more focused on commanding a fleet than piloting. Because of the vast amount of content added by the mod, i preferred to focus exclusively on the Junker ships. I also disabled the sub-faction like Fang and Brighton because my PC is a also a junker. Anyway, here's how it went.

As i knew beforehand of the dubious quality of Junker ships, i started my campaign with the Nexerelin "small combat fleet" (Cockroach destroyer, Greasy and Shotglass frigates) start instead of going with just lone frigate. A few experiments in the simulator indeed confirmed my original thoughts about my new ships : they are junk. Slow, unshielded, unarmoured, with shoddy flux stats. The absence of proper shield or any defence system made the Junkers unable to fight for prolonged duration, and their lack of mobility left them extremely vulnerable to kiting. Even with their incredible amount of hull point, there was no way my ships would handle a long battle. All of those flaws ensured they would never survive in a fair fight.

Fortunately, Junkers neither need to fight fairly, nor to survive said fight.

There was a wise guy that once said that the best defence is a good offence. Another wise (?) guy also that said that quantity have a quality all its own. With this in mind, i went to build my warfleet. Every single ships were based on the idea of lobbing as many harpoons and sabots as possible, all in the purpose of maximising their alpha strike potential. The enemy can't shoot you if the enemy is dead. That's one way to resolve the survivability issue with Junkers.



Among the first few ships i got was the Shotglass. A frigate barely deserving of being crewed both for safety reasons and actual fighting ability. It's a piece of scrap, but it's a dirt cheap piece of scrap with a missile mount. If somehow you can't find a Kite laying around, the Shotglass will do. There's no magic trick that makes the Shotglass good, but it doesn't need to be "good", it just need to shoot at things sufficiently until they die. A few eliminate order, every weapons set to linked on the same weapon group... This is a good way to ensure your stuff will fire everything they've got before exploding. And when there's a few Shotglasses in the fleet just doing that, things start to die surprisingly fast, both on your side and the enemy's.

Thanks to their affordable price, i could buy a few more frigates before leaving for bounty hunting. The Snail was one of those frigate, and it is probably the most dangerous tool in the HMI roster. Even cheaper to deploy than a Vigilance, and with more missiles, it flies the same way the Shotglass does, recklessly and violently. With its ridiculous armament, it can burst through any frigates and even destroyers that get in range. It still needs to survive long enough to unleash its entire payload, but that was rarely an issue since my faster Shotglasses usually reach the frontline first to distract the enemy.

I also got myself a Streak. It's not as good as a Snail, but the medium missile hardpoint still makes the Streak an interesting addition in a fleet, and its numerous ballistic mounts gives it a very nasty bite if it can get close without exploding. It's also the best Safety Override frigate the Junkers have access to. With its numerous front facing mounts, it can pump out an absurdly high amount of DPS, enough to threaten even the biggest destroyers.

The Greasy works just like the Streak, although it trades firepower for resilience. There's not much to say here, the Greasy isn't as spectacular as the Snail or Streak at killing things, but it does a good enough job. It's not like i had a reason not to deploy as many ships as possible anyway, so every ship i could get my hands on were sent to the frontline.

The Cockroach destroyer was my first flagship. Like all Junker ships, the Cockroach tank hits with its hull, and it got a lot of hull, even more so with Reinforced Bulkhead and Blast Door, which are absolutely mandatory hullmods for Junkers by the way. It also got a very decent amount of missile mounts, and more than enough weapons to turn it into a Safety Override brute. Although at this point SO felt almost superfluous, since my fleet could end fights with missile saturation alone. There was no need to get close to actually fire my guns during early game, just sit at a reasonable distance and fire the missiles when appropriate.


This is with this merry band of clunkers that i went hunting pirates, derelicts and the occasional remnants. Battles were finished very quickly, and casualties, mainly due to hugging exploding ships, could be salvaged safely after the encounter thanks to Reinforced Bulkhead. I went with the obvious route of Industry and Leaderships skills for this campaign, with a few Technology ones. Very rapidly, i amassed a large armada of D mods ridden junks, but it's okay, Junker ships love D mods! Each D mod (up to 4 i think?) does increase the OPs and reduce the repair costs. Combined with the Industry skills, those ships becomes very cheap to maintain and repair. Although each D mods also reduce the quality of the fighters, that's a trade off to keep in mind.

I rarely went back to the core worlds, only to resupply in fuel and crew. Yes, Junkers ships run on meat instead of supplies. Well, not literally, but even with the proper skills and Blast Doors, i kept losing large amounts of crewmen during battle. Hull tanking will do that to you. Supplies however are relatively plentiful in the outer rim, and you barely spend any on repair anyway.


As the campaign went on, i got my hands on more Junker ships. The Creep destroyer is probably the one i salvaged and used the most. It is the logical evolution of the Streak frigate, a fragile glass cannon with a hefty amount of missile mounts. Just like the Streak, the Creep can be built in one of the meanest SO destroyer. Which is exactly what i did. Junkers do struggle to catch faster ships. Using a lot of missiles and Safety Override tends to mitigate that weakness.

Also got a few Convict carriers. Unexpectedly expensive to deploy (as much as a Drover!), very fragile and slow. Because of D mods degrading the efficiency of fighters, it makes for a relatively poor carrier. It compensate by being an extremely heavily armed missile boat. if noticeably starved in OPs. My main issue was getting them to the frontline before the battle ended. To resolve that, i start the battle with an escort order on my carriers, forcing my fleet to deathball around them. Once the main bulk of the enemy's fleet is engaged, i can cancel the escort order and press the red button.

Spoiler

The red button. When you absolutely, positively got to kill everyone in the room, accept no substitutes.
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Junkers love the red button, it's the signal that the leash is off and they can ignore trivial matters such as self preservation. Not a good idea to use from the get go, because you don't want your ships chasing that Hound on the edge of the map. That's also a good reason to start with the escort order to keep a close formation before the big brawl. Of course, after a time during big battles, your ships will inevitably disperse to chase something, but you can still force them to regroup for a moment, then repeat the process.

I also got my hands on the cruisers, the Roach King and Slugworth. Both are very similar, big bricks of armour plates welded together, with more weapons than good sense. The Roach King is the brawler, the one that is on the frontline, hugging that capital ship while choking on its guns flux. The Slugworth is the support, the one that is on the frontline, hugging that capital ship while choking on its guns flux. Except it also got fighters. Both got a lot of missiles, both were loaded in a way they could kill things as fast as possible with a blatant disregard for their own safety. And it worked! Backed by the rest of the fleet, my cruisers could dive deep in the enemy's formation, and kept going until they reached the other end of the battlefield, ignoring torpedoes and bombers trying to deplete their huge, fat sack of hullpoints. My crewmen didn't liked this tactic one bit, but hey, it "works".

A bit later, i acquired a Junk, the HMI combat superfreighter. As its title implies, the Junk is not really a combat ship, but just like a butcher knife isn't a weapon, it will still wreck anything that would think it little more than an armoured Atlas. The Pummerer cannon reach far, is accurate, have a high rate of fire, and hit surprisingly hard. Sadly i couldn't make good use of it as my battles always devolved into messy close combat brawls with constantly blocked line of sight. Regardless, the Junk is still a worthy acquisition, even if only for its gargantuan cargo hold, and you'll haul a lot of crap when playing HMI. Yes, it's slow as sin, but at this point in the campaign, i was daring everyone to try to engage for a fight, so i didn't cared much for its slowness. Oh i almost forgot, the Junk is also armed with an inexplicable build-in swarmer near its bridge., for some reason.


Early, mid and even some late game battle were handled fast enough that the lack of armour and shield weren't too much of an issue. Very late game however, proved to be more complicated. Drowning the enemy under an avalanche of missiles works only if you have the number advantage. This is why i eventually disabled the 30 ships limit in the player fleet, so i could see how far i could push it. Battles often devolved into a bloody meatgrinder, with extreme causalities on both sides, but i just need to win, if i win i can salvage back all i lost and keep going as if nothing happened. Moreover, if you play with Starship legends, Junkers are under-evaluated in term of power level, every fight will be counted as an uphill battle. The bonuses for winning such fight, even with 90% causalities, will often be positives. So yeah, 90% causality rate makes for an acceptable win for Junkers.


I did take a look at the fighters too. I was pretty underwhelmed by the Trapdoors bombers. Dirt cheap and fast but also extremely fragile and barely armed. I don't think they're worth it. Maybe if there were six of those per wing, maybe as a cheap alternative...

The Shell drones are similar, although not as bad. Cheap, and heavily armoured, but also barely armed and frustratingly slow. In theory they could be really annoying when massed, blobbing around a ship. However with their lack of mobility they would spend most of their time trying to chase a target, and anything slower than Shells usually have the firepower to rapidly burst through their heavy armour.

The Bombardment drone is a much more interesting one. It is simply a flying annihilator launcher. Unlike the Kopesh that fires all their missiles in one burst, the Bombardment function like the small annihilator launcher does. Yes that includes its hefty ammo capacity. That makes the Bombardment a very decent support bomber that rarely needs to reload, one that is best to keep at the ship's side as it keep firing volleys after volleys of rockets. It's also extremely cheap to mount, what's not to love? Arguably overpowered when used on a proper battlecarrier, a constant and unlimited stream of Annihilators for such a cheap price feels really damn strong. One thing of note, unlike conventional bombers running out of ammo, the Bombardment drone does not go back to resupply to the carrier when set in engage mode, it needs to be done manually by regrouping them. The Scale fighter also suffers from this issue.

Speaking of which, the Scale function in a nearly identical way as the Bombardment, although its is much more expensive, and its Mbecke rocket launcher is much weaker. But it also have much longer range. That long range makes the Scale a pretty incredibly fire support alternative to the Xyphos. Not really adapted to the fleet i used during this campaign, but something to keep in mind when playing another faction.



After a surprisingly long campaign, i finally met my end during a reckless incursion in Mansa. Overconfident, i charged headlong against three local fleets. I didn't expected those feeder drones to be a hard counter to my missile spam, and those high-tech ships are also pretty good at kiting. Oh well, that was a fun ride at least. I'm very sad that i never found a Fishkill carrier. The Junker Astral was all i could have wished for during this campaign, lot of missiles, lot of bombers, a truckload of hullpoints...  Still, i managed to go pretty far with just a swarm of scrapships. As for the overall balance of the ships, it's... Hardto tell. Junkers does not really function like vanilla, or any other mod faction really, as such the comparison is difficult to make. The brutal missile spam deleting things obscenely fast could make them appear overpowered, but that's also something that vanilla ships can do, although to a lesser extent.

On top of bounty hunting, i also did some exploration, and i have to say i did quite enjoy the content added by HMI, the writing too. Vanilla is pretty barebone in that regard, so it's always a plus. The Domain Resurgent, the Horrors and the Mess also respectively bring some welcome mid, late and very late game challenge.

In the end, i did quite enjoy this campaign. The Junkers do have the chance of offering a playstyle completely different from other mods that i know of. It's also the closest thing we currently have to Warhammer 40.000 Orks in Starsector. HMI feels like a worthy addition to the modlist, although from my perspective it did feels more demanding on performances than other mods, which makes sense given all the stuff it brings in the sector. I personally won't use all the time, but for people that like exploration and plethora of content in the sector, HMI  is a very good bet.

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