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Author Topic: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price  (Read 2090 times)

TartarusMkII

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Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« on: May 08, 2017, 01:31:22 PM »

Heya Alex, Just want to say firstly that I am not very experienced with this game, and I had to go to the Discord to make sure it wasn't just me, but the answers I got were concerning to me, so I discarded them.

Here's my bug report, and I'll leave it up to you to determine whether this is an issue or not. I only want to give you a hand, if I can.

Also, one last disclaimer: I tested this in both my modded .8, and my vanilla .8. The screenshots are from the modded game because that is the last state I had the game before I decided I needed to know more.


So here's a break down of my symptoms:
  • Find Agricultural Planet
  • Buy food for the cheapest I can find
  • Use Intel screen to find food shortage
  • Economy with food shortage is offering less than what I paid for it elsewhere.

I tried to embed these screenshots and I can't, sorry. Links they'll be.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pgz0i2wrkqevc9e/5dbe60427696ebb83f939197915c505e.png?dl=0
In this Screenshot, you can see that I bought Food from Eventide at 30c base (this world is described as mildly agricultural, enough for it to be notable). Then, I took it to Karma, where they will pay 20c base for it.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bjjecf01ieov4kp/edc330b95cdb0ef116406021d7b414a6.png?dl=0
It was hard to take screenshots of the game unfortunately, but here you can see the icon showing that Karma is currently under a food shortage event.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/g12he9cjpzs8f2g/f0d3be5cea6490529c8b91d1c2b72bed.png?dl=0
Here you can see that relief was sent, but I believe I beat the relief here, as according to the market screen, the demand had not yet been met. Also to note, the market stability of Karma was at 0.

I tested this in three different new games, two modded, one vanilla. Every time I brought food to an economy suffering from food shortage, they would offer less than the base price for it.


So that's my bug report, I'd be happy to give any other information that you might find useful. Below is my opinion on the issue, if I may also give it.

So, when I went to the Discord, a lot of people who responded to my request for help on this issue excused it as being part of how the economy is messed up. "Yeah you're not supposed to really be able to trade." "But why trade tho." "Trading is kind of intentionally made not be profitable, unless you do procurement contracts." "Too much work, not enough profit." "Nobody does trading so this bug would very likely go overlooked."

None of this makes any sense to me. Everyone I know who I've played this game with very much trades. And I don't understand the rationale here. If trading was not something the player was meant to interact with, then why bother having commodities and simulated economies in the first place? You could rip that out of the game and not affect the combat, exploration, salvaging, etc. Is the idea that the player is not meant to interact with the trading something that FractalSoftworks agrees with? because if so, then I'd be happy to write a more detailed retort to that in the suggestion forums, because that decision would ensure I never pick up the game again.


Best wishes, and again, if you need any other information from me, just let me know.








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Mr. Sterling

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2017, 01:38:25 PM »

99% of all trading will net you a loss in $ even in food shortages. Fastest way to earn cash is missions, and then buy from BM if possible to earn even more $.

you can also turn off transponder destroy the food shortage relief fleet steal the food then turn it in yourself.
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TartarusMkII

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2017, 01:40:52 PM »

99% of all trading will net you a loss in $ even in food shortages. Fastest way to earn cash is missions, and then buy from BM if possible to earn even more $.

you can also turn off transponder destroy the food shortage relief fleet steal the food then turn it in yourself.

Did you look at the screenshot mate? Did you play .7? This is not how the system worked before. I'm immensely frustrated with the numerous people who are offering advice (which I appreciate, I do!) but are refusing to acknowledge the obvious discrepancy here.

The fact I can steal the food and turn it in is 100% irrelevant here. The economy with the shortage is asking below base price for it.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2017, 01:42:31 PM by TartarusMkII »
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Mr. Sterling

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2017, 01:49:10 PM »

99% of all trading will net you a loss in $ even in food shortages. Fastest way to earn cash is missions, and then buy from BM if possible to earn even more $.

you can also turn off transponder destroy the food shortage relief fleet steal the food then turn it in yourself.

Did you look at the screenshot mate? Did you play .7? This is not how the system worked before. I'm immensely frustrated with the numerous people who are offering advice (which I appreciate, I do!) but are refusing to acknowledge the obvious discrepancy here.

The fact I can steal the food and turn it in is 100% irrelevant here. The economy with the shortage is asking below base price for it.



yes there is a massive discrepancy. No i didn't look at the screenshots as i have been playing since before game was called Starsector (long time ago) and know about the messed up trading system. originally you could make a massive profit from hunting ships and selling them to markets but you cant do that any more ether.
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Alex

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2017, 01:52:30 PM »

Yeah, the pricing here is clearly borked - not sure what caused it. I'll take a look.

(I will say that "trading" hasn't been at all a focus for the .8a update, hence the turned-off (due to being broken) trade disruptions and this falling through the cracks. Exactly what shape it'll take later, I don't know.)

Edit: please, let's not have a discussion here. What's being reported is clearly a bug; conversation about game design etc belongs in other subforums.

Edit #2: Thank you for the report :)
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TartarusMkII

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2017, 01:54:51 PM »

99% of all trading will net you a loss in $ even in food shortages. Fastest way to earn cash is missions, and then buy from BM if possible to earn even more $.

you can also turn off transponder destroy the food shortage relief fleet steal the food then turn it in yourself.

Did you look at the screenshot mate? Did you play .7? This is not how the system worked before. I'm immensely frustrated with the numerous people who are offering advice (which I appreciate, I do!) but are refusing to acknowledge the obvious discrepancy here.

The fact I can steal the food and turn it in is 100% irrelevant here. The economy with the shortage is asking below base price for it.



yes there is a massive discrepancy. No i didn't look at the screenshots as i have been playing since before game was called Starsector (long time ago) and know about the messed up trading system. originally you could make a massive profit from hunting ships and selling them to markets but you cant do that any more ether.

I was told in Discord that Alex purposely and knowingly disabled Market Disruptions. Though he did not disable Food Shortages for .8 . My rationale is that if he intentionally did not do this, that he should know that [someone] is having an issue with it. Again, you're talking about something being overpowered or imbalanced. I'm talking about a.. I don't even understand why I have to explain this??? The symptom is Supply & Demand but reversed.
Yeah, the pricing here is clearly borked - not sure what caused it. I'll take a look.

(I will say that "trading" hasn't been at all a focus for the .8a update, hence the turned-off (due to being broken) trade disruptions and this falling through the cracks. Exactly what shape it'll take later, I don't know.)

Alex, thank you, I feel so much better reading you say that. I'm totally fine with some features needing to be pushed aside. You're one guy. But the sentiment on the Discord seems totally incorrect. Again, you can even see it here that it's more likely that a bug would be excused than brought to your attention. I'm sorry to vent, but I really genuinely thought I was crazy.

Thanks again for the gamey-game, and please be well!
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Alex

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Re: Food Shortage Asking-Price Less Than Base-Price
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2017, 02:03:22 PM »

Thanks for your understanding! Yeah, "basic trade isn't supposed to be profitable" is pretty different from "this event that's supposed to make trade profitable for the duration is *also not profitable*" :)
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