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[orost]

If there are escort missions, they should attach to your fleet. That way there's no danger of frustration from the AI being stupid and getting itself killed. If you go the wrong way or take too long they detach and you pay a rep and/or money penalty.

[Toxcity]

Having them as a seperate entity is fine since it forces you to keep you transponder on, and fight battles you otherwise wouldn't. If you just want to earn money in your own fleet you can trade or do bounties.

[orost]

That's not a good thing. It's the recipe for the typical frustrating escort mission which you can lose through no fault of your own based on luck. And the game cannot be made smart enough to judge whether you did your best in face of impossible odds or screwed up and should be punished.

If you're in command you can sneak and evade enemies you cannot fight, and always have a chance succeed in the mission through skill. It can still be made more challenging than regular flying around by spawning extra fleets that specifically hunt for you (the pirates found out about your escort contract and know there's something valuable to steal). And you'll have the freighters' inferior civilian sensor stats to make it a bit harder to sneak around.

[Dri]

Escort missions are pure trash. That goes doubly for escorts missions where the NPCs get to set the pace and not, you know, the player who knows best how to protect them!

[Toxcity]

It's not like you'd be forced to do them. Bounties, procurement, and ezploration would still be available.

[orost]

But why would you want an escort mission where you're at the mercy of the AI, when the game's design easily allows something better? I'd have thought that these days everyone agrees that's a bad idea...

[PCCL]

imo the best implementation of escort would be spawning a fleet that goes to the destination and you (as a separate fleet) can maneuver yourself.

As long as you stay in short range sensor (so they're comfortable you're around) and they arrive safely, you're good. Contact with your clients ("hey, we're gonna scout ahead so we'll be out of range for a few days" or "hey, we're gonna draw that pirate fleet off, rendez vouz at the jump point" or "Barad is really close to the Jangala jump point right now, consider resupplying through Asharu via fringe approach instead of resupplying from Jangala") would also be really nice but might be too complicated.

This is a bit off topic though

[Tartiflette]

To me the best way to have escort mission would be to directly add the escorted fleet to your fleet (without sharing cargo and crew obviously), and have them spawn as allies if needed in battle. That system could also be used the other way around by hiring mercenary escorts when venturing in hostile space, or private transports to fulfill a trade mission. Could also be used to have "character" ships that can join you for specific story driven missions...

[cjuicy]

Could also be used to have "character" ships that can join you for specific story driven missions...

Something like "A former admiral working to prove his innocence" or "Hegemony detective hunting a group of smugglers from Barad B"?

[Inventor Raccoon]

Could also be used to have "character" ships that can join you for specific story driven missions...

Something like "A former admiral working to prove his innocence" or "Hegemony detective hunting a group of smugglers from Barad B"?

Oh my god, I realised we need unique character quests. Pop into a market, see a questgiver, accept quest, and then you engage in some premade scenario, like relieving a siege on some backwater planet, or breaking up a drug deal, with allies joining in.

On an unrelated note, it would be awesome to have an end-game mission type where you defend an orbital station (armed to the teeth and with a module that stops your ships from losing CR), from waves of enemy ships, until reinforcements arrive.

[AxleMC131]

I don't think the AI would ruin escort missions. You might be surprised how good the AI actually is at having convoys avoid pirate ambushes: they'll actively avoid them, and even turn their transponders off in dangerous locations.

Even so, AI isn't perfect, and it's the reason I suggest A) still being paid if you try to fight and lose, and B) only being able to escort fleets the same speed as you, so you still have exactly the same options to escape or engage.

[Voyager I]

Escort missions sound like they have a lot of potential to be hell in an open-world sandbox where a big fuckoff ball of pirates can come down on you at any time and place.

Those giant pirate balls also come down on you if you're not escorting something. The one change would be that during the escort mission you've got NPC support and don't have to win with just your ship/fleet.

No, the difference when you're by yourself is that you don't have to fight them at all.

[AxleMC131]

Those giant pirate balls also come down on you if you're not escorting something. The one change would be that during the escort mission you've got NPC support and don't have to win with just your ship/fleet.

No, the difference when you're by yourself is that you don't have to fight them at all.

Neither do the AI. Do you really think a small convoy, upon seeing a pirate attack fleet coming for them, is just going to hold course? No, they don't do that.

[Bastion.Systems]

Two examples how to create endgame challenge in an open world game:

1. Endgame crises (good example: in Battle Brothers as the game clock advances it will trigger one of three cataclysmic events that spawn very hard armies that will genocide the entire map if not stopped)

2. Boss faction (Templar mod for example spawns fleets that can easily crush the player even with a full fleet and support and need good tactics and careful execution to defeat.)

[DatonKallandor]

A) still being paid if you try to fight and lose,

I think the best option there is you don't get the mission complete lump sum, but you do get the per-kill payment. That way you get compensated for trying, but not for failing.

Really, anybody making a sandbox space game should really play Void Destroyer 2 to see how to properly reward the player in ways that make sense and aren't punishing. From bounties scaling to the cost of the ship being destroyed to being able to get paid for non-combat stuff like having a repair ship and repairing NPCs with hull damage everything feels valuable in proportion to the risk taken to do it. It's even got Pirates that act like actual Pirates - they demand payment and only kill if don't comply (which is also how you build or lose pirate rep - demand payment and kill if refused, but if you kill somebody that paid you lose pirate rep).