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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.8a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 639208 times)

AxleMC131

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #465 on: March 26, 2017, 10:17:06 PM »

Reading through the patch note to translate, I realized one thing: now we can get Mudskipper Mk.II and get rid of its Ill-Advised Modification!

 :o
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TheEndstoneGolem

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #466 on: March 27, 2017, 02:01:23 AM »

Hey people!

This is in regards to the whole sustained/emergency burn situation that we appear to have here.

What if sustained burn is a perk only available to certain ships, for example, sustained burn is something commonly found on exploration or mercantile ships (they would also get e burn) whilst emergency burn is found on combat/hunter ships.

This would result in both player and npc fleets being focused around sets of ships, and in real life if it existed would be more realistic.

Something to note is that in this situation, it would make sense that sustained is a toggle on/off (sort of like switching entire engine systems on a ship), reduces manoeuvrability MASSIVELY, and provides a smaller burn boost than emergency (+5 for example). On the other hand emergency provides +10 to burn speed and huge manoeuvrability boost (sending normal engines into an overdrive mode) at the expense of a moderate amount of CR. Another addition to balance this would be that sustained burn could only be used in hyperspace, and increase fuel usage slightly, whilst E burn can't be used in hyperspace. The reason that combat fleets get e burn only is because they could sort of ambush mercantile fleets. Hence why mercantile fleets still get e burn, (possibly a degraded version).

Sorry for the awful formatting (I'm on mobile).

I recognise that this couldn't be implemented for 0.8a and that this should go in suggestions, but is a good long term plan. It would also require HUGE changes to the way in which ships interact with the campaign level ganeplay, but I feel as though this is a good solution for the NEXT patch (Jesus Endstone we've not even got this one yet) xD.

Feel free to move to suggestions if you feel this should go there :)
« Last Edit: March 27, 2017, 02:54:14 AM by TheEndstoneGolem »
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Inventor Raccoon

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #467 on: March 27, 2017, 02:32:06 AM »

Reading through the patch note to translate, I realized one thing: now we can get Mudskipper Mk.II and get rid of its Ill-Advised Modification!
Sounds fun, except that ship still can't support any large weapon effectively and takes hits like an anorexic boxer. At least it won't malfunction, though.
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Clockwork Owl

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #468 on: March 27, 2017, 03:46:18 AM »

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Gothars

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #469 on: March 27, 2017, 04:53:38 AM »

Quote
Ejecting cargo:
Creates "cargo pods" that will drift away and be lost within a few days


You know, that could be a super interesting way to deal with pirates (or corrupt patrols). If they are chasing you and you can't shake them, just drop a respectable amount of valuable cargo pods. They will decelerate to pick them up and give you time to escape. If the AI also drops these distractions when chased, voilà, here's a non-bloodthirsty pirate playstile.

Next step would be something like poisoned supplies that allows you to set a trap for enemies ;D



Quote
Ship refit now only degrades CR when something is removed. I.E. adding weapons or hullmods will not reduce CR unless something is removed to make room
Mostly applicable for recovered ships - spending their free OP will not tank their CR

Optimal-but-tedious strategy: Set sail with unequipped ships and a choice of stored weapons and only when you encounter an enemy put weapons on your ships (that are perfect for the specific encounter). On the next station, de-equip your ships and repeat.

It's stupid, but I thought I'd mention it. Small CR cost for equipping would probably be enough to discourage it.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2017, 05:18:47 AM by Gothars »
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #470 on: March 27, 2017, 05:20:28 AM »

  • Ejecting cargo:
    • Creates "cargo pods" that will drift away and be lost within a few days
    • Can stabilize orbit of cargo pods for several months; costs supplies based on amount of cargo
      • Only in-system, not in hyperspace
    • Can put crew in cargo pods ("cryosleep" etc)
Disposable heroes return!  Put crew in pods, space 'em, and leave them to die!  Nice for those who want to replay a callous, capricious, proud, ruthless, and vengeful tyrant.  Space crew for incompetence or even on a whim.
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DeathRay

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #471 on: March 27, 2017, 07:36:10 AM »

Sooo, now we cannot only eject Cargo, but also Crew. In their own Pods...

Wouldn't that also make some good Mechanics for missions?
Like:
Dear mercenaries, we have received an emergency Signal from a ship around that Starthingy.
Could you please go and help them?
*arriving at star*
Oh hey, theres a debris field.
And there are some Crew Pods.
Aaand there is an asteroid field with readings of a pirate armada...
Help?

Or something like:
Here you have a small special research satellite.
Please put/take it into/out of a/the Orbit of planet x.

That might be interesting.

Hm, we can eject cargo and Crew. That kinda reminds me of something...
The Hull has been breached and the Science is leaking out!!!!
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ANGRYABOUTELVES

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #472 on: March 27, 2017, 07:39:42 AM »

Optimal-but-tedious strategy: Set sail with unequipped ships and a choice of stored weapons and only when you encounter an enemy put weapons on your ships (that are perfect for the specific encounter). On the next station, de-equip your ships and repeat.

It's stupid, but I thought I'd mention it. Small CR cost for equipping would probably be enough to discourage it.
That strategy is optimal for that specific fight. Equipping for a specific enemy can easily backfire; for example, a grav/tac beam outfitted Wolf is a tiny god when fighting broken down low-tech pirate ships, but immediately stops working when fighting anything with decent shield efficiency and flux stats, or even just enough armor that the piddly little beams aren't going to break through it before the Wolf completely runs out of CR. Generally speaking you want ships to be generally effective against most enemy types, unless it's a specialist ship you carry around to deal with specific threats your fleet has trouble with, e.g. a phase strike frigate for killing Dominators and Onslaughts. In which case you wouldn't want to refit that ship out of that specific role anyway, because then you lose the ability to deal with that specific threat.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2017, 07:43:17 AM by ANGRYABOUTELVES »
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Gothars

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #473 on: March 27, 2017, 08:07:41 AM »

It's still an advantage to be able to adapt to the first fight while having exact knowledge of enemy fleet composition. How extreme you then do your specialization if of course up to you.
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Deshara

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #474 on: March 27, 2017, 08:28:14 AM »

Quote
Ejecting cargo:
Creates "cargo pods" that will drift away and be lost within a few days


You know, that could be a super interesting way to deal with pirates (or corrupt patrols). If they are chasing you and you can't shake them, just drop a respectable amount of valuable cargo pods. They will decelerate to pick them up and give you time to escape. If the AI also drops these distractions when chased, voilà, here's a non-bloodthirsty pirate playstile.

Next step would be something like poisoned supplies that allows you to set a trap for enemies ;D

You can drop crew. Once boarding mechanics get developed, nothing would be preventing you from pitching a cargo pod full of valueable guns... with a marine coprs present to use it once they crack the container open.
Would also give cargo ships/shuttles an extra use too; if it were possible to get boarded from a sleeper cell in a cargo pod you collected, having a non-combat ship what collects cargo to get boarded instead of your Onslaught would be a handy safety precaution
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #475 on: March 27, 2017, 09:38:31 AM »

You know, that could be a super interesting way to deal with pirates (or corrupt patrols). If they are chasing you and you can't shake them, just drop a respectable amount of valuable cargo pods. They will decelerate to pick them up and give you time to escape. If the AI also drops these distractions when chased, voilà, here's a non-bloodthirsty pirate playstile.

Actually have a todo item somewhere for this sort of thing! Not obvious how to add AI-wsie, but probably going to have a look at it.

Optimal-but-tedious strategy: Set sail with unequipped ships and a choice of stored weapons and only when you encounter an enemy put weapons on your ships (that are perfect for the specific encounter). On the next station, de-equip your ships and repeat.

It's stupid, but I thought I'd mention it. Small CR cost for equipping would probably be enough to discourage it.

Hmm - that's true, yeah. Seems like it probably won't be something people do much, though - the payoff is really dubious, as over-speccing for a given encounter may make you less effective in the next one. Feels like any special rules to handle this are probably not worth it.



Once boarding mechanics get developed

Let me stop you right there :) To be perfectly clear: ship recovery replaces boarding entirely, and other boarding mechanics are not on the table whatsoever.
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Sy

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #476 on: March 27, 2017, 09:51:08 AM »

Feels like any special rules to handle this are probably not worth it.
how about something simple like: "adding new things never reduces CR below X%". since the main reason for this change seems to be allowing immediate outfitting of recovered ships without CR & supply penalty, even just preventing CR from dropping below 40% (aka into malfunction range) would be enough.

Quote
other boarding mechanics are not on the table whatsoever.
but you know that won't stop people from making a new boarding suggestion thread every couple months regardless. :D
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Cyan Leader

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #477 on: March 27, 2017, 10:02:51 AM »

IIRC enemy fleet levels go up as you do too, right? (or maybe only for bounties, I'm not sure)
If possible, are you going to look into changing other things as the player levels? Such as the average number of ships in pirate fleets or their tech level.

To add to the SB discussion, I'm also concerned that the limitation to player fleets only will make the game less believable. Like others I'll reserve final judgment until after I play .8, but if there are mechanical problems in adding dynamic code for that have you consider just giving the ability to basic fleets going from A to B? For example heavy trade fleets that launch every once in a while and only use it to go straight to a destination. We won't meet them often but seeing them on the campaign every once in a while will go a long way to make the universe more believable.
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Deshara

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #478 on: March 27, 2017, 10:25:18 AM »

Once boarding mechanics get developed

Let me stop you right there :) To be perfectly clear: ship recovery replaces boarding entirely, and other boarding mechanics are not on the table whatsoever.


okay so, are crew recoverable from the wreckage of disabled ships as a form of loot?
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #479 on: March 27, 2017, 10:29:20 AM »

how about something simple like: "adding new things never reduces CR below X%". since the main reason for this change seems to be allowing immediate outfitting of recovered ships without CR & supply penalty, even just preventing CR from dropping below 40% (aka into malfunction range) would be enough.

Hey, that's a good idea. Done.

but you know that won't stop people from making a new boarding suggestion thread every couple months regardless. :D

I can but try.


To add to the SB discussion, I'm also concerned that the limitation to player fleets only will make the game less believable. Like others I'll reserve final judgment until after I play .8, but if there are mechanical problems in adding dynamic code for that have you consider just giving the ability to basic fleets going from A to B? For example heavy trade fleets that launch every once in a while and only use it to go straight to a destination. We won't meet them often but seeing them on the campaign every once in a while will go a long way to make the universe more believable.

Again, its more of a "no time right now" issue rather than a design decision. What you're saying makes sense, but I also don't know if it's a good idea to give this ability to *any* AI fleets without some counter-abilities also being in place. It might be, or it might not; it would take some investigating and playtesting to find out either way. So, I don't want to "just" do something.
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